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Wonder what type [more Gattis hate]

kryptonite said:
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I think you have ENOS SYNDROME.

It's not curable.
 
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ThomasM said:
I hope you are right, but I have a hard time expecting that. I've seen a lot of stubborn coaches do the same thing over, and over, and over again, thinking it will work once the players get it right. In the end, they get fired and go somewhere else for rehab, usually under a coach that knows that side of the ball better than they do.

We need to see more, and in a hurry, or this whole thing is going to fall apart. I want Mario to succeed here, so he'd better get Gattis to adapt to the talent he has, not the talent he wishes he had, or might have someday.
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Oh, good lord. This is almost hoping for or expecting a self-fulfilling prophesy. So, let me ask a rhetorical question, if our wide receivers are supposedly having trouble getting separation, we are going to go with a spread, uptempo, vertical passing game outside the hashes?
 
SWFLHurricane said:
I have a sick feeling about Gattis. As I do with Addae. I feel like their in the same boat. I've heard that Gattis success at Michigan (Broyles) was due to Harbaugh basically being wayyy more hands on with the offense...and with Addae, that it was Kirby who really should get credit for the DB play at Georgia. Spoke to many credible people off CIS about both. I knew just who to call in ref. to Addae...and I trust them.
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More worried about Addae than Gattis. Praying for a win but respect your opinion as always
 
Pentagon Cane said:
Not defending Shannon, but he had overwhelming talent near the end of his tenure as DC? In 2006 Miami finished #13 in scoring defense, #7 in total defense, #4 in rush defense, #3 in yards per rush? In 2005, Miami was #4 in scoring defense, #4 in total defense, #1 in pass defense, #23 in rush defense. Butch's games were long gone.

He gets maligned for being a bad head coach and a quirky guy. All the legitimate weaknesses and points. I wouldn't say he was a great DC. He certainly was not creative. He was a good one. He did a decent job as co-DC at UF. Okay at UCF. Verdict is out at FSU, but they look improved defensively.
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I was taking about when he won the Broyles Award.
 
Cribby said:
We ran a flea flicker for a reason. It was because they were blowing up the run , getting pressure on Tvd and even when Tvd had time guys weren’t getting open. You rcan meh that all you want but separation has been an issue all through camp and even in the season. Our one big play over the top was a flea flicker. That’s playing Bcu and S Miss. That’s why I’ve said we need more space and less congestion with formations. Lashlee had guys outside the hashes which put pressure on the defense vertically and horizontally. Which opens up the middle of the field and makes the Rpo more effective.
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While not to the degree of Lashlee, the thing I can’t fully understand is why Gattis ran a lot of RPO at Umich and very little so far here. In your opinion, Is it just a matter of time?
 
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ddann said:
I was taking about when he won the Broyles Award.
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Got this from Wikipedia:

"Shannon remained the Hurricanes defensive coordinator for six seasons, and his defenses consistently finished among the best in the nation:
2001 – 6th
2002 – 7th
2003 – 2nd
2004 – 28th
2005 – 4th
2006 – 7th"

Shannon did an excellent job for us as DC. He wasn't the right guy to be HC, but I don't knock his leadership on as DC. Our defense was excellent every year he served as our DC.

No need to knock former Hurricane leaders which he was as a player and coach. Every Broyles award winner comes from a team with tremendous talent: http://www.espn.com/college-football/awards/_/id/29.
 
Pentagon Cane said:
Not defending Shannon, but he had overwhelming talent near the end of his tenure as DC? In 2006 Miami finished #13 in scoring defense, #7 in total defense, #4 in rush defense, #3 in yards per rush? In 2005, Miami was #4 in scoring defense, #4 in total defense, #1 in pass defense, #23 in rush defense. Butch's games were long gone.

He gets maligned for being a bad head coach and a quirky guy. All the legitimate weaknesses and points. I wouldn't say he was a great DC. He certainly was not creative. He was a good one. He did a decent job as co-DC at UF. Okay at UCF. Verdict is out at FSU, but they look improved defensively.
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I was referring more specifically to when he won the Broyle’s Award. But yes, that 2005 defense still had a lot more talent than most of the teams they faced.
 
JD4 said:
Got this from Wikipedia:

"Shannon remained the Hurricanes defensive coordinator for six seasons, and his defenses consistently finished among the best in the nation:
2001 – 6th
2002 – 7th
2003 – 2nd
2004 – 28th
2005 – 4th
2006 – 7th"

Shannon did an excellent job for us as DC. He wasn't the right guy to be HC, but I don't knock his leadership on as DC. Our defense was excellent every year he served as our DC.

No need to knock former Hurricane leaders which he was as a player and coach. Every Broyles award winner comes from a team with tremendous talent: http://www.espn.com/college-football/awards/_/id/29.
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Again, my comments were directed more toward the “Gattis won the Broyles Award” and “Shannon won the Broyles Award” train of thought.
 
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Cribby said:
We ran a flea flicker for a reason. It was because they were blowing up the run , getting pressure on Tvd and even when Tvd had time guys weren’t getting open. You rcan meh that all you want but separation has been an issue all through camp and even in the season. Our one big play over the top was a flea flicker. That’s playing Bcu and S Miss. That’s why I’ve said we need more space and less congestion with formations. Lashlee had guys outside the hashes which put pressure on the defense vertically and horizontally. Which opens up the middle of the field and makes the Rpo more effective.
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No, we ran the flea flicker because it was set up nicely. We just finished off a 13-play scoring drive where we ran the ball 10 times. They go 3 and out and we get a nice return by Stevenson. Perfect time to run it.

So if our wideouts cannot get separation or beat one on one coverage how much pressure are we going to put on A&M vertically?
 
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Pentagon Cane said:
No, we ran the flea flicker because it was set up nicely. We just finished off a 13-play scoring drive where we ran the ball 10 times. They go 3 and out and we get a nice return by Stevenson. Perfect time to run it.

So if our wideouts cannot get separation or beat one on one coverage how much pressure are we going to put on A&M vertically?
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Set up nicely ? Lol, yeah that running the ball to nauseam for two weeks straight out of 12 personnel ? There wasn’t anything different from the week prior to last week. Anyone at the game or that’s watched an all 22 angle will tell you wr’s weren’t getting separation. We didn’t hit one deep ball in two weeks against horrible competition minus that “ trick play”. Weird right?

They were playing down hill the entire first half and we didn’t make them pay once, repeatedly hitting TVD or sacking him . Thank god we realized the flea flicker needed to be set up lol.

Fact is Gattis isn’t helping these cats with the formations and routes concepts. The reason receivers put up big numbers in these air raid type offenses is they are put in space , they’re **** near outside the hashes ,which gives them an advantage vertically and horizontally. Our guys have been bunched or in tight formations which makes separation harder. That’s why I keep saying we have to be saving stuff for a real opponent.
 
ddann said:
No he wasn’t. He had an overwhelming talent advantage and ran 4-3, Cover 2 all
day every day. If he was a great DC, then he would’ve have shown it in his other stops after UM. He hasn’t.
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All the coaches that win the Broyle's award have talent advantages. If simplifying schemes works for your players then it works. You don't get more points for having more complex playbooks. Kind of whack to belittle his achievements so much and act like he didn't help at all.

The guy bled for Miami as a player, coached linebackers in the NFL after playing in the NFL, and was able to relate to and coach up a team that will be remembered as the greatest of all time and have similar defensive performance with less talented teams for the better part of a decade too.
 
Cribby said:
Set up nicely ? Lol, yeah that running the ball to nauseam for two weeks straight out of 12 personnel ? There wasn’t anything different from the week prior to last week. Anyone at the game or that’s watched an all 22 angle will tell you wr’s weren’t getting separation. We didn’t hit one deep ball in two weeks against horrible competition minus that “ trick play”. Weird right?

They were playing down hill the entire first half and we didn’t make them pay once, repeatedly hitting TVD or sacking him . Thank god we realized the flea flicker needed to be set up lol.

Fact is Gattis isn’t helping these cats with the formations and routes concepts. The reason receivers put up big numbers in these air raid type offenses is they are put in space , they’re **** near outside the hashes ,which gives them an advantage vertically and horizontally. Our guys have been bunched or in tight formations which makes separation harder. That’s why I keep saying we have to be saving stuff for a real opponent.
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So we could not run the first series of the second half? The real reason we ran flea flicker because that was the only way we could get vertical? I get being critical which is warranted with the small sample size but give credit where it is due. They completely bit on Keyshawn's double move.

There were some deep routes open. The Brashard Smith catch is one of them where Keyshawn was wide open down the right hash and TVD forced the ball to the middle of the field on the free play.

There are certainly route combos we can run out of bunch formations.

I do think we will see a lot more play action Saturday.

I also think we will see more spread formations on Saturday.

But again if we cannot get separation outside the hashes one on one we will need to run a lot more combos.
 
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JgDaCane said:
I mean I see offenses with less then X & Parrish doing more. So I expect more.
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Good point. I just think there's a cap on what those guys can do.

I like Parrish, and I'm really happy we have him - but at the end of the day he's a 190 lb RB who runs a 4.6. Put him in the greatest scheme and there's only so much he can give you. He definitely gets the most out of what he has to work with.
 
Cribby said:
Fact is Gattis isn’t helping these cats with the formations and routes concepts. The reason receivers put up big numbers in these air raid type offenses is they are put in space , they’re **** near outside the hashes ,which gives them an advantage vertically and horizontally. Our guys have been bunched or in tight formations which makes separation harder. That’s why I keep saying we have to be saving stuff for a real opponent.
Click to expand...

I feel like this is part of why TVD is taking longer to make reads and release the ball. We have fewer options that are open and he’s waiting to see if the 1st or 2nd reads will break out past the d where they’re supposed to
 
SWFLHurricane said:
I have a sick feeling about Gattis. As I do with Addae. I feel like their in the same boat. I've heard that Gattis success at Michigan (Broyles) was due to Harbaugh basically being wayyy more hands on with the offense...and with Addae, that it was Kirby who really should get credit for the DB play at Georgia. Spoke to many credible people off CIS about both. I knew just who to call in ref. to Addae...and I trust them.
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well then that's the first strike on mario, 2 bad hires if it turns out to be true.
 
JD4 said:
I feel like this is part of why TVD is taking longer to make reads and release the ball. We have fewer options that are open and he’s waiting to see if the 1st or 2nd reads will break out past the d where they’re supposed to
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Lashlee‘s offense was a lot easier for everyone. Tvd is now having to process more and go through more progressions. It was obvious he was unsure at times and wasn’t trusting his eyes. I said weeks ago this was a dramatic change from last year for the offense.

We have to use more Rpo and space and I believe we will. Theres no way the last two weeks is close to what this offense is. At least it better not be lol.
 
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