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The myth of Mario the recruiter

STG said:
Schools that recruited at high level are only going to get better. NIL isn't going to take a mid level program to new heights. They aren't going to raise money, or get huge committments from boosters for schools that have never won or will never win anything.

But how about we start with us. We have improved recruiting. Off the top of my head I know Auburn has, so has Tennessee, and looks like Michigan may go nuclear now with Ellison going in big.
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Don’t use the word parity then if you don’t know what that means. Those are schools who always recruit well
 
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AtrainCane said:
this is what most people dont understand. It takes talent, but it takes older talent. Not players that just finished their soph and freshman years. Stacking classes is a slow process, even with the transfer portal. Thats how the monster rosters in the sport are built. When Frederique is a junior, watch how different the team looks on the field. Pruitt made the biggest defensive play of the game, another puppy that will bite much harder 2 years from now.
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I Agree...Its all gloom and doom right now but I predict our defense will look much better when his full classes from HS 2023 - 2024 takes over. (ASSUMING Guidry is gone)
 
252cane said:
You put up the money needed to get these top 3 classes or take your metrics and just stfu
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Gets owned by facts and results to telling people to STFU. How about you take Mario's balls out of your mouth? It may help your process facts a little better.
 
DMoney said:
I’m not here to argue whether he is the guy for Miami or not.

But he won 12 games and a conference title at Oregon, 10 games here, and he led FIU to its best season ever.

Considering what most people on here feel about his coaching, he must be doing something right in talent acquisition.
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How good were USC and Washingto during his little run while at Oregon? Who was he competing against to win the vaunted Pac 12?
 
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Again, I’m not going to argue if he’s the guy or not. I’m frustrated, too, and he has a lot to prove.

But people are getting emotional and trying to have it both ways. If he can’t recruit OR coach, he is winning a lot of games at very different spots by accident.
 
DMoney said:
Again, I’m not going to argue if he’s the guy or not. I’m frustrated, too, and he has a lot to prove.

But people are getting emotional and trying to have it both ways. If he can’t recruit OR coach, he is winning a lot of games at very different spots by accident.
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i think hes a good recruiter
but after watching him up close for the past 3 years
he is a horrible CEO and head coach with little in x and os
basically he needs to recruit way better than he is bc I didnt realise his coaching was so bad
that he has to way over recruit his bad coaching
the question is can he recruit to that level
which he has not done so far
 
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DMoney said:
He defeated two Top 5 Big 10 teams during that run, both away from home.
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Why didn't you answer the question? How good were USC and Washington during his 4 years as Oregons HC?

He also lost to a a 3-9 Stanford team as double digit favorite, a 4-8 Arizona team as a double digit favorite, a 6-5 Arizona State team as a double digit favorite, a 5-7 Oregon State team as a double digit favorite, a 6-6 Cal team as a double digit favorite and got throttle twice by Utah with big stakes on the line.
 
So many things go into recruiting,evaluating etc-

Bottom line he still hasn’t developed an elite DL especially at DT-

Bain was not the same player, Baron was stiff couldn’t hold the edge he was basically invisible after the first 3 games-
Moten was serviceable, Barrow did some good things-

The last 9 games they basically **** the bed-coaching, talent whatever the final results sucked.
 
Gables Canes said:
Mario has landed numerous 4 and 5 star guys in the 2023 and 2024 classes. Many have failed to contribute. Our overall hit rate has been much lower than what you need to succeed.

Whether this is missed eval's, poor scheme, poor development, a combination...I'm not really sure. But the below is alarming:

C/O 2023 4 and 5 stars

Hits
Francis
Bain
Fletcher

TBD (these guys have flashed in limited PT)
Riley Williams
Malik Bryant
Popo
Damari Brown

No impact (too soon to say bust?)
Samson
Robby Washington
Ray Ray
Robert Stafford
Jayden Wayne (transferred)
Collins Achaempong (transferred)

C/O 2024 4 and 5 stars

Immediate hits
Lyle
Pruitt (criminal he got just 4 snaps vs. Cuse)
Lofton

TBD
Scott
Lightfoot
Blount
Patterson
Trader
Carr
Robinson
Pickett
Jones
Hayes
Rudolph

It's absolutely critical Miami develops this class of 2024. To me, it's just as important as landing a star portal class. What's the point in "stacking talent" if said talent doesn't do anything but disappoint?
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It’s been absolutely atrocious

Cam Ward , along with a senior laden (Mannys recruits) skill positions covered up so many warts

Arroyo, X, George, Rivers, Borragales

This team is 7-5 without Ward this year
 
STG said:
Why didn't you answer the question? How good were USC and Washington during his 4 years as Oregons HC?

He also lost to a a 3-9 Stanford team as double digit favorite, a 4-8 Arizona team as a double digit favorite, a 6-5 Arizona State team as a double digit favorite, a 5-7 Oregon State team as a double digit favorite, a 6-6 Cal team as a double digit favorite and got throttle twice by Utah with big stakes on the line.
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Your question implied that he only beat bad teams. I corrected that false narrative. In fact, he beat three top 10 teams, the #11 team, and the #13 team. Oregon has had four coaches over the past 10 years. They've won three conference titles. Mario has two of them.

I'm not here to argue about whether he is the right guy. He has many flaws, including the consistent losses to unranked teams. But he's had big seasons at three different schools. If he's a terrible coach, he must be doing something right in recruiting. You can't have it both ways.
 
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BigDikDaddyFromCincinnati said:
This. Comments like this reveal so much more about the commenter than the comment itself. Let me explain why @rascon

Dawson is the OC and QB coach. Guidry is the DC and secondary coach. While the results and accountability ultimately fall on their shoulders for all position groups, Dawson isn’t the one teaching technique to the OL. Guidry isn’t teaching footwork and hand placement with the DL. Therefore, when you say “Not sure Dawson or Guidry are teachers at all,” you’re actually making somewhat of a correct statement, although you intended it as a slam.

The player development commentary is just dumb.
TE play was good/great this year. The only reason I say it’s not excellent is because that group was a little slow to start.
WR play was excellent. Horton is probably the poster child for PlaYeR DuhVeLopMenT this year. X is X. JG played better this year.
OL play was very solid all year. Spare me the running lanes comment - most of the runs are RPOs which are slower developing, zone blocked schemes. Do I wish we ran more sweeps and counters? Sure but we don’t. There are only so many snaps. Pass pro got better throughout the year. There was a play against Wake where Cam was flat footed and moon walking because he had so much time. Yeah it was Wake, but it was still impressive. Cici is a first rounder. Carpenter and Rivers played solidly all year and Markel Bell certainly improved throughout the year.
DL has me wondering, but how much could we expect from Blount, Scott, and Artaviois as true freshmen? J Horton has been hurt all year. However Anthony Campbell improved. The DEs were a disappointment, mainly because Bain was hurt half the year along and Baron can’t set an edge.
Lbs - Popo and Pruitt look to be future stars. Wes improved a little, but he is what he is at this point.
Secondary - blow it all up except for OJ.

So we have one position group that sucked all year and another that was disappointing. Those groups out weigh the gains from I Horton, Fletcher, Lyle, Arroyo, Markel Bell, Popo, Pruitt and OJ? You and others, while throwing out ridiculous takes using the buzz words of the day like eVaLs and pLaYerDUHvELopMeNt, completely omit anything to the contrary. Then you mention the coordinators not teaching as if it’s their fault for the lack of development (that’s not really lacking) because you don’t know that most of the players practice time is spent with their position coaches rather than the coordinator with the exception of QB and secondary.

Now before you get feisty and reply, please know that I heard this same crrapp 20 years ago walking out of the OB after a loss against some team we should’ve beaten. The guy who said was a dip$chit, so “player development” makes me feel like Alex toward the end of A Clockwork Orange with eyelids propped open with toothpicks as I’m getting electrotherapy treatment. “Evals” is now added to the list.
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Appreciate the reply and I think there are some good conversation pieces here.

When I say teaching, it’s not just technique, its the assignment and the why behind it. It is the coordinators system, and they should be able to talk to each position group about the “why” behind their assignments. Coordinators should be able to look at their system and tell you exactly who isn’t doing their job.

Player development - I think it’s a little generous to say impact freshman players are the result of good development. I think those should be called great evals. Just my .02. That’s OJ, Pruitt and Popo on defense.

Completely agree on Horton being the poster guy for development, but who else had remotely the same jump in development as he did - on either side of the ball? Defense is hard to find that - Kiko didn’t. Bain was hurt, and I give him a pass, but I wonder if DE is still in his future. Wes was more consistent I guess. No DB showed improvement. And I agree with you the DT you can’t judge until year 2.

Offensive player development - I’m not sure we saw significant improvement on the oline. They were solid previously. Cici was always a first rounder. With him I give credit for not having a sophomore slump like Bain experienced. But I still don’t see the improvement in Bell. Our entire WR corp was listed on the preseason Biletenkoff (sp) award list.

At the end of the day, when I talk about player development, I look for more guys like Horton. A guy 2-3 years in who has been working his way up and boom, he shows out.
 
DMoney said:
Your question implied that he only beat bad teams. I corrected that false narrative. In fact, he beat three top 10 teams, the #11 team, and the #13 team. Oregon has had four coaches over the past 10 years. They've won three conference titles. Mario has two of them.

I'm not here to argue about whether he is the right guy. He has many flaws, including the consistent losses to unranked teams. But he's had big seasons at three different schools. If he's a terrible coach, he must be doing something right in recruiting. You can't have it both ways.
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@DMoney are you going to post an update on recruiting leading up to signing day with all these decommit and flip rumors floating around?
 
DMoney said:
Your question implied that he only beat bad teams. I corrected that false narrative. In fact, he beat three top 10 teams, the #11 team, and the #13 team. Oregon has had four coaches over the past 10 years. They've won three conference titles. Mario has two of them.

I'm not here to argue about whether he is the right guy. He has many flaws, including the consistent losses to unranked teams. But he's had big seasons at three different schools. If he's a terrible coach, he must be doing something right in recruiting. You can't have it both ways.
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His feel for game flow sucks and that is how these subpar teams beat him. We lost twice as a double digit fave this year for that reason. This lack of feel lets these teams hang around and believe they an play with his teams and once you're in a tight 4th quarter game, anything can happen.

Cuse especially, being up 21-0, how the **** does he not mandate a 2 high shell the rest of the way and if they score, it takes 7 minutes. Then on O we pound Martinez and Fletch. That shortens the game and we win a 34-21 type deal. Instead, we literally playing man all game and they score in 3 minutes, 40 seconds,3 minutes and we don't know WTF hit us. Horrid
 
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STG said:
NIL
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STG said:
Schools that recruited at high level are only going to get better. NIL isn't going to take a mid level program to new heights. They aren't going to raise money, or get huge committments from boosters for schools that have never won or will never win anything.

But how about we start with us. We have improved recruiting. Off the top of my head I know Auburn has, so has Tennessee, and looks like Michigan may go nuclear now with Ellison going in big.
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TrumpyCane wants to know if Abella danger can get herself some billionaire in Miami and tell them to donate to the school
 
rascon said:
Appreciate the reply and I think there are some good conversation pieces here.

When I say teaching, it’s not just technique, its the assignment and the why behind it. It is the coordinators system, and they should be able to talk to each position group about the “why” behind their assignments. Coordinators should be able to look at their system and tell you exactly who isn’t doing their job.

Player development - I think it’s a little generous to say impact freshman players are the result of good development. I think those should be called great evals. Just my .02. That’s OJ, Pruitt and Popo on defense.

Completely agree on Horton being the poster guy for development, but who else had remotely the same jump in development as he did - on either side of the ball? Defense is hard to find that - Kiko didn’t. Bain was hurt, and I give him a pass, but I wonder if DE is still in his future. Wes was more consistent I guess. No DB showed improvement. And I agree with you the DT you can’t judge until year 2.

Offensive player development - I’m not sure we saw significant improvement on the oline. They were solid previously. Cici was always a first rounder. With him I give credit for not having a sophomore slump like Bain experienced. But I still don’t see the improvement in Bell. Our entire WR corp was listed on the preseason Biletenkoff (sp) award list.

At the end of the day, when I talk about player development, I look for more guys like Horton. A guy 2-3 years in who has been working his way up and boom, he shows out.
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I can't. I just can't with this. You're all over the place in the the third paragraph - OJ and Pruitt are true freshmen; Popo is a 2nd year guy. So are they great evals or great development?

People cling on to certain buzzwords. In CiSLand, it's evals and player development. It's word soup. It's talk radio crap. It's let's argue about things that can't be proven or disproven. I don't feel like picking apart what you said because I have end-of-season-fatigue and quite honestly, you don't deserve the wrath I feel. All the doomsday trolls are doing their unhappy dances throughout the posts as they claim "TOLD YA SO" and they hyperbolicly point to things and say eval or development even though they attended zero practices, zero film sessions, zero walk throughs, zero coaches meetings, and zero weight sessions. So they claim poor eval and lack of player development as they sip a ****tail they didn't pay for with their pinky finger sticking out to come off as smart as they think they are, all the while thinking that the next coach is the answer and savior. The next coach never comes.
 
DMoney said:
Your question implied that he only beat bad teams. I corrected that false narrative. In fact, he beat three top 10 teams, the #11 team, and the #13 team. Oregon has had four coaches over the past 10 years. They've won three conference titles. Mario has two of them.

I'm not here to argue about whether he is the right guy. He has many flaws, including the consistent losses to unranked teams. But he's had big seasons at three different schools. If he's a terrible coach, he must be doing something right in recruiting. You can't have it both ways.
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No, my question did not. Why are you pulling that out of thin air? My question was pretty straight forward. USC and Washington are the typical powerhouses in the Pac 12. And I asked how did those programs peform during his 4 year run as Oregon HC. You CLEARLY ignored it because they pretty much sucked during his time there. Which made his run easier not having to deal with them at there best.

You also have a very clear narrative to never point out the obvious, no matter what, because you don't want it to hurt your access/wallet. I can't take anyone serious if all they can do is wear orange and green goggles. You need to be able to call a spade a spade if you want to have a serious discussion.
 
STG said:
No, my question did not. Why are you pulling that out of thin air? My question was pretty straight forward. USC and Washington are the typical powerhouses in the Pac 12. And I asked how did those programs peform during his 4 year run as Oregon HC. You CLEARLY ignored it because they pretty much sucked during his time there. Which made his run easier not having to deal with them at there best.

You also have a very clear narrative to never point out the obvious, no matter what, because you don't want it to hurt your access/wallet. I can't take anyone serious if all they can do is wear orange and green goggles. You need to be able to call a spade a spade if you want to have a serious discussion.
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His answer to you, twice, has been more than fair. But for some reason you won't address it:

DMoney: "I'm not here to argue about whether he is the right guy. He has many flaws, including the consistent losses to unranked teams. But he's had big seasons at three different schools. If he's a terrible coach, he must be doing something right in recruiting. You can't have it both ways."
 
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