Places to knock down for stadium

[hoops156]

Yeah; I used to come to Miami a lot, but it’s been since 2010, August 2010 to be exact. I know the laws & bylaws, and greasing of palms is quite different. Lol. The infrastructure of the layout is different.

Let me be clear ladies & gents, all I’m saying “IF” the opportunity arises, it could be in Miami Gardens for all I care, but if an opportunity arises where Miami has its own stadium, it could be on the open waters for all I care (actually I do care, lol), why not? But, I’ve also said, moving to play at field designed for futbol, would make no sense either. It would be best to stay at HRS w/ that being the case.

I agree w you here. tropical park is the only viable site and I don't think the county will ever give the land to miami and honestly, no matter what rad says, I don't think the school really wants to deal with their own stadium and maintaining it lol. the soccer stadium idea was stupid and like I said, it was an idiot commissioner throwing it out there w no real merit and then UM gets asked about it and of course the owner of UM, Ruiz, gets tweeted about it. HRS is fine for now as long as ross is the owner of the fins (bc hes putting in the money to make upgrades regardless of who's paying for it but thats not guaranteed with another owner).

 

[hoops156]

Talk to me. I believe our avg. attendance since moving to Sun Life - HRS has been around 47k, although 2016-18 were the best yrs. I also think that’s y some fans have said having a stadium w/ 60k+ would make no sense, vs. a 55k seat stadium. But what was the point, my brotha?

anytime we play FSU at home, our ticket sales are usually higher. were supposedly gonna hit 50k sth this year by the start of the year. add in away fans , students, and single game tickets, you're closer to 60k if everyone showed up on average (IF YOURE GOOD AND RIGHT NOW WELL GET THE MARIO BUMP)I think you need 60-65 imo (HRS Is 65 now).

 

[Rellyrell]

Hahaha Well you should tell THE WHOLE STORY!!

And this is when we were just a very good team but not a NC team
Miami averaged 56,263 fans in 2017. That number was down from 57,396 in 2016. The Hurricanes almost always have better attendance numbers in the even numbered years when they host Florida State. The declining attendance number aligned with college football overall and the ACC more specifically.

Yeah; I actually just said that in response to Notsince1985. I didn’t put the #’s, but I said our best yrs at Sunlife - HRS attendance was 2016 - 2018. I was being specific of his 2001 season claim. Just like I didn’t highlight in 2002, when the OB avg. 69,539. Lol.

 

[Atom Atlas]

so they blamed the flame out of first iteration of MLS on lack of real national interest, being in FTL, and poor ownership and management.

inter with beck has better PR so it had initial interest. the team sucks and the management is trash. the ownership already got fined for breaking rules which doesn't help. I personally don't think it'll work here bc like I said, we aren't a sports market but an event market. the heat have the most loyal section of fans that was built up bc they won titles when the working fans were kids and built it up then. the fins will always have their support bc of the history and its football lol, but even then, SFL turned apathetic with them. baseball doenst work. here either.

Gotcha and yes I agree...

 

[Rellyrell]

Allow me to put a bow on my argument for a stadium so that I don’t offend or confuse anyone.

Of course I’m a pro-stadium for The Canes, b/c I know the “potential” revenue stream it can bring. As I posted, Ross made $250m, alone, from naming rights. That’s apart of the equation a lot of fans don’t understand. That was the game changer for SC, & despite its struggles w/ operating the Rose Bowl, what helped UCLA.

I try to be fair, equitable, & not dogmatic w/ my views. In my world of business, I can’t; u’ll become a dinosaur real quick.

Having our own stadium is good, IF it makes sense. I’m sure Rad knows that benefit as well, hence provoking him to make such a statement; but, it also has to make sense. If it doesn’t make sense, then hey, at least we have a space for another 9 yrs. The other thing that concerns me is Ross’ age. Maybe he’ll be like a Virginia McCaskey who’s still alive at **** near 100, but I also see how **** poor my Bears r operated as she’s owner by name w/ incompetent folks running the org in her stead. I dunno, but having ur own is more secure than leasing, b/c chit can change. BUT, IT HAS TO MAKE SENSE from a structural & financial standpoint.

That’s all.

 

[hoops156]

Allow me to put a bow on my argument for a stadium so that I don’t offend or confuse anyone.

Of course I’m a pro-stadium for The Canes, b/c I know the “potential” revenue stream it can bring. As I posted, Ross made $250m, alone, from naming rights. That’s apart of the equation a lot of fans don’t understand. That was the game changer for SC, & despite its struggles w/ operating the Rose Bowl, what helped UCLA.

I try to be fair, equitable, & not dogmatic w/ my views. In my world of business, I can’t; u’ll become a dinosaur real quick.

Having our own stadium is good, IF it makes sense. I’m sure Rad knows that benefit as well, hence provoking him to make such a statement; but, it also has to make sense. If it doesn’t make sense, then hey, at least we have a space for another 9 yrs. The other thing that concerns me is Ross’ age. Maybe he’ll be like a Virginia McCaskey who’s still alive at **** near 100, but I also see how **** poor my Bears r operated as she’s owner by name w/ incompetent folks running the org in her stead. I dunno, but having ur own is more secure than leasing, b/c chit can change. BUT, IT HAS TO MAKE SENSE from a structural & financial standpoint.

That’s all.

naming rights Is interesting. I know uM has had sponsors on the original convocation center obviously. marlins had trouble finding sponsors for their stadium till loan depot came this past year. wonder what UM would get potentially bc lets face it, its not the fins or the heat in terms of a draw. there are a lot of UF and FSU grads in the area.

 

[Rellyrell]

naming rights Is interesting. I know uM has had sponsors on the original convocation center obviously. marlins had trouble finding sponsors for their stadium till loan depot came this past year. wonder what UM would get potentially.

I’m sure w/ Miami’s brand, it would be huge. I didn’t even realize FTX paid $135m in crypto currency to The Heat for their naming rights. They paid Berkeley $17.5m for the naming rights of their football stadium.

 

[supersaiyanshel]

We gonna regret leaving Hard Rock.

 

[OriginalCanesCanesCanes]

We gonna regret leaving Hard Rock.

I doubt we leave. The school doesn’t have that much of an appetite to leave the current situation at hard rock.

Always exploring the possibility is a good idea because it gives you leverage, but in reality, 99% of the people that are decision makers would be more than happy with the status quo.

Fans that actually go to the game, the vast majority of them, are happy with where we are.

Other than the more complicated parking situation that’s involved, they prefer things to stay the same.

 

[Notsince1985]

My point was we talk too much about attendance.

Also, our avg. attendance at HRS has been inflated. There were some games against Duke that were listed at 60,000 when they were maybe 30,000

 

[supersaiyanshel]

I doubt we leave. The school doesn’t have that much of an appetite to leave the current situation at hard rock.

Always exploring the possibility is a good idea because it gives you leverage, but in reality, 99% of the people that are decision makers would be more than happy with the status quo.

Fans that actually go to the game, the vast majority of them, are happy with where we are.

Other than the more complicated parking situation that’s involved, they prefer things to stay the same.

Exactly all of this.

There truly is no real, legitimate reason to leave.

If we continuously win and put on a good product, the people will come. Not to mention Hard Rock is a fantastic stadium in really the perfect location down here.

My appreciation grew even more when I set foot inside of Loan Depot or whatever tf it's called now for the Kanye show.

What an absolute ****hole.

I'll be at Hard Rock this weekend for the Formula 1 race btw. The track looks amazing.

 

[OriginalCanesCanesCanes]

Exactly all of this.

There truly is no real, legitimate reason to leave.

If we continuously win and put on a good product, the people will come. Not to mention Hard Rock is a fantastic stadium in really the perfect location down here.

My appreciation grew even ore when I set foot inside of Loan Depot or whatever tf it's called now for the Kanye show.

What an absolute ****hole.

I'll be at Hard Rock this weekend for the Formula 1 race btw. The track looks amazing.

Take some pictures and post them if you can. Have fun.

 

[TheOriginalCane]

They may be closer, but the football field is still significantly further away. Soccer fields are over 60 feet wider than American football fields. Add to that fact that you have to account for sideline accommodations like benches and so forth, and there’s no way that you can get the seats closer for American football. I’m not sure if I’m making sense here but that’s how I visualize it.

Not sure if you have been in any of the more recent soccer-only stadiums.

I'm posting a picture below of the Orlando City stadium.

Technically, there is no "away" side. Both teams sit on the same side. If you look in the upper left corner and the top middle, you will see that the places where all the players sit are recessed into the normal seating sections. Thus, on both sides of the field, there is actually very little distance between the stands and the lines of the sidelines.

Translated, what that means is this. Even though the soccer FIELD is wider, once you reorient it so that you would have football benches and player/coach areas on BOTH sides, you would essentially have the same orientation. So you'd have the same OVERALL width, but the playing field would be narrower and the sideline areas would be wider. There really wouldn't be much difference, no matter how big Joe Robbie initially made his "multi-use" stadium in the 1980s.

If the Mas brothers build something like this at Freedom Park, with additional seating (you can see that the lower bowl is not very big on the opposite side before you hit the suites), then you wouldn't really have to worry about the size of the field and the closeness of the first row.

The key would be the angle or incline of the overall facility, as to how close ALL of the seats would be. If you go higher/faster, everyone sits closer, but I think there are some height limitations for Freedom Park, being in the MIA flight paths. If you go wider/slower, then everyone sits farther away (on average), but you could put more people in the stadium without having to go as high.

 

[OriginalCanesCanesCanes]

Not sure if you have been in any of the more recent soccer-only stadiums.

I'm posting a picture below of the Orlando City stadium.

Technically, there is no "away" side. Both teams sit on the same side. If you look in the upper left corner and the top middle, you will see that the places where all the players sit are recessed into the normal seating sections. Thus, on both sides of the field, there is actually very little distance between the stands and the lines of the sidelines.

Translated, what that means is this. Even though the soccer FIELD is wider, once you reorient it so that you would have football benches and player/coach areas on BOTH sides, you would essentially have the same orientation. So you'd have the same OVERALL width, but the playing field would be narrower and the sideline areas would be wider. There really wouldn't be much difference, no matter how big Joe Robbie initially made his "multi-use" stadium in the 1980s.

If the Mas brothers build something like this at Freedom Park, with additional seating (you can see that the lower bowl is not very big on the opposite side before you hit the suites), then you wouldn't really have to worry about the size of the field and the closeness of the first row.

The key would be the angle or incline of the overall facility, as to how close ALL of the seats would be. If you go higher/faster, everyone sits closer, but I think there are some height limitations for Freedom Park, being in the MIA flight paths. If you go wider/slower, then everyone sits farther away (on average), but you could put more people in the stadium without having to go as high.




View attachment 184933

I can’t tell anything, from that picture anyway, I need to see a wider shot

 

[TheOriginalCane]

the entire thing is silly for Inter esp since the ftl stadium was completely fine esp for what they draw and their limited success.

mas greased the politicians and wants this for the real estate. he has plans to add a ton of entertainment to the land with a stadium side piece really. airport is right next door so perfect haven for tourists who don't want to stay too far out. he doesn't actually care if anyone sits in the stadium imo. thats more beckham

Samson gave good insight into how the process is done w the city. the only time they ever call it to vote is when the team owners know they have enough. he said the marlins kept pushing off the vote for the stadium until Samson knew he had the votes. once he had that, he called the vote right away.

I'm not sure why this nonsense gets repeated over and over again.

"Wants this for the real estate"? How so? The land would be owned by Miami and leased. Yes, the commercial properties would be intended to be profitable.

"He doesn't actually care if anyone sits in the stadium"? What? That's just Billy Corben bullcrap. Well-run soccer teams are profitable. The cost of MLS franchises is increasing. The cities fighting for new MLS franchises are numerous. Where does this myth get invented, that the Mas brothers are buying into a franchise, CHEATING to spend extra money to buy good players, rebuilding a TEMPORARY stadium in Fort Lauderdale...and all just to build a small hotel and a small mall across from MIA. If that was the "evil plan", they certainly executed it horribly, including the purchase of what, a decoy location, in Overtown?

Look, the reality is, building a stadium-ONLY, with acres of parking around it, only to be used a few times a year, IS NOT GOOD FOR ANYONE. Not the owner, not the team, not the local community, not the city. The SUCCESSFUL newer stadium projects are trying to incorporate YEAR-ROUND economic impact in addition to what a stadium provides.

NFL teams have 8 or 9 regular season home games per year (not counting pre-season). MLS teams play 17 regular season home games. NBA/NHL arenas have 41 regular season home games, and there are currently no arenas in Florida that host both NBA and NHL. MLB stadiums host 81 regular season home games.

Outside of baseball, all other sports venues are part-timers. They need other economic activity in the area to most effectively utilize the parking and infrastructure improvements (roads, mass transit, etc.). When Orlando built the new NBA arena, the Magic were given the chance to develop the land across the street, and after numerous delays, the construction is starting. This is the new reality, this is the new way that things get done. You don't just build a stadium or arena, you build other stuff around it so that the place is not some ghost town on all the days the team is not playing.

Oh, and Hard Rock figured it out after a few decades. That's why it's now a combo football/tennis/auto racing facility. Outside of UM's 6 or 7 home games, those Hard Rock parking lots were just sitting there empty for the other 357 days out of the year (since the Dolphins rarely make the playoffs).

But, yeah, we're just supposed to expect the Mas brothers to build a soccer stadium with no other economic development...why? Because they are rich? Why wouldn't we want team owners to feel vested and invested with the facility they build, by giving them the chance to develop other economic activities in the same location? Why does Billy Corben hate the Mas brothers so much that he is FINE WITH PAVING OVER MELREESE, as long as we just let OTHER Miami developers do it and profit from it? Just, you know, NOT the Mas brothers. THEY cannot profit off of it. But every other corrupt developer who has corrupted Miami politicians for decades, sure, THEY can pave it and profit from it.

It's just ridiculous.

 

[TheOriginalCane]

I can’t tell anything, from that picture anyway, I need to see a wider shot

Seriously? The width between the sideline and the stands is about 6 or 8 feet. It's about the same distance on the other side, I realize you can't see that. The only space they have on the "players/coaches" side is a box that the coach is allowed to stand in. All of the other players are supposed to sit in the stands, unless they are coming in for a substitution. The sidelines are for referees and ball-boys, plus the 2 coaches. Everyone else is in the stands.

Watch an MLS match for a team with a recent purpose-built stadium. You'll see what I'm talking about. You don't have to watch for long, just a couple of minutes.

My seats were 5 rows up, that picture was taken at the last home match when one of our best players was leaving for a contract in Europe (his Euro coach was just fired and he is about to come back to MLS with Chicago, which sucks). One of my friends, his daughter got hit in the head with a ball last season, the people in front of us were trying to catch it and just whiffed. Very little time to react, that's how close you are to the field.

 

[TheOriginalCane]

Other than Nascar moving to Homestead, racing doesn't really appeal down here. Which is actually kind of interesting that Homestead didn't get the Grand Prix race.

Want me to explain why not?

 

[TheOriginalCane]

So how does a race track benefit the University of Miami? I keep hearing “good for HRS”, but are we benefiting from it? Are we making any $$ from it? Are season ticket holders getting first access to view the events? If not, why is anyone gushing over what someone else is profiting from?

Because just like those who chant "SEC-SEC-SEC", there are some who live in SoFla who chant "Miami-Miami-Miami". And that's not a reference to UM.

Don't get me wrong, I like to see interesting events, but not at the cost of the permanent home-team stuff.

 

[TheOriginalCane]

I once ordered a sandwich there and stood next to Dan Morgan. Miami Heroes was solid as well. Wash it down with some Velvet Creme donuts.

Until recently, I still had a plastic Miami Heroes cup. I don't think it survived my last move.

 

[TheOriginalCane]

They should rebuild the stadium downtown. Next to Marlins Park and put it back where it belongs.