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Upon Further Review: Carson Beck

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Miami needs to beat Notre Dame...but beyond that, the ACC is losing 5 of their Top 7 returning starters. Only Cade Klubnik and Kevin Jennings are returning, Eli Holstein @ 8 is there, too.

Where does Carson Beck rank in the ACC?

Klubnik
Jennings
Holstein
Incoming players like Mensah, now Beck, Miller Moss, JKS at Cal.

Also, Haynes King is always there lurking in conference because he's a dawg.

But where is Beck on that list? T-1 with Klubnik?
 
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Miamis supporting cast at receiver te and rb is not nearly as good as 2024. X George Horton brown and arroyo with Damien Martinez was a monster crew. Fletcher isn’t as good. Lyle is green. Tight end I don’t even need to start. Arroyo is that dude. Receiver were green and have a guy coming off injury. Offensive line will be good.

The reality is the offense takes a step back. Probably be a top 40 offense. We are praying the defense gets better and takes some pressure off.

Beck is good. He’s not cam. He is more athletic than people think tho. Not a statue
 
idk man I think the offense will be a surprise. I’m usually pretty realistic. Canes def r losing production, but Fletcher finally will get an offseason not injured and Lyles will
Be in his 2nd year, the problem will come if one of them gets hurt. CJ Daniels replaces Horton, and if they get a WR1 and slot/return man I think that position will be fine. The TE positions has more variety, last year it was Arroyo and everybody else was mid. I think Baumen and Lofton r 2 guys they can rely on and hopefully 1 more TE steps up whether it’s Jack Nickel in blocking, Brock Schott, Luka Gilbert, or Jackson Carver. Ik it sounds optimistic but if they do get WRs from the portal everything else will be by committee and if a few players step up that’s a cherry on top.
 
BoxingRobes said:
Miami needs to beat Notre Dame...but beyond that, the ACC is losing 5 of their Top 7 returning starters. Only Cade Klubnik and Kevin Jennings are returning, Eli Holstein @ 8 is there, too.

Where does Carson Beck rank in the ACC?

Klubnik
Jennings
Holstein
Incoming players like Mensah, now Beck, Miller Moss, JKS at Cal.

Also, Haynes King is always there lurking in conference because he's a dawg.

But where is Beck on that list? T-1 with Klubnik?
Click to expand...

Klubnik is the clear #1. Coming off of a very good season, going into Y3 of a system and his top 3 WR’s are all returning. Beck is #2 though IMO.
 
htownkidd said:
Klubnik is the clear #1. Coming off of a very good season, going into Y3 of a system and his top 3 WR’s are all returning. Beck is #2 though IMO.
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Beck did produce a higher EPA per Play, against much tougher competition this year. And last year. Which doesn't give any credit or regression for all the drops Beck endured.

Take that for what you will.
 
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305407cane said:
Miamis supporting cast at receiver te and rb is not nearly as good as 2024. X George Horton brown and arroyo with Damien Martinez was a monster crew. Fletcher isn’t as good. Lyle is green. Tight end I don’t even need to start. Arroyo is that dude. Receiver were green and have a guy coming off injury. Offensive line will be good.

The reality is the offense takes a step back. Probably be a top 40 offense. We are praying the defense gets better and takes some pressure off.

Beck is good. He’s not cam. He is more athletic than people think tho. Not a statue
Click to expand...
* At this time. There's still the spring portal and good players are unhappy all over the country.
 
A lot of people focus on Georgia leading the nation in drops, and rightfully so. But there was also a profound drop-off in the running game.

In 2023, Georgia was 9th in the nation in yards per carry. In 2024, that dropped to 84th. For comparison, Miami was 5th. And Georgia was even worse in terms of volume, ranking 102nd in rushing yards per game.

Miami’s running game will likely drop some without their best back in Damien Martinez. But even in 2023, Miami finished 20th in the nation in yards per carry. And Lyle and Fletcher are a significantly better duo than Parrish and Chaney.

It’s critical that Miami’s running game stays strong, because Beck thrives off play action.
 
DMoney said:
A lot of people focus on Georgia leading the nation in drops, and rightfully so. But there was also a profound drop-off in the running game.

In 2023, Georgia was 9th in the nation in yards per carry. In 2024, that dropped to 84th. For comparison, Miami was 5th. And Georgia was even worse in terms of volume, ranking 102nd in rushing yards per game.

Miami’s running game will likely drop some without their best back in Damien Martinez. But even in 2023, Miami finished 20th in the nation in yards per carry. And Lyle and Fletcher are a significantly better duo than Parrish and Chaney.

It’s critical that Miami’s running game stays strong, because Beck thrives off play action.
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I wish we could put their *** in bubble wrap this Spring.
 
DMoney said:
A lot of people focus on Georgia leading the nation in drops, and rightfully so. But there was also a profound drop-off in the running game.

In 2023, Georgia was 9th in the nation in yards per carry. In 2024, that dropped to 84th. For comparison, Miami was 5th. And Georgia was even worse in terms of volume, ranking 102nd in rushing yards per game.

Miami’s running game will likely drop some without their best back in Damien Martinez. But even in 2023, Miami finished 20th in the nation in yards per carry. And Lyle and Fletcher are a significantly better duo than Parrish and Chaney.

It’s critical that Miami’s running game stays strong, because Beck thrives off play action.
Click to expand...

Don't forget about the OL in general, too. Sacks per game do not tell the whole story, for a few reasons. But they do tell A story.

2023 - UGA was #8 in sacks allowed per game. Allowed 13 in 13 games
2024 - UGA was #58 in sacks allowed per game. Allowed 24 in 13 games

Conversely, Miami was 51st in 2024 in sacks allowed per game, but we know a lot of that was due to Cam's willingness and propensity to hold onto the ball for an eternity and look for big plays down the field. I didn't watch every snap of UGA this year, so Beck may have done something similar at times, but I'd bet money the ball was out of Beck's hands a lot quicker than it was out of Cam's, overall.

In 2023, when Miami had much more stationary QBs, we were 18th in the country in sacks allowed.

So in 2024 Beck had a much worse running game, his pass catchers led the country in drops, and they couldn't protect him nearly as well as they could in 2023.

Just things to keep in mind. Do I think we'll have 2023 UGA talent on offense? No. Brock Bowers and Amarius Mims and Ladd McConkey ain't walking through that door. But I guarantee you Miami won't be in the 80s in rushing. I'd be shocked if they're in the 60s in sacks allowed. Drops TBD, but I like our WR room and I think we add at least 1 more.
 
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BoxingRobes said:
Miami needs to beat Notre Dame...but beyond that, the ACC is losing 5 of their Top 7 returning starters. Only Cade Klubnik and Kevin Jennings are returning, Eli Holstein @ 8 is there, too.

Where does Carson Beck rank in the ACC?

Klubnik
Jennings
Holstein
Incoming players like Mensah, now Beck, Miller Moss, JKS at Cal.

Also, Haynes King is always there lurking in conference because he's a dawg.

But where is Beck on that list? T-1 with Klubnik?
Click to expand...
Cade is 1 right now until Beck is seen healthy imo. we dont know how **** look post recovery.
 
Memnon said:
Good when he had great talent around him.

Now you show me all the NFL caliber talent he currently has at Miami & I'll stop asking questions.
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He will have better talent around him based on what we currently have on the roster than he had last year at UGA. Now it is up to Mario to get even more talent to add in Spring Portal, and to develop the guys that are currently unproven. It is up to Mario+Mirabal and the OLine to ensure we maintain a pretty dominant run game and there isn't a dropoff from having Cam+Martinez. It is up to Beck to vastly improve his decision making.

These aren't things that are out of the realm of possibility. Difficult to achieve? Sure. But not impossible or like it is unknown what is needed. Beck was great in 2023, he wasn't just good. And yes that was with elite weapons. There is no shot we give him anything close to a Brock Bowers. But whereas he mainly just had 2 great weapons in 23 and nothing much else, hopefully we can give him 4-5 Good weapons and design a scheme that makes it easy for him and difficult for the defense to stop.

He was bad to terrible for a 4.5 game stretch last season with objectively bad weapons and an inferior system to ours around him. There is absolutely a reachable middle ground there that ends with him having a good to great season for us though.

Im not making excuses when I say he was dog**** against Texas lol. I am playing devil's advocate a bit because I'm not like some super big fan of his, i just think he is definitely a good college QB and can have success here. And most importantly he was objectively the best qb we actually could land. Thats really the most important thing at the end of the day.

And again you said he was bad-terrible against the best defenses he played this season. Okay well I made a reasonable argument that some of the best actual pass defenses he played against he actually played pretty well. So sure you can then argue against TOTAL defenses he was bad, but that leads to just saying it means he needs a good to hopefully great run game. Okay well it is up to Mario/Dawson/ our Oline/ and RBs to provide that. And you know you and I pretty much share the same position on Fletcher, but it is just factual that last season our run game WAS great. Im guessing you're just of the opinion that that is entirely due to Cam + Martinez being a great runner. So yes total question to whether we can maintain that. But its really not that complicated to have success we NEED to ensure we have a high quality ground game. It's up to Mario and Dawson to deliver that. Im certainly not going to act like it is impossible for this to happen. It may be the most pivotal part to determining if this offense is very successful or not tbh ...

My main opinion is if this offense turns to crap imo it's a failure of coaching. Beck is certainly a good enough college QB to deliver a top 5-25 offense, period. And ultimately how the defense performs will be the determining factor to if this team can repeat 10 wins or even exceed that.
 
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Memnon said:
Beck has shown he can have success on the college level & not necessarily because of him, so WHO is the one that's supposed to take up the mantle of that responsibility this upcoming season?

And how you can make an argument by saying, if you ignore Texas? WHY WOULD WE IGNORE THE TEXAS GAME?

And again, that's a parlor trick of moving the goalposts by going by Pass Defense. The best 3 Defensive teams he played this year, Ole Miss, Texas & Kentucky. Bama did not have a better Defense than any of those teams & even if you want to try to say they did, he's literally the reason they lost to Bama.

Of course you don't view Beck as badly as I do. I don't view him bad at all, I just don't overrate him the way everyone else does. He gets more credit than he actually deserves & receives literally no blame for his porous play. That's the part I don't understand. Especially considering he's played on the most loaded rosters in recent CFB history.

I have no issue with pocket passers. I dont like pedestrian QB's who benefit from playing on loaded teams & then get hyped up as if they're something more than what they really are. QB play in today's era is a whole world's different from what it was 15-20 years ago. The best QB's are the ones who can thrive in uncomfortable situations & make plays when things aren't perfect.

If the only time you look good as a QB is when you have everything else going perfect around you, then that means you lack raw ability. And that lack of raw ability gets exposed once teams figure out how to make you uncomfortable through pass rush & coverages.

That's why a safe risk adverse QB, who doesn't take a lot of deep shots can still manage to throw 12 picks. Because when his inefficiencies aren't being hidden by conservative play calling, he's out there in the wild left to do it on his own. When that happened, he looked like a different player from when he had the protection of high caliber players to rely on.

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These aren't wild improvisational gunslinger throws taking a chance down the field...

These are safe, routine regular system passes that are getting picked or batted down. So what's that say?

These weren't the WR ran the wrong route, or I didn't have enough protection miscues. These are just flat out bad throws within the confines of the same Offense that he ran when UGA was steamrolling over everybody the year prior, so what happened?

Same QB, same Offense, but worse results? How?
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Overall, I have a lot of respect for your game knowledge. You know more than I do. But some of this feels like cherry picking to me. I could just as easily show a dozen bonehead mistakes that Cam made and I legit think he's the best QB Miami has ever had.

I've also seen a fair number of UGA games, and I've also seen Beck make bad decisions. But I've seen a lot of other games, and he's still comparatively better than any other portal QB I've seen except maybe Mateer. Who else would you have gone with? Stack-rank Beck vs. other options, because to me he's either 1a or 1b.
 
Memnon said:
Good when he had great talent around him.

Now you show me all the NFL caliber talent he currently has at Miami & I'll stop asking questions.
Click to expand...

Well, we have 4 or 5 of them along the OL. And when we get the WR1 from the portal -- because we will get one -- I'll circle back.

Jury is still out for me on Fletcher, Lyle, Jojo and Carr. All have flashed. I think Bauman can be stout, not sure he's NFL quality. A year ago today, I would have said the exact same thing about Horton, George and Arroyo. Arroyo is a special case, because he was coming off of essentially two years of injury-based underperformance. Much more upside than Bauman but risk was greater, too.

Look I deeply respect your football knowledge. You were 100% on the DB issues last year and I was right there with you. I am not making excuses, I see the downside risks. But Beck is literally rated HIGHER by Vegas and NFL scouts than Cam was this time last year as a pro-level QB. All I'm saying is maybe you're projecting without all the facts? Or maybe you just really don't like Beck and are biased?
 
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hurricaneman said:
Just reading through this thread, you seem a little unhinged dude. Not really what you're saying but how you're saying it.
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There's nothing unhinged about what or how I'm saying anything.

I'm just not buying the assumptions being made & drinking the Kool-Aid, therefore it appears that way to those who have Blind faith.

It would be very very easy to just accept everything at face value & ask no questions at all & just assume that because we got Beck we're winning the ACC & going to playoffs.

But then there's that pesky little enemy of CIS called reality, that always does its damndest to ruin the dream state.
 
if we can get 80% of what came did passing with a new set of skill that’s solid. Defense becomes top 25 and gets TO’s. That is a recipe for e better season for me.

OL I think will be improved.
Skill positions need to prove it but talent is there. For me losing Cams leadership is the loss. Can Beck lead a new group is my question?

Dl should be improved by scheme and experience.

A tick up in SP and 10-12 wins should absolutely happen.

Lastly comes down to staff to win 1-2 games with scheme, time management, and putting the right players in the field. That is my concern
 
grover said:
Well, we have 4 or 5 of them along the OL. And when we get the WR1 from the portal -- because we will get one -- I'll circle back.

Jury is still out for me on Fletcher, Lyle, Jojo and Carr. All have flashed. I think Bauman can be stout, not sure he's NFL quality. A year ago today, I would have said the exact same thing about Horton, George and Arroyo. Arroyo is a special case, because he was coming off of essentially two years of injury-based underperformance. Much more upside than Bauman but risk was greater, too.

Look I deeply respect your football knowledge. You were 100% on the DB issues last year and I was right there with you. I am not making excuses, I see the downside risks. But Beck is literally rated HIGHER by Vegas and NFL scouts than Cam was this time last year as a pro-level QB. All I'm saying is maybe you're projecting without all the facts? Or maybe you just really don't like Beck and are biased?
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I'm 100% certain I'm significantly more unbiased than anyone on here in general & specifically as it pertains to Beck.

If he were the QB he's being presented to be I would have no problem with saying so & wouldn't have the perspective I do.

I've watched every game he's played over the last 2 seasons as a starter, that's where my opinion is coming from. That's how I come to my conclusions. I don't spout off random thoughts based on nothing. I actually watch & can tell you why & how I get from point A to point B.

You guys remember when I was the only person on the board who posted on Cam Ward when he was at Incarnate Word? How do you think I found out about him? You think I just plucked a random name out of a hat & decided I liked his ability for no reason at all?

Do I strike you as someone who projects without having all the facts?

Did this comment not have facts in them? Or did I just make it all up?

Post in thread 'Upon Further Review: Carson Beck'
https://www.canesinsight.com/threads/upon-further-review-carson-beck.197079/post-7596480

Maybe just maybe, I have reason for why I'm saying the things I'm saying...

But as I stated in my original comment, I knew beforehand exactly what the responses would be.
 
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