How talented is this team really?

[jandman514]

Talented enough to win the coastal and 10 games with a soft schedule.. Talented enough to not get raped by VT worst offense ever at home with them having 8 turnovers against Duke and BC

 

[cane33]

I keep having this argument with friends. We overrated our talent. Look at the defense for example and how many difference makers do you see?

Many of our guys were not highly recruited and for good reason. We have nowhere near the level of talent we should have at Miami. It's going to take time boys.

When he was hired everyone praised him ad nauseum for being able to develop talent. "If he can win with Temple players then he certainly can with Miami players". 3 years in and now the excuse is that we have no talent. What happened to him being such a great developer of talent? Good coaches make the most out of whatever talent they have to work with.

You don't think having this current team at 7-2 is impressive considering the defense doesn't have a first day NFL draft pick on that unit presently?

Our best WR statically is Allen Hurns who is considered a day-2 at best (obviously could change when teams see him work out)

This is nonsense. Howard, Perryman, Gunter, Jenkins, and Bush will all be drafted eventually. Newsflash....MOST DEFENSES IN THE NCAA DO NOT HAVE 5 DRAFTABLE STARTERS. I don't know why people think you must have a team full of future NFL players to field a competent defense. Most of the teams ranked ahead of us have maybe 1 or 2 players that would even get drafted. You think Minnesota, Rice, Ohio, USF, Texas state, Tulane, FAU, Buffalo, Marshall, Western Kentucky, Eastern Carolina, and Bowling Green have more talent than we do on defense? Because they are all ahead of us. And that's despite the garbage schedule we've played. So spare me the nonsense about a lack of talent. I guarantee you this defense will produce more NFL players than every single one of those teams.

Our 7-2 record is fool's gold. Of our 7 wins the only team with a winning record is GT. And we needed a late 4th quarter comeback just to pull that off.

So no...7 wins is not impressive when 6 of those teams are complete garbage and the other is a gimmick option team.

All of you are blinded by our 7-2 record. That **** is a mirage.

 

[sotacane22]

2 fumbles and bad snap put us in a hole before bad teams let us come back in the game but vt didn't make mistakes but our d still played bad and bad play calling coming out of the half and bad player execution

 

[BlackKeysFan]

I think the last 3 games of the regular season will tell us a great deal about the makeup of this team. If we escape 9-3 then I can live with it but if we fold I will be very very concerned.

 

[Dghustla]

Lets look at it from this perspective.

Our best offensive Player: Duke, Soph
Our best defensive player: Tracy Howard, Soph

Duke & Dorsett get injured...we have 3 true freshmen on kickoff and punt return duty. There isn't a single upper classmen who is considered to be a playmaker that can take over that job from them. When 2 freshmen fumble we respond with..................another freshmen lol.

Gus Edwards was a 3 star RB, who is good but now is playing. because we simply don't have any other RB
2* RB/FB Walter Tucker is 1 injury away from seeing meaningful reps.

If we loose another WR i actually don't know who would come in to play.
.....And that was an evaluation of our strongest unit...

Defense..I'm going to keep it simple. every player who is a Redshirt So. (if we even have any RS sophs on this team?) or older is a jag to me until proven otherwise.

Is there some talent there yes. But overall there really isn't much on this team. This class and last years class will define Golden. Primary looking at Kevin Olsen and Brad Kayaa should he stick..one of them has to be legendary PERIOD.

Did Golden just get here? He's recruited 3 classes and around 70 kids since he's gotten here. if our talent issue is as bad as you believe it is, that's on him.

Did I ever say Golden wasn't at fault? Not that I count that first class. But course there a bunch of guys he choose to be here.

 

[Dghustla]

I keep having this argument with friends. We overrated our talent. Look at the defense for example and how many difference makers do you see?

Many of our guys were not highly recruited and for good reason. We have nowhere near the level of talent we should have at Miami. It's going to take time boys.

When he was hired everyone praised him ad nauseum for being able to develop talent. "If he can win with Temple players then he certainly can with Miami players". 3 years in and now the excuse is that we have no talent. What happened to him being such a great developer of talent? Good coaches make the most out of whatever talent they have to work with.

You don't think having this current team at 7-2 is impressive considering the defense doesn't have a first day NFL draft pick on that unit presently?

Our best WR statically is Allen Hurns who is considered a day-2 at best (obviously could change when teams see him work out)

This is nonsense. Howard, Perryman, Gunter, Jenkins, and Bush will all be drafted eventually. Newsflash....MOST DEFENSES IN THE NCAA DO NOT HAVE 5 DRAFTABLE STARTERS. I don't know why people think you must have a team full of future NFL players to field a competent defense. Most of the teams ranked ahead of us have maybe 1 or 2 players that would even get drafted. You think Minnesota, Rice, Ohio, USF, Texas state, Tulane, FAU, Buffalo, Marshall, Western Kentucky, Eastern Carolina, and Bowling Green have more talent than we do on defense? Because they are all ahead of us. And that's despite the garbage schedule we've played. So spare me the nonsense about a lack of talent. I guarantee you this defense will produce more NFL players than every single one of those teams.

Our 7-2 record is fool's gold. Of our 7 wins the only team with a winning record is GT. And we needed a late 4th quarter comeback just to pull that off.

So no...7 wins is not impressive when 6 of those teams are complete garbage and the other is a gimmick option team.

All of you are blinded by our 7-2 record. That **** is a mirage.

Yeah eventually is right. Those guys will have a chance to be drafted. And we are comparing this team with other elite teams. If u think any of the top 3-4 teams in the nation outside of Stanford don't have 4-5+ draftable guys in their 1 deep you are sadly mistaken.

 

[OBLIVION]

Having players drafted, or lack there of. Is not the reason for play this season.

 

[Gamineal]

so who is to blame when 3 guys collide and miss a 3rd and 16 and the guy scores...I think that is on the players, but not sure

 

[Canes_]

I keep having this argument with friends. We overrated our talent. Look at the defense for example and how many difference makers do you see?

Many of our guys were not highly recruited and for good reason. We have nowhere near the level of talent we should have at Miami. It's going to take time boys.

When he was hired everyone praised him ad nauseum for being able to develop talent. "If he can win with Temple players then he certainly can with Miami players". 3 years in and now the excuse is that we have no talent. What happened to him being such a great developer of talent? Good coaches make the most out of whatever talent they have to work with.

You don't think having this current team at 7-2 is impressive considering the defense doesn't have a first day NFL draft pick on that unit presently?

Our best WR statically is Allen Hurns who is considered a day-2 at best (obviously could change when teams see him work out)

Not when you look at our wins and how we won some of those games. We'd be struggling to be bowl eligible if we played the schedule of most top 25 teams.

 

[bacane]

Good thread and a lot of standout points. Here are the take aways (Note: unfortunately, something we still have too few of):

-- The current talent level is a 7 on a 1-to-10 scale, decent but no imminent 1st or 2nd rounders. Henderson looks the part, though suspect he we will get picked apart and no GM will gamble on a selection that early.

-- Talent level is still better than everyone we've played except FSU. Florida also has more on defense.

-- About as expected, but can't say we should be impressed with 7-2 record. Again, the schedule has been ridicuously pedestrian. Never should have lost to a Va Tech team that came in as one of their weakest in recent memory. Scratched, clawed and shown no separation in conference play and can only assume that continues the next three weeks.

-- Belief that we're sitting on a good number of underclassmen who project as 1st or 2nd rounders. Sorry, I see some nice players and hope they really come on, but don't see an OL, DL or linebacker (maybe Perryman after returning for a senior year) currently on campus projecting that high. Our transfer punter may be surest thing to be drafted and make a roster. Coley, Howard, and Burns could project if they develop over the next 2-3 seasons. Gunter is a sleeper. Most assume Duke is a can't-miss but teams recognize early selection of RBs to be a poor allocation of assets, so last year believe there were none taken in first round and 4 or 5 in the second. Tougher when coming off a major injury as well as difficult time staying healthy in general.

 

[Loafers]

You don't have to be draft eligible to be talented. And you don't have to be all that talented to stop Vag Tech. Just ax Duke University.

Since nobody cares to discuss anything other than the performance when I was attempting to speak generally about the team fine. Since when did it become folklore that duke some how destroyed vt. Duke had 198 total yds in the game. Vt had 400. I didn't watch the game so I don't know why Thomas threw the picks but that is why they lost. Duke was 0-11 on third downs. They went 7-26 for 100yds passing.

 

[Loafers]

Having players drafted, or lack there of. Is not the reason for play this season.

That wasn't the point of the thread. I was just talking in general about the overall talent of the team.

 

[bobbydigius]

There isn't a simple answer to where one can grade on a scale from 1-10. We have great talent is some spots, ok in others and inadequate in others. The. There has to be a distinction whether or not the talent is young or upperclassmen. For instance on defense we only have one guy who is anything reminiscent of a difference maker and that is Perryman. We got a bunch of young guys here and there but nothing crazy. Then in other spots such as back up safety, DT, LB and RB we have marginal talent that is pretty pathetic.

Still through all that you just can't convince me that we didn't have enough talent to give VT a better game then we did.

 

[DiegoCane]

I'll keep my answer on topic:

SR who will get drafted:
Morris
Hurns
Linder
Henderson

Porter

JRs who will get drafted:
Dorsett
Scott
Walford
Feliciano

Pierre
Chick
Perryman
Gunter

Most of those guys will be 4th-7th rounders.

Still enough upperclassman talent to be better defensively then we are.

 

[RaiseCane]

Having players drafted, or lack there of. Is not the reason for play this season.

That wasn't the point of the thread. I was just talking in general about the overall talent of the team.

I think the team is not talented enough to stand toe-to-toe with FSU, Alabama and some of the other top teams, but is talented enough to win the Coastal division. Even with some of the JAGs we play on D, are you telling me that Wake, Duke, and several other teams in the country wouldn't trade a bunch of their players for ours?

Do we have some JAGs that play too much, especially on D? Absolutely. But I think we also have to recognize that some of those JAGs are playing ahead of players brought in by Golden, which calls into question why. Raphael Kirby is a RS freshman. He's been here long enough now to be able to make a difference, but he sits behind Jimmy Gaines. Alex Figueroa played in prep school, was here in the spring, and is built like a man, but he plays behind Cornelius. Why? Jelani Hamilton and Hoilett can't get on the field over Shayon Green and David Gilbert. Jamal Carter is a true freshman and shouldn't be expected to be ready to play, but guess what, with 30 and 22 struggling like they have, and 2 not being healthy, it's time for him to find a way to step it up.

Ultimately, it doesn't take too much convincing to believe that we're not at the level of FSU yet from a talent perspective. But lack of talent is not an excuse at this point for getting gashed by mediocre offenses like Florida, UNC, Wake and VT.

 

[Loafers]

Having players drafted, or lack there of. Is not the reason for play this season.

That wasn't the point of the thread. I was just talking in general about the overall talent of the team.

I think the team is not talented enough to stand toe-to-toe with FSU, Alabama and some of the other top teams, but is talented enough to win the Coastal division. Even with some of the JAGs we play on D, are you telling me that Wake, Duke, and several other teams in the country wouldn't trade a bunch of their players for ours?

Do we have some JAGs that play too much, especially on D? Absolutely. But I think we also have to recognize that some of those JAGs are playing ahead of players brought in by Golden, which calls into question why. Raphael Kirby is a RS freshman. He's been here long enough now to be able to make a difference, but he sits behind Jimmy Gaines. Alex Figueroa played in prep school, was here in the spring, and is built like a man, but he plays behind Cornelius. Why? Jelani Hamilton and Hoilett can't get on the field over Shayon Green and David Gilbert. Jamal Carter is a true freshman and shouldn't be expected to be ready to play, but guess what, with 30 and 22 struggling like they have, and 2 not being healthy, it's time for him to find a way to step it up.

Ultimately, it doesn't take too much convincing to believe that we're not at the level of FSU yet from a talent perspective. But lack of talent is not an excuse at this point for getting gashed by mediocre offenses like Florida, UNC, Wake and VT.

Way to quote me and then speak about how we should be better than we are. That wasn't the point. I am speaking in general about the talent of the team. Not performance or what they should be doing. Why keep bringing up duke. They played godawful against vt and only won because vt screwed up. There was nothing duke in that game that should be commended.

 

[RaiseCane]

Having players drafted, or lack there of. Is not the reason for play this season.

That wasn't the point of the thread. I was just talking in general about the overall talent of the team.

I think the team is not talented enough to stand toe-to-toe with FSU, Alabama and some of the other top teams, but is talented enough to win the Coastal division. Even with some of the JAGs we play on D, are you telling me that Wake, Duke, and several other teams in the country wouldn't trade a bunch of their players for ours?

Do we have some JAGs that play too much, especially on D? Absolutely. But I think we also have to recognize that some of those JAGs are playing ahead of players brought in by Golden, which calls into question why. Raphael Kirby is a RS freshman. He's been here long enough now to be able to make a difference, but he sits behind Jimmy Gaines. Alex Figueroa played in prep school, was here in the spring, and is built like a man, but he plays behind Cornelius. Why? Jelani Hamilton and Hoilett can't get on the field over Shayon Green and David Gilbert. Jamal Carter is a true freshman and shouldn't be expected to be ready to play, but guess what, with 30 and 22 struggling like they have, and 2 not being healthy, it's time for him to find a way to step it up.

Ultimately, it doesn't take too much convincing to believe that we're not at the level of FSU yet from a talent perspective. But lack of talent is not an excuse at this point for getting gashed by mediocre offenses like Florida, UNC, Wake and VT.

Way to quote me and then speak about how we should be better than we are. That wasn't the point. I am speaking in general about the talent of the team. Not performance or what they should be doing. Why keep bringing up duke. They played godawful against vt and only won because vt screwed up. There was nothing duke in that game that should be commended.

Wait, explain how what I said didn't relate to the amount of talent that we have. How do you measure talent? I measure talent by how players perform. How would you propose to measure talent? By excluding performance and only looking at how they played in high school? By how fast they run the 40? Anthony Chickillo was a 4/5 star recruit. Everyone wanted him. He's a talented guy that other teams would want. Given his level of talent, he should be performing better but he's not. You want to speak in hypotheticals and ignore how guys are actually playing?

Why bring up Duke? Are you serious? BECAUSE THEY JUST BEAT THE SAME TEAM THAT BLEW US OUT, IN BLACKSBURG, WITH A ROSTER WITH SIGNIFICANTLY LESS TALENT! Who cares that Duke didn't play great. They found a way to win the game and cause Thomas to turn it over 4 times. That would be like saying who cares how Miami played against Florida. UF put up a ton of yards but we won because we forced turnovers.

 

[nycane]

morris and henderson will be drafted based on potential and physical skills not production or accomplishments.

 

[rok]

so who is to blame when 3 guys collide and miss a 3rd and 16 and the guy scores...I think that is on the players, but not sure

Welp, considering the WR was wide *** open on that same route all night long, I blame the coaches.

 

[DeadPoets]

It's amazing how talent shines in certain schemes & under certain tutelage.
DP, Deon, Chickillo, Gunter, Howard, Jenkins, AQM, McCord

^ That alone is enough to hold VT under 300 yards of total offense
Can you even imagine some of that talent in the hands of a real DC.

lol @ McCord playing less than 1/4 of the game. Disgrace.