Talent improvement on Defense

This right here, and add in the inability to make adjustments to what your opponents are doing. I agree we've had a dearth of talent, but we've had enough talent to put a better defense on the field than we've seen. To me it's about maximizing the potential of the players you do have through development and a scheme that fits their strengths.

I found this comparison interesting, so I looked up Michigan State who was #1 in avg yds per game. Pretty much all 3 stars which shows we don't need a team full of 4 and 5 stars to be even respectable. This is what good coaching can do.

Marcus Rush DE (3)
Shilique Calhoun DE (3)
Damon Knox NT (3)
Joel Heath DT (3)
Ed Davis LB (3)
Darien Harris LB (3)
Taiwan Jones LB (3)
Darien Hicks CB (3)
Trae Waynes CB (2)
RJ Williamson S (3)
Curtis Drummond S (3)

So do you think Curtis Porter, Shayon Green, Jimmy Gaines, AJ Highsmith and Ladarius Gunter would have started for that defense? I'm gonna go with "no."

Main point of the OP was, though, to show that we've upgraded our talent a lot from last year, so we should expect to see a better product on the field.

As their careers went at Miami, no, but if they had started day 1 at Mich st under those coaches, who knows.

I doubt it. I think the Michigan State staff just did a better job finding under the radar kids than Randy Shannon did.

Unless you want to give Mark D'Onofrio credit for developing Muhammed Wilkerson, Jaiquawn Jarrett, Terrance Knighton, etc who played for him at Temple.

NO. I think Michigan State just did a better job of scheming for their talent and coaching their kids up.

We do neither.

Our version of the 3-4 (2 gap, read and react) is not what suits Miami. Miami is a traditionally aggressive in your face defense.

We don't have the horses to play 2 gap. Good coaches scheme to the talent of their teams year to year.

Even Golden said every team is different every season. Our coaches are too stubborn to change or just not very good teachers/coaches.

It's like having a pocket passer who doesn't run fast and the coordinator or coach is insistent on running the triple option. Makes no **** sense.
 
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This right here, and add in the inability to make adjustments to what your opponents are doing. I agree we've had a dearth of talent, but we've had enough talent to put a better defense on the field than we've seen. To me it's about maximizing the potential of the players you do have through development and a scheme that fits their strengths.

So do you think Curtis Porter, Shayon Green, Jimmy Gaines, AJ Highsmith and Ladarius Gunter would have started for that defense? I'm gonna go with "no."

Main point of the OP was, though, to show that we've upgraded our talent a lot from last year, so we should expect to see a better product on the field.

As their careers went at Miami, no, but if they had started day 1 at Mich st under those coaches, who knows.

I doubt it. I think the Michigan State staff just did a better job finding under the radar kids than Randy Shannon did.

Unless you want to give Mark D'Onofrio credit for developing Muhammed Wilkerson, Jaiquawn Jarrett, Terrance Knighton, etc who played for him at Temple.

NO. I think Michigan State just did a better job of scheming for their talent and coaching their kids up.

We do neither.

Our version of the 3-4 (2 gap, read and react) is not what suits Miami. Miami is a traditionally aggressive in your face defense.

We don't have the horses to play 2 gap. Good coaches scheme to the talent of their teams year to year.

Even Golden said every team is different every season. Our coaches are too stubborn to change or just not very good teachers/coaches.

It's like having a pocket passer who doesn't run fast and the coordinator or coach is insistent on running the triple option. Makes no **** sense.

I've been saying this since fairyland... smh
 
I hear you 82.

This right here, and add in the inability to make adjustments to what your opponents are doing. I agree we've had a dearth of talent, but we've had enough talent to put a better defense on the field than we've seen. To me it's about maximizing the potential of the players you do have through development and a scheme that fits their strengths.

As their careers went at Miami, no, but if they had started day 1 at Mich st under those coaches, who knows.

I doubt it. I think the Michigan State staff just did a better job finding under the radar kids than Randy Shannon did.

Unless you want to give Mark D'Onofrio credit for developing Muhammed Wilkerson, Jaiquawn Jarrett, Terrance Knighton, etc who played for him at Temple.

NO. I think Michigan State just did a better job of scheming for their talent and coaching their kids up.

We do neither.

Our version of the 3-4 (2 gap, read and react) is not what suits Miami. Miami is a traditionally aggressive in your face defense.

We don't have the horses to play 2 gap. Good coaches scheme to the talent of their teams year to year.

Even Golden said every team is different every season. Our coaches are too stubborn to change or just not very good teachers/coaches.

It's like having a pocket passer who doesn't run fast and the coordinator or coach is insistent on running the triple option. Makes no **** sense.

I've been saying this since fairyland... smh
 
I saw an interesting article on SI "Rumors of Brady’s Demise Are Greatly Exaggerated"
http://mmqb.si.com/2014/06/06/tom-brady-mike-pettine-top-five-quarterback/

Most of the article is irrelevant, but some of the points I think can be related to our Canes offense and defense. The offense part could be related to Morris real easily. Talking about the tiers of qb's in the NFL -

“That’s what I mean,” Pettine said. “There aren’t many guys like that. There’s Tom then there’s Peyton and then I think Brees and you would put Rodgers in that group. Maybe (Philip) Rivers. I think Rivers has had some success and he’s had, like (Antonio) Gates in and out of the lineup, and some no names at wideout and he’s still been able to be successful. Once you get beyond that group, they’re dependent on the guys around them, as we saw with some guys last season. And then there are some quarterbacks you are going to struggle to win with no matter who’s around them. There’s probably 10 like that.”


I think Morris fell into the bottom category, and all the Canes need, with offensive weapons they have, is a guy in the middle category that can use the his weapons to win. Not playing from behind, or with big leads, or with a decent offensive top, should help the defense greatly.
On to the topic of defensive talent-

“There were certain games where you knew that you had zero margin for error, that you couldn’t make a mistake or have a bad call or a bad series because they were going to take advantage of it,” Pettine said. “There are some coordinators you feel like you’re playing checkers against. You’re playing chess against grand masters when you’re going against those two. That’s just the way that you feel going into the game."


Checkers and chess reference.. love it. Problem is, you can't play chess when all you have are checkers pieces. If all you have are mostly checkers guys, you can only play checkers. Is that why we've only been seeing vanilla while trying to teach chess? That leads to this -

“You see the games where they don’t do as well, there’s a little bit of frustration, especially on Tom’s part where he’s not getting a clean look. The games where he knows what you’re in (defensively), I mean it’s over. It might as well be pass scout (team drills). It’s over. The games that he goes 24 for 28, those are the teams that are rushing four and playing split safety coverage against him and it’s just a matter of him playing catch."


Sound familiar? ******* opposing qb's looking like Heisman candidates against the defense?

“That game (against Brady) is the ultimate dial-it-up, I have to be in something different (every play). Not only do I have to have a plan for the first half, but nobody’s better at second-half adjustments so we better come out in the second half, no matter what we’ve been successful with in the first half, we have to come up with something a little different in the second half. When you have success against him, I think that’s because you can keep him guessing a little bit, that he can’t get dialed in."

When you're playing chess with mostly checkers pieces, you're basically a one trick pony. Once you show you're trick... FSU and Louisville, held them for a little bit, they figured it out and went ape **** playing chess.

“The bottom line still is if you can’t match up against all five eligible (receivers), then you’re in trouble. Because he’ll exploit the one (bad matchup). That’s why they get in so much empty (backfield sets) when they start to struggle a little bit. When they get in empty, which kind of cleans (the look) up a little bit, there’s only so many things you can do (scheme-wise) against empty, and he’ll be more concerned about matchup than he is potential coverage. Where can I go? If you don’t have the players to matchup, you can’t hide anybody against them. If you’re hiding guys then you’re probably playing Cover 2 and you’re predictable and you’re probably getting gashed anyway.

The last few years the Canes have been hiding guys at every level of the defense. Only a few of the players could actually match up. We've seen the result. When you're hiding guys at every level of the defense, even cheese doodle qb's get to just play catch. I realize there's nothing new in what I'm saying or any of those quotes. I just found it interesting when I read that and saw Canes all over the scenarios. Captain obvious says that **** has got to stop. Apparently a 3-4 is even more vulnerable when you're hiding guys. The good new is we're starting to see Canes with chess style moves. We're about to see if dorito can actually play chess. No more excuses, you got the players, get the job done or gtfoh. Grand master.. game one.

97.gif
 
Much better athletes in 2014.

McCord > Shayon

Kirby > Gaines

Figueroa > Cornelius

Dallas > Highsmith

Carter > Rodgers

Wyche > Renfrow

AQM > Gilbert

C. Thomas > Perry

D. Owens > Cain
 
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Much better athletes in 2014.

McCord > Shayon

Kirby > Gaines

Figueroa > Cornelius

Dallas > Highsmith

Carter > Rodgers

Wyche > Renfrow

AQM > Gilbert

C. Thomas > Perry

D. Owens > Cain

Going to be better for one simple fact: we will actually be playing 11 guys on defense.

Last year we usually played 7 players and 4 traffic cones right up the middle on all three levels.

This year we have real, live safeties, DP as a middle linebacker, and at the very least a couple guys at DT who won't be blown back 10 yards on every play.

Couple that with good to great corners, speed and size at both OLB positions, and a pretty good 2 deep at both end positions, and what you have is a defense that will shut all the ******** up.
 
Last year against VT we had Highsmith, Green, Gaines, Cornelius, Renfrow starting.

Chick, Pierre, Denzel, Gunter, Jenkins, Howard rounded out the rest of the starting unit.

Which of those two groups made more plays in 2013?
 
Much better athletes in 2014.

McCord > Shayon

Kirby > Gaines

Figueroa > Cornelius

Dallas > Highsmith

Carter > Rodgers

Wyche > Renfrow

AQM > Gilbert

C. Thomas > Perry

D. Owens > Cain

The only problem is most of those guys were already here last year. Since the other guys were so much worse, these guys should have been playing. Why weren't they?
 
So basically we are taking the throw **** on the wall until it sticks approach with guys we assume will be better...we shall see
 
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Much better athletes in 2014.

McCord > Shayon

Kirby > Gaines

Figueroa > Cornelius

Dallas > Highsmith

Carter > Rodgers

Wyche > Renfrow

AQM > Gilbert

C. Thomas > Perry

D. Owens > Cain

The only problem is most of those guys were already here last year. Since the other guys were so much worse, these guys should have been playing. Why weren't they?

I am pretty sure they did play, when not injured. Limited roles as underclassmen, but they did play.

McCord Fr
Kirby So
Figueroa Fr
Dallas RB
Carter Fr
Wyche not here
AQM Fr
C. Thomas high school
D. Owens high school
 
Much better athletes in 2014.

McCord > Shayon

Kirby > Gaines

Figueroa > Cornelius

Dallas > Highsmith

Carter > Rodgers

Wyche > Renfrow

AQM > Gilbert

C. Thomas > Perry

D. Owens > Cain

The only problem is most of those guys were already here last year. Since the other guys were so much worse, these guys should have been playing. Why weren't they?


Were they supposed to play every ******* snap?
 
Much better athletes in 2014.

McCord > Shayon

Kirby > Gaines

Figueroa > Cornelius

Dallas > Highsmith

Carter > Rodgers

Wyche > Renfrow

AQM > Gilbert

C. Thomas > Perry

D. Owens > Cain

The only problem is most of those guys were already here last year. Since the other guys were so much worse, these guys should have been playing. Why weren't they?


Were they supposed to play every ******* snap?

**** dude, go change your tampon, because you are obviously bothered right now. I was just pointing it out that they were already here. Your original post makes it sound like they were not already here and playing and that they just magically appeared and will be the saviors. Most of those guys were here last year and getting solid playing time.

You're stating that they are so much better than the guys they just replaced and I'm asking you why were they not the starters then? You're assuming these guys are going to come in and just dominate because they are on the field. I hope they do, but if they were that much better, why weren't they starting? Why weren't they getting more snaps than those guys they just replaced? In no way did I say they had to play every snap, but why are they playing less snaps since those other guys are such trash in your eyes?
 
Much better athletes in 2014.

McCord > Shayon

Kirby > Gaines

Figueroa > Cornelius

Dallas > Highsmith

Carter > Rodgers

Wyche > Renfrow

AQM > Gilbert

C. Thomas > Perry

D. Owens > Cain

The only problem is most of those guys were already here last year. Since the other guys were so much worse, these guys should have been playing. Why weren't they?


Were they supposed to play every ******* snap?

**** dude, go change your tampon, because you are obviously bothered right now. I was just pointing it out that they were already here. Your original post makes it sound like they were not already here and playing and that they just magically appeared and will be the saviors. Most of those guys were here last year and getting solid playing time.

You're stating that they are so much better than the guys they just replaced and I'm asking you why were they not the starters then? You're assuming these guys are going to come in and just dominate because they are on the field. I hope they do, but if they were that much better, why weren't they starting? Why weren't they getting more snaps than those guys they just replaced? In no way did I say they had to play every snap, but why are they playing less snaps since those other guys are such trash in your eyes?

You wanna meet me at a game and settle this like men?
 
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Much better athletes in 2014.

McCord > Shayon

Kirby > Gaines

Figueroa > Cornelius

Dallas > Highsmith

Carter > Rodgers

Wyche > Renfrow

AQM > Gilbert

C. Thomas > Perry

D. Owens > Cain

The only problem is most of those guys were already here last year. Since the other guys were so much worse, these guys should have been playing. Why weren't they?


Were they supposed to play every ******* snap?

**** dude, go change your tampon, because you are obviously bothered right now. I was just pointing it out that they were already here. Your original post makes it sound like they were not already here and playing and that they just magically appeared and will be the saviors. Most of those guys were here last year and getting solid playing time.

You're stating that they are so much better than the guys they just replaced and I'm asking you why were they not the starters then? You're assuming these guys are going to come in and just dominate because they are on the field. I hope they do, but if they were that much better, why weren't they starting? Why weren't they getting more snaps than those guys they just replaced? In no way did I say they had to play every snap, but why are they playing less snaps since those other guys are such trash in your eyes?

You wanna meet me at a game and settle this like men?

This

194.jpg


or this

195.jpg
 
One of the problems our team has had over the years and it started with clappy is the players thought they were smarter than the coaches. That I'm at the U now, so I'm first round talent and I'm smarter than you. Sam Shields, the junior class that left and most didn't get drafted, and Robinson's dad/him not buying into the system, was a problem. I hear the crowd saying adjust the scheme. I want to wait to see how we look with guys with a different attitude and who wants to buy into Al's system. i do believe this year's defense could be way better than 11. We have high draft picks all over the place. That's if it's not the scheme. Waiting to see.


This is the right attitude to have. Let's see what we look like next year and THEN make judgements.
 
This right here, and add in the inability to make adjustments to what your opponents are doing. I agree we've had a dearth of talent, but we've had enough talent to put a better defense on the field than we've seen. To me it's about maximizing the potential of the players you do have through development and a scheme that fits their strengths.

So do you think Curtis Porter, Shayon Green, Jimmy Gaines, AJ Highsmith and Ladarius Gunter would have started for that defense? I'm gonna go with "no."

Main point of the OP was, though, to show that we've upgraded our talent a lot from last year, so we should expect to see a better product on the field.

As their careers went at Miami, no, but if they had started day 1 at Mich st under those coaches, who knows.

I doubt it. I think the Michigan State staff just did a better job finding under the radar kids than Randy Shannon did.

Unless you want to give Mark D'Onofrio credit for developing Muhammed Wilkerson, Jaiquawn Jarrett, Terrance Knighton, etc who played for him at Temple.

NO. I think Michigan State just did a better job of scheming for their talent and coaching their kids up.

We do neither.

Our version of the 3-4 (2 gap, read and react) is not what suits Miami. Miami is a traditionally aggressive in your face defense.

We don't have the horses to play 2 gap. Good coaches scheme to the talent of their teams year to year.

Even Golden said every team is different every season. Our coaches are too stubborn to change or just not very good teachers/coaches.

It's like having a pocket passer who doesn't run fast and the coordinator or coach is insistent on running the triple option. Makes no **** sense.


What scheme would fit the strengths of Kacey Rogers, AJ Highsmith starting at safety, Jimmy Gaines and Tyrone Cornelius starting at linebacker, and Justin Renfrow and Shayon Green starting on the defensive line?

These were NOT Miami caliber athletes.

I'll hang up and listen....
 
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I saw an interesting article on SI "Rumors of Brady’s Demise Are Greatly Exaggerated"
http://mmqb.si.com/2014/06/06/tom-brady-mike-pettine-top-five-quarterback/

Most of the article is irrelevant, but some of the points I think can be related to our Canes offense and defense. The offense part could be related to Morris real easily. Talking about the tiers of qb's in the NFL -

“That’s what I mean,” Pettine said. “There aren’t many guys like that. There’s Tom then there’s Peyton and then I think Brees and you would put Rodgers in that group. Maybe (Philip) Rivers. I think Rivers has had some success and he’s had, like (Antonio) Gates in and out of the lineup, and some no names at wideout and he’s still been able to be successful. Once you get beyond that group, they’re dependent on the guys around them, as we saw with some guys last season. And then there are some quarterbacks you are going to struggle to win with no matter who’s around them. There’s probably 10 like that.”


I think Morris fell into the bottom category, and all the Canes need, with offensive weapons they have, is a guy in the middle category that can use the his weapons to win. Not playing from behind, or with big leads, or with a decent offensive top, should help the defense greatly.
On to the topic of defensive talent-

“There were certain games where you knew that you had zero margin for error, that you couldn’t make a mistake or have a bad call or a bad series because they were going to take advantage of it,” Pettine said. “There are some coordinators you feel like you’re playing checkers against. You’re playing chess against grand masters when you’re going against those two. That’s just the way that you feel going into the game."


Checkers and chess reference.. love it. Problem is, you can't play chess when all you have are checkers pieces. If all you have are mostly checkers guys, you can only play checkers. Is that why we've only been seeing vanilla while trying to teach chess? That leads to this -

“You see the games where they don’t do as well, there’s a little bit of frustration, especially on Tom’s part where he’s not getting a clean look. The games where he knows what you’re in (defensively), I mean it’s over. It might as well be pass scout (team drills). It’s over. The games that he goes 24 for 28, those are the teams that are rushing four and playing split safety coverage against him and it’s just a matter of him playing catch."


Sound familiar? ****ing opposing qb's looking like Heisman candidates against the defense?

“That game (against Brady) is the ultimate dial-it-up, I have to be in something different (every play). Not only do I have to have a plan for the first half, but nobody’s better at second-half adjustments so we better come out in the second half, no matter what we’ve been successful with in the first half, we have to come up with something a little different in the second half. When you have success against him, I think that’s because you can keep him guessing a little bit, that he can’t get dialed in."

When you're playing chess with mostly checkers pieces, you're basically a one trick pony. Once you show you're trick... FSU and Louisville, held them for a little bit, they figured it out and went ape **** playing chess.

“The bottom line still is if you can’t match up against all five eligible (receivers), then you’re in trouble. Because he’ll exploit the one (bad matchup). That’s why they get in so much empty (backfield sets) when they start to struggle a little bit. When they get in empty, which kind of cleans (the look) up a little bit, there’s only so many things you can do (scheme-wise) against empty, and he’ll be more concerned about matchup than he is potential coverage. Where can I go? If you don’t have the players to matchup, you can’t hide anybody against them. If you’re hiding guys then you’re probably playing Cover 2 and you’re predictable and you’re probably getting gashed anyway.

The last few years the Canes have been hiding guys at every level of the defense. Only a few of the players could actually match up. We've seen the result. When you're hiding guys at every level of the defense, even cheese doodle qb's get to just play catch. I realize there's nothing new in what I'm saying or any of those quotes. I just found it interesting when I read that and saw Canes all over the scenarios. Captain obvious says that **** has got to stop. Apparently a 3-4 is even more vulnerable when you're hiding guys. The good new is we're starting to see Canes with chess style moves. We're about to see if dorito can actually play chess. No more excuses, you got the players, get the job done or gtfoh. Grand master.. game one.

97.gif



Scheme matters more in the NFL because there isn't such a big talent gap between the best players and the worst players.... also these guys live and breathe football 24/7, they are able to understand more complicated schemes.

High school and college football are all about the athletes. You think Ice Harris was a national champion because of his defensive schematics? **** no, it's because he had Chad Thomas and Demetrius Jackson on the defensive line.

High school and college are about identifying and developing talent. Scheme is secondary at this stage.
 
Much better athletes in 2014.

McCord > Shayon

Kirby > Gaines

Figueroa > Cornelius

Dallas > Highsmith

Carter > Rodgers

Wyche > Renfrow

AQM > Gilbert

C. Thomas > Perry

D. Owens > Cain

The only problem is most of those guys were already here last year. Since the other guys were so much worse, these guys should have been playing. Why weren't they?

Conditioning and experience.
 
I would run a 4-3 with this team most of the time with this lineup


DE - AQM
DT - Chickillo
DT - Wyche
DE - Mccord

LB - Figs
LB - Perryman
LB - Kirby

CB - Howard
S - Bush
S - Carter/Jenkins
CB - Gunter
 
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But for a 3-4 I would do this

DE - Chickillo

NT - Wyche

DE - Pierre


LB - Figs
LB - Perryman
LB - Kirby
LB - Grace

CB - Howard
S - Bush
S - Carter/Jenkins
CB - Gunter/Burns
 
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