Serious question regarding turning this program around.

[DMoney]

My take:

When Butch came in, his biggest problem wasn't sanctions. It was a roster full of crappy Dennis Erickson recruits AND sanctions. The three classes before probation, Erickson signed one first rounder (Duane Starks). IIRC, Butch signed nine first rounders in his first three probation classes.

Golden has a two-year head start on clearing the roster and getting his guys on there. So half the job is done. If he can develop these players, including the depth guys, into solid contributors without much attrition, it will make it easier to win games amidst sanctions.

 

[AlexCane]

BTW, and while we're on the subject of perspective, how does the perspective on Coach D go from "we're improving" last week to "fire him!" this week. I'm convinced that 85% of this board is bi-polar. We're a bad defense. And then you take away our 3 biggest playmakers (Bush, Perryman, and EJ) - so bad goes to badder - and people are surprised at the result? Look, I ain't D'Onofrio's agent, but how about we all take a step back?

 

[blackvern]

So OP wants to give him 6 years? Lulz...Listen here us Golden "Questioners" I wont use bashers yet. We are curious why we cant beat a team that was 1-4 in the ACC, we are curious that his best friend was hired as defensive coordinator, we are curious why we're not showing improvemnent by the 10th game of the season on defense. Yea we were out 3 defensive players, but do you realize Virginia was the lowest scoring offense in teh ACC? Lets add to the fact that curtis porter was back and wreaking havoc in the backfield all day we still sucked. Some choose to ask questions some chose to stick their head in the sand. Nobody is saying we have the talent and should field a top 20 defense. What we are saying is that we should not be dead last in the nation on defense.

 

[Angry Ibis]

So OP wants to give him 6 years? Lulz...Listen here us Golden "Questioners" I wont use bashers yet. We are curious why we cant beat a team that was 1-4 in the ACC, we are curious that his best friend was hired as defensive coordinator, we are curious why we're not showing improvemnent by the 10th game of the season on defense. Yea we were out 3 defensive players, but do you realize Virginia was the lowest scoring offense in teh ACC? Lets add to the fact that curtis porter was back and wreaking havoc in the backfield all day we still sucked. Some choose to ask questions some chose to stick their head in the sand. Nobody is saying we have the talent and should field a top 20 defense. What we are saying is that we should not be dead last in the nation on defense.

I think it is ok to be curious, but:

1. While we should have won the game against VA, we were out as many as 5-6 players on defense (if you consider King/Cain players) and our second best and hottest receiver. Facts or excuses, depends on how you want to look at them, but VA picked apart the middle of the field all day where Bush, Terry, EJ and DP could have been, but were not. The winning TD was a solid play, but it was defensive execution too that allowed him back there. Definitely problems on D, and I am curious what the coaches see during the week and if it is not translating to Saturdays.

2. Coach D was "successful" with Golden building a team and defense at Temple. The way you stated it, you make it seem like he hired his best friend off the street and they had not worked together previously and that the Coach had not improved teams on defense. Coach D may not be the answer, but he is in a tough spot rebuilding the shell of a defense after what left in the offseason.

3. We were showing improvement vs. FSU and VT, then we had 5-6 defensive players missing against VA, including the 3 best on the team.

I agree to ask questions, but I also think there is a strong sentiment that says We are Miami, we cannot be this bad, when really given the facts, we could be and are this bad. I think we have to be fair and that is not just "but it's been 10 games, or it's been 2 seasons" but more looking at the talent level, the teams we lost to, players out and the defense the coaches are trying to install.

Is it that people don't agree with the long term philosophy or the current results or both?

I think Coach D deserves a bit more slack and shouldn't be killed because we are frustrated that the overall football team has sucked for almost a decade.

 

[Consigliere]

So OP wants to give him 6 years? Lulz...Listen here us Golden "Questioners" I wont use bashers yet. We are curious why we cant beat a team that was 1-4 in the ACC, we are curious that his best friend was hired as defensive coordinator, we are curious why we're not showing improvemnent by the 10th game of the season on defense. Yea we were out 3 defensive players, but do you realize Virginia was the lowest scoring offense in teh ACC? Lets add to the fact that curtis porter was back and wreaking havoc in the backfield all day we still sucked. Some choose to ask questions some chose to stick their head in the sand. Nobody is saying we have the talent and should field a top 20 defense. What we are saying is that we should not be dead last in the nation on defense.

A few things

1. People should question, that is their right. Keep questioning. Just be open and honest.

2. Why do people give a **** about total yards over points?

I am not a fan of giving up yards but I don't care if we give up a 1000 yards a game if we hold them to 15 points. Now, I understand more yards = more scoring opportunities but it doesn't guarantee points.

We are 88th in scoring defense, which sucks a$$. Stick with that.

3. Once we lost 3 of our best players on a Defense that has serious issues, what did you expect? Hold them to 20 or less points. We have issues in both coaching, talent and experience on our defense. All of the sudden you thought this game was going to be a stellar defensive performance.

I have issues with the D coaching but once EJ was suspended, I began to think BLOOD BATH.

 

[blackvern]

So OP wants to give him 6 years? Lulz...Listen here us Golden "Questioners" I wont use bashers yet. We are curious why we cant beat a team that was 1-4 in the ACC, we are curious that his best friend was hired as defensive coordinator, we are curious why we're not showing improvemnent by the 10th game of the season on defense. Yea we were out 3 defensive players, but do you realize Virginia was the lowest scoring offense in teh ACC? Lets add to the fact that curtis porter was back and wreaking havoc in the backfield all day we still sucked. Some choose to ask questions some chose to stick their head in the sand. Nobody is saying we have the talent and should field a top 20 defense. What we are saying is that we should not be dead last in the nation on defense.

A few things

1. People should question, that is their right. Keep questioning. Just be open and honest.

2. Why do people give a **** about total yards over points?

I am not a fan of giving up yards but I don't care if we give up a 1000 yards a game if we hold them to 15 points. Now, I understand more yards = more scoring opportunities but it doesn't guarantee points.

We are 88th in scoring defense, which sucks a$$. Stick with that.

3. Once we lost 3 of our best players on a Defense that has serious issues, what did you expect? Hold them to 20 or less points. We have issues in both coaching, talent and experience on our defense. All of the sudden you thought this game was going to be a stellar defensive performance.

I have issues with the D coaching but once EJ was suspended, I began to think BLOOD BATH.

1. Giving up more yardage = worst field position for your offense
2.giving up more yardage =more time that your defense is on the field getting tired
3. giving up more yardage means less time and less possesions for your offense to score
4. giving up more yardage =means more confience for the offense your going against and less confidence for your defense
5. and final;ly giving up more yardage and not points is the classic bend but dont break mentality that only pu$$y coaches believe in. Onofrio is a phaggot coach because he has that pu$$y *** mentatlity, what kind of **** is that to be praching mane!!!! It screams passivity and it passes on to our players mane... Olivadotti said the same thing once, im done with dude mane...

 

[tsimonitis]

So OP wants to give him 6 years? Lulz...Listen here us Golden "Questioners" I wont use bashers yet. We are curious why we cant beat a team that was 1-4 in the ACC, we are curious that his best friend was hired as defensive coordinator, we are curious why we're not showing improvemnent by the 10th game of the season on defense. Yea we were out 3 defensive players, but do you realize Virginia was the lowest scoring offense in teh ACC? Lets add to the fact that curtis porter was back and wreaking havoc in the backfield all day we still sucked. Some choose to ask questions some chose to stick their head in the sand. Nobody is saying we have the talent and should field a top 20 defense. What we are saying is that we should not be dead last in the nation on defense.

A few things

1. People should question, that is their right. Keep questioning. Just be open and honest.

2. Why do people give a **** about total yards over points?

I am not a fan of giving up yards but I don't care if we give up a 1000 yards a game if we hold them to 15 points. Now, I understand more yards = more scoring opportunities but it doesn't guarantee points.

We are 88th in scoring defense, which sucks a$$. Stick with that.

3. Once we lost 3 of our best players on a Defense that has serious issues, what did you expect? Hold them to 20 or less points. We have issues in both coaching, talent and experience on our defense. All of the sudden you thought this game was going to be a stellar defensive performance.

I have issues with the D coaching but once EJ was suspended, I began to think BLOOD BATH.

1. Giving up more yardage = worst field position for your offense
2.giving up more yardage =more time that your defense is on the field getting tired
3. giving up more yardage means less time and less possesions for your offense to score
4. giving up more yardage =means more confience for the offense your going against and less confidence for your defense
5. and final;ly giving up more yardage and not points is the classic bend but dont break mentality that only pu$$y coaches believe in. Onofrio is a phaggot coach because he has that pu$$y *** mentatlity, what kind of **** is that to be praching mane!!!! It screams passivity and it passes on to our players mane... Olivadotti said the same thing once, im done with dude mane...

Anyone that has ever met Coach D would disagree with him having a "***** *** mentality". He might or might not be the right man for the job but "***** *** mentality" does not describe Coach D.

 

[WhatTheHell]

Didn't Butch get hired in 95? Probation ended in 98? He won 9 games the year after getting off probation. 11 the season after.

He went 50-21 here even though he was on probation about half the time.

 

[sebastian91]

So OP wants to give him 6 years? Lulz...Listen here us Golden "Questioners" I wont use bashers yet. We are curious why we cant beat a team that was 1-4 in the ACC, we are curious that his best friend was hired as defensive coordinator, we are curious why we're not showing improvemnent by the 10th game of the season on defense. Yea we were out 3 defensive players, but do you realize Virginia was the lowest scoring offense in teh ACC? Lets add to the fact that curtis porter was back and wreaking havoc in the backfield all day we still sucked. Some choose to ask questions some chose to stick their head in the sand. Nobody is saying we have the talent and should field a top 20 defense. What we are saying is that we should not be dead last in the nation on defense.

The OP specifically stated that he was NOT saying that Golden should be given 6 years. We can't beat a 1-4 team in the conference because we are NOT a good team. You can question Golden and the staff all you want, but it doesn't change all of the facts that perfectly explain the answers to your questions. They're sitting there right in front of you.

 

[CanesAreAble]

Numerous posters have offered their opinions with regards to how long it's going to take to turn this thing around. Most posters also agree that Golden's strength is not with X's & O's but instead with recruiting. Many of these same posters hope that he's the second coming of Butch Davis. So my question is, with sanctions that are looming over the program longer than what Butch had to deal with, and considering that almost everyone agrees that butch had arguably the best eye for talent ever, why are so many people expecting Golden to turn it around faster than Butch did? I mean, we weren't fully back until Butch's 6th season, yet I haven't seen one single individual say that 2016 should be the barometer year for AG. In fact, if Golden does turn it around in his 6th season just like Butch, one could argue that Al's turnaround is even more impressive considering sanctions are still hovering over his head late into his second season whereas Butch knew what he was up against before the end of his first season.

Are you saying Golden is better than Butch? Are you saying the circumstances are more favorable in Golden's situation? I am in no way asking for everyone to be patient and give Golden six years before they start complaining, but instead I'm just trying to understand the logic of those that compare Golden to Butch Davis but then expect him to turn things around quicker. That stance just doesn't make sense to me, yet quite a few fans have it.

Great post.

Bottom line is people wanted to run Butch out of here, but they didn't get their wish, and we know how that turned out.

 

[AlexCane]

Numerous posters have offered their opinions with regards to how long it's going to take to turn this thing around. Most posters also agree that Golden's strength is not with X's & O's but instead with recruiting. Many of these same posters hope that he's the second coming of Butch Davis. So my question is, with sanctions that are looming over the program longer than what Butch had to deal with, and considering that almost everyone agrees that butch had arguably the best eye for talent ever, why are so many people expecting Golden to turn it around faster than Butch did? I mean, we weren't fully back until Butch's 6th season, yet I haven't seen one single individual say that 2016 should be the barometer year for AG. In fact, if Golden does turn it around in his 6th season just like Butch, one could argue that Al's turnaround is even more impressive considering sanctions are still hovering over his head late into his second season whereas Butch knew what he was up against before the end of his first season.

Are you saying Golden is better than Butch? Are you saying the circumstances are more favorable in Golden's situation? I am in no way asking for everyone to be patient and give Golden six years before they start complaining, but instead I'm just trying to understand the logic of those that compare Golden to Butch Davis but then expect him to turn things around quicker. That stance just doesn't make sense to me, yet quite a few fans have it.

Great post.

Bottom line is people wanted to run Butch out of here, but they didn't get their wish, and we know how that turned out.

You mean, Botch, as he was known around here.

 

[Consigliere]

So OP wants to give him 6 years? Lulz...Listen here us Golden "Questioners" I wont use bashers yet. We are curious why we cant beat a team that was 1-4 in the ACC, we are curious that his best friend was hired as defensive coordinator, we are curious why we're not showing improvemnent by the 10th game of the season on defense. Yea we were out 3 defensive players, but do you realize Virginia was the lowest scoring offense in teh ACC? Lets add to the fact that curtis porter was back and wreaking havoc in the backfield all day we still sucked. Some choose to ask questions some chose to stick their head in the sand. Nobody is saying we have the talent and should field a top 20 defense. What we are saying is that we should not be dead last in the nation on defense.

A few things

1. People should question, that is their right. Keep questioning. Just be open and honest.

2. Why do people give a **** about total yards over points?

I am not a fan of giving up yards but I don't care if we give up a 1000 yards a game if we hold them to 15 points. Now, I understand more yards = more scoring opportunities but it doesn't guarantee points.

We are 88th in scoring defense, which sucks a$$. Stick with that.

3. Once we lost 3 of our best players on a Defense that has serious issues, what did you expect? Hold them to 20 or less points. We have issues in both coaching, talent and experience on our defense. All of the sudden you thought this game was going to be a stellar defensive performance.

I have issues with the D coaching but once EJ was suspended, I began to think BLOOD BATH.

1. Giving up more yardage = worst field position for your offense
2.giving up more yardage =more time that your defense is on the field getting tired
3. giving up more yardage means less time and less possesions for your offense to score
4. giving up more yardage =means more confience for the offense your going against and less confidence for your defense
5. and final;ly giving up more yardage and not points is the classic bend but dont break mentality that only pu$$y coaches believe in. Onofrio is a phaggot coach because he has that pu$$y *** mentatlity, what kind of **** is that to be praching mane!!!! It screams passivity and it passes on to our players mane... Olivadotti said the same thing once, im done with dude mane...

Like I said, not a fan of giving up a bunch of yards but points is and are what runs the ship.

So I will take that as you agree with me.

Thanks

 

[ghost2]

I think the 8 consecutive years of mediocrity have got this miniscule but passionate fanbase so ****ing irate that we(including myself) do not give a **** that it's only his second year, or that he has to play a bunch of undersized, inexperienced babies.

All we see are a bunch of ****ing **** *** terrible ACC teams and our complete and utter inability to take advantage of them, and that's enough to send us to the rubber room in a straitjacket.

****, I'm still intensely ****ed up over that Hoos loss. It's simply insane to me that we continue to make terrible, awful, ****ty quarterbacks look like Joe Montana. Literally cannot stand thinking about it. **** you, Dorito. **** YOU.

:ibisroflmao:


I just have this awesome image of DCF sitting at his keyboard drunk off his ***, beating up a puppy while screaming at the top of his lungs... Well put, sir!

 

[UMJer026]

BTW, and while we're on the subject of perspective, how does the perspective on Coach D go from "we're improving" last week to "fire him!" this week. I'm convinced that 85% of this board is bi-polar. We're a bad defense. And then you take away our 3 biggest playmakers (Bush, Perryman, and EJ) - so bad goes to badder - and people are surprised at the result? Look, I ain't D'Onofrio's agent, but how about we all take a step back?

Well said, Alex.

 

[Dandycane]

Stop acting like this is 00-04 canes teams

Is that meant for the OP? If so, wtf?

Based on what I saw in the spring, the depth chart, and all of the experience on defense getting hoodwinked by Rosenhaus, I thought we would be very fortunate to equal our win total from last year. I legitimately thought that we could see a 2-4 win season based on the roster and schedule. A lot of the so-called experts around the country also had us finishing well down in the Coastal and not even winning 6 games. This team has exceeded my expectations for the season, and the coaching staff, IMO, is performing miracles with what they have to work with. Most fans here don't want to hear that because they need to be instantly gratified and lack any comprehension of reality. They think that "We are Miami!", which is somehow supposed to make us immune to being a crappy team. Guess what? We're a crappy team, and we'll be lucky to win another game this season. Hopefully, we can pull one of these games out and self-impose again. There's little chance, in my mind, of winning 9 games next season. That would be a fantastic result, and Golden should be crowned and given a job for life if he can pull that off.

This. Golden walked into an abomination from all angles: recruiting, talent, S&C, entitled players, and the icing on the cake, pending sanctions.

Thank you. Tis fanbase continues to live in the heyday of this program. Delusional 24/7. Golden has a more difficult situation in terms of what he is up against than Butch ever had to face. Sanctions hovering, negative recruiting, no Orange Bowl, a new era of college football where South Florida is pilfered for recruits, more Florida schools. And he inherited a mental and cultural team cancer unlike anything Butch saw......and **** for a fan base.

No comparison. Golden is looking at mountain of difficulties.

 

[RaiseCane]

I think the 8 consecutive years of mediocrity have got this miniscule but passionate fanbase so ****ing irate that we(including myself) do not give a **** that it's only his second year, or that he has to play a bunch of undersized, inexperienced babies.

All we see are a bunch of ****ing **** *** terrible ACC teams and our complete and utter inability to take advantage of them, and that's enough to send us to the rubber room in a straitjacket.

****, I'm still intensely ****ed up over that Hoos loss. It's simply insane to me that we continue to make terrible, awful, ****ty quarterbacks look like Joe Montana. Literally cannot stand thinking about it. **** you, Dorito. **** YOU.

I think that part of the reason that we're so bi-polar, as a fanbase, is that we're all just itching for something positive to grab onto. But, every time it seems like we have something, we find a way to blow it, with each successive year become more frustrating than the one before. It SEEMED like our defense was making progress the past couple weeks, so we were all hopeful. It SEEMED like this year, with the division once again in our control, we had a path that would allow us to finally win our division in the ACC (which is still unbelievable to type, I mean, honestly, who would have thought 9 years ago that we'd still be looking for our first division title). But, just like so many recent seasons, all of our apparent progress went up in flames, this time, to probably the worst team we've lost to in the process of blowing a chance at the division.

Personally, I'm dying to see progress. I want to be able to point to the overtime win against GT, or the last second win against NCST, or the toughing it out win against VT, as signs that we're headed in the right direction. I understand it's a process. But, losses like this really shake my belief in the process. I know we are mediocre (at best). I know we were missing our best 3 defensive players. Still, we made Michael Rocco look like Peyton Manning, we found a way to underutilize Duke at the end of a game he was dominating, and we found a way to lose a 3rd straight game to Virginia (another sentence that pains me).

I'm hopeful that we can close out the season positively, because it would be hard to stomach more negativity on the field heading into another offseason of uncertainty.

 

[cane305]

i just wish we don't have to keep saying, "next year we'll be back"

 

[maximegauthierl]

I'm just trying to understand the logic

Good luck with that. Logic is not a strong point of this fanbase.

This.

 

[Shogungts]

Personally, I'm dying to see progress. I want to be able to point to the overtime win against GT, or the last second win against NCST, or the toughing it out win against VT, as signs that we're headed in the right direction. I understand it's a process. But, losses like this really shake my belief in the process. I know we are mediocre (at best). I know we were missing our best 3 defensive players. Still, we made Michael Rocco look like Peyton Manning, we found a way to underutilize Duke at the end of a game he was dominating, and we found a way to lose a 3rd straight game to Virginia (another sentence that pains me).

I'm hopeful that we can close out the season positively, because it would be hard to stomach more negativity on the field heading into another offseason of uncertainty.

I think that (the first bold) is a fair thing to want to see.

I also think it's games like that (the second bold) that set us up for disappointment. When we beat a team like VT who has struggled all year and did everything they possibly could to give us that game, we act like they were the VT from a couple of years ago and get our hopes up. Sure, we beat them 30-12, but everyone who watched that game should realize the game was a lot closer. A bad VT gave us that game. Look at every game we have won this year; we only handled BCC. Every other game we won was a struggle and which of the teams we have beat can we point to being good? The best team is a 6-4 NCST who was a last second win.

I understand people are frustrated and understandably so, but people have to realize we are just not a good team. Yes, that is a bad UVA team we lost to, but to act like we are good enough that we should automatically win that game b/c we are Miami is looking through some orange and green tinted glasses and 'mirage' wins against teams like VT unfortunately just tints those glasses even darker.

 

[maximegauthierl]

Are you really trying to have a logical discussion after a Hurricane loss? Might as well throw your life savings into the lotto today and hope for the best.

And this.