Scrimmage take...

[ThomasM]

If Ken is hiding in the QB room bring him out. I was unhappy with Vinny because he lost both his NC games. He was our best QB ever and had the best team ever but every time I looked up it was another pick or dropped pass. JJ couldn't coach a bowl game worth a crap.

Do I want better QB play, **** yes!!!!! I also want Manny to stop having brain farts on defense and Mark to coach better. While I am at it, I WANT BUTCH TOO. But we have what we have and last year was the best in I turned 50 so I will not trash the guy at the point of the spear for it. He loss his All ACC rb in Tally and won the game in the most classic Cane manner for that rival game -- unlike the last three years where we played better than this year but loss. That alone made the year a winner. Then the TO chain, the GT comeback, the VT beat down and that ND game with Game Day in town. Come on. For a shinning moment we were back my friend. We climb to Number 2 and are the first thing to come close stealing the news cycle since Trump rode down the escalator.

Look, everything you say is true and if Williams shows enough to get Mark to sit the guy who gave him is best start EVER as a HC, then I have no problem with it. Given your fair points, I have one question, with the noles in The Rock this year, one minute to play and us down 5, who do you want on the field? The guy who won game like that 12 months earlier, of the shiny new kid in his first ever BIG MOMENT? Is it okay to lose that game next year in exchange for the promise of better 2019?

If someone beats Rosier out then fine. But I just cannot dump the guy who just gave us best season and most excitement since Berlin for what he did NOT do when we don't know if anyone we have can do what he DID do. Williams an 11 win guy, okay. Nine wins with promise of more later, he can wait until next year.

If we are down 5, it means Rosier missed a crap load of passes and we are losing because of it. Good QB play and we're not down by 5.

Again, I don't get too caught up in the 10 wins, because we win more with better QB play, and I don't think that's even debatable. Also, we pound UNC, whoop FSU, and don't need a miracle to beat GT.

Also, Ken Dorsey wasn't Ken Dorsey when Kelly was struggling. To most he was a skinny backup that was going to get snapped in half if he ever played. All we needed was a guy to complete passes to our plethora of skill position talent. Sound familiar? We have guys open all over the field, but a QB in Rosier that can't hit them.

I do agree with you. Diaz needs the D to play at a higher level. I believe, though, that when our O can convert more than 4 3rd downs a game, our D will be rested and look a lot better. They can't give up plays if they aren't on the field.

https://www.teamrankings.com/college-football/stat/third-down-conversions-per-game

Feast your eyes on this stat. This is not acceptable at all, and Rosier is a big reason for it.

 

[OriginalCanesCanesCanes]

Game changing play, IMO. If we score there the entire complexion of the game changes. At the very least we make the game competitive.

I’ve seen that play once.

I thought there was something wrong with his arm. It’s not that like was 70 yds in the air. And Rosier has had enough arm in the past. It had to be the shoulder. He didn’t have enough strength to get the ball 35-40 yds in the air? Nah...That’s an injury. Right?

I mean that’s what I thought at the the time. There’s Jeff sitting there waiting for it for a full 2 seconds.

What was the consensus?

There were plenty of other crappy throws that game, but I just don’t think he had his “long arm” that game. Am I remembering this wrong?

Because I saw the game live, and I’ve never rewatched it.

I don’t like to relive misery.

 

[919cane]

Jeff Thomas was running free all **** year. Not surprising he was ****ed about us not having a QB capable of getting him the ball.

 

[AUcane]

We do all of the above...problem is we do it at wrong time with the wrong people, IE calling an ill advised tunnel screen to Berrios in the bowl game that brought all the momentum we did have to a screeching halt.

we don't do nearly enough of it and when we do it, it usually takes a perfect storm to make it an effective play. It almost always gets destroyed.

Screens/short passing game is one of those things if you're not practicing it over and over, you just won't get good at it.

 

[DTP]

Ahh 17 pages and counting of people ready to blow their heads off. @Coach Macho you had to know this was coming when you started this thread lol. Some promising signs and some disturbing setbacks but this team is far from a finished product. The defense usually dominates these early scrimmages. Mostly because the offense is purposefully vanilla. Can't get creative until you get the fundamentals down first. Gotta learn how to hit a slant against man coverage and not throw a bubble at a receiver's feet before you can get super intricate and creative with plays.

 

[CANEMC]

 

[boxtonenyc]

The excuse machine is warming up. “Rosier sucks thats why the offense doesnt work”.

Hes had three recruiting classes plus the transfer wire and JUCOs to get a QB that isnt a baseball player.

He put all his eggs in the Perry basket, and if Perry sucks, thats terrible evaluation.

Bottom line is in year 3 Richt owns this team. Anyone who is arguing otherwise is not a Cane fan, but a Richt fan.

 

[brock]

The excuse machine is warming up. “Rosier sucks thats why the offense doesnt work”.

Hes had three recruiting classes plus the transfer wire and JUCOs to get a QB that isnt a baseball player.

He put all his eggs in the Perry basket, and if Perry sucks, thats terrible evaluation.

Bottom line is in year 3 Richt owns this team. Anyone who is arguing otherwise is not a Cane fan, but a Richt fan.

What excuse machine? Yes rosier has limitations but let’s be real about the situation, we were missing our top 3 offensive players basically the last 2 games(Walton since game 4). Let’s see what richt does with hopefully improved play from rosier who happened to have 3600 yards 31(26 passing) 14 ints total in his first season starting or one of the young guns beat him. As well as a loaded offense at his disposal. Williams looks like a guy we should be excited about and it’s still early for Perry as well. After all this is his first spring and hasn’t even been on campus for a full year yet

 

[boxtonenyc]

Broke missing the forest through the trees? No way!

This thread is about how we are staring at the real possibility of Rosier starting again.

So when the offense is inconsistent fans like you will scream “its not richts fault!”. My point is if Rosier is starting next year by default, it is 100% Richts fault.

Nuanced, I know.

 

[STG]

Honest questions. Do you think Rosier performed well all season? Do you think we can do better than Rosier at the position?

You see, people like to talk about those 10 wins because we haven't done it in a while, but truth be told, with good QB play we win 12, and are in the playoffs. Rosier didn't carry this team. Yes, he made some big plays, but had he played well we wouldn't have needed comebacks and miracles to beat some of those teams. This team, and every good football team, needs consistent play from the QB position. There's nothing more disheartening to a team than a QB missing opportunities that are there. It wears on them.

Look at the 99 Canes team. Just a couple years removed from 5-7. We should have been doing backflips. Instead, we were watching some pretty terrible QB play. Only when Dorsey came in did the team take off. Same exact thing right now. Ironically, Kenny Kelly completed 54.4% of his passes that year. Rosier this year? 54.0% Dorsey came in and completed 61.7% at the end of 1999 and the team set a record for most points in 3 games. It's a really big deal, getting those completions. Rosier is not a 60% completion guy, and that's what we need. And quite honestly, with the plays being called that % should be closer to 65%.

If you're happy with stalled drives and missed wide open WRs, good for you. I've been around long enough to know what good QB play looks like, and we didn't see it last year.

Here's the thing, NO QB in UM history has every completed passes at that rate. Now you want a 2 star QB, who was never supposed to play a down of football, or even be here to begin with to be the most efficient passer in UM history now? None of our 4 and 5 star QB could completed 65% of there passes, ****, no QB in UM history is even close that for there career, but let's ask the most unheralded starter we have ever had at QB to be the first to do it.

Historically we have NEVER had QB's who complete at a high percentage rate. Out of our 9 starting QBs in the last 20 years, only 2 of those 9 have a career completion percentage of over 60%. And it's not like they were completing 63, 64, 65, they were just above 60%.

First, as was done with Dorsey and Berlin, both who had career 58% or less at UM, you can clearly win and succeed with a QB who does not complete a high percentage of passes, if, he has enough talent around him. All Rosier needs to do to be better than Covington, Dorsey, Berlin, Wright, Morris in his senior year is average 1.75 more completions per 32 attempts than he did his junior year. That is EXTREMELY doable. I am by no means a fan of Rosier. ****, I would love to see ANY, yes, ANY of the current QB's unseat him if they truly are going to give us a better chance at winning, but, if they don't, it's not like Rosier has to DRASTICALLY improve on his completion percentage. ****, just alone in dropped passed last year, if those are cut in half, Malik completes 56% of his passes instead of 54%.

The more I look at our past QB's rate of completion percentages, the more I think that Malik is getting a really bad rap. He already gives us a dimension at a true threat running the ball, if he can just complete 1.75 more passes this year for every 32 attempts, he is at 59%. And I don't believe he regresses this year, I think he either will be the same or slightly improve. But the slight improvement doesn't have to be much as you can see.

​

1. Scott Covington (1995-1998) - 58.9% his senior year, 56.5% for his career​

2. Ken Dorsey (1999-2002) - 56.5% his senior year, 57.9% for his career​

3. Brock Berlin (2003-2004) - 56% his senior year, 58% for his career at UM​

4. Kyle Wright (2004-2007) - 58.5% his senior year, 59.2% for his career​

5. Kirby Freeman (2005-2007) - 31% his junior year, 46.7% for his career at UM​

6. Robert Marve (2008) - 54.5% his only year at UM​

7. Jacory Harris (2008-2011) - 65% his senior year, 60.1% for his career​

8. Stephen Morris (2010-2013) - 57.6% his senior year, 57.7 for his career​

9. Brad Kaaya - (2014-2016) - 62% his junior year, 60.6% for his career​

​

 

[brock]

Broke missing the forest through the trees? No way!

This thread is about how we are staring at the real possibility of Rosier starting again.

So when the offense is inconsistent fans like you will scream “its not richts fault!”. My point is if Rosier is starting next year by default, it is 100% Richts fault.

Nuanced, I know.

You need to chill, we don’t play LSU until 5 months from now, it will all play out

 

[OriginalCanesCanesCanes]

Broke missing the forest through the trees? No way!

This thread is about how we are staring at the real possibility of Rosier starting again.

So when the offense is inconsistent fans like you will scream “its not richts fault!”. My point is if Rosier is starting next year by default, it is 100% Richts fault.

Nuanced, I know.

You seem to be a one man band, playing the same one note song, over and over and over again.

We get it.

This will be Rick’s third season. If he hasn’t found a QB better than Rosier by season 3 to start it’s 100% on him. Fair enough.

We got it.

What else you got?

Or are you going to repeat that 50 more times?

.

 

[ThomasM]

We

Here's the thing, NO QB in UM history has every completed passes at that rate. Now you want a 2 star QB, who was never supposed to play a down of football, or even be here to begin with to be the most efficient passer in UM history now? None of our 4 and 5 star QB could completed 65% of there passes, ****, no QB in UM history is even close that for there career, but let's ask the most unheralded starter we have ever had at QB to be the first to do it.

Historically we have NEVER had QB's who complete at a high percentage rate. Out of our 9 starting QBs in the last 20 years, only 2 of those 9 have a career completion percentage of over 60%. And it's not like they were completing 63, 64, 65, they were just above 60%.

First, as was done with Dorsey and Berlin, both who had career 58% or less at UM, you can clearly win and succeed with a QB who does not complete a high percentage of passes, if, he has enough talent around him. All Rosier needs to do to be better than Covington, Dorsey, Berlin, Wright, Morris in his senior year is average 1.75 more completions per 32 attempts than he did his junior year. That is EXTREMELY doable. I am by no means a fan of Rosier. ****, I would love to see ANY, yes, ANY of the current QB's unseat him if they truly are going to give us a better chance at winning, but, if they don't, it's not like Rosier has to DRASTICALLY improve on his completion percentage. ****, just alone in dropped passed last year, if those are cut in half, Malik completes 56% of his passes instead of 54%.

The more I look at our past QB's rate of completion percentages, the more I think that Malik is getting a really bad rap. He already gives us a dimension at a true threat running the ball, if he can just complete 1.75 more passes this year for every 32 attempts, he is at 59%. And I don't believe he regresses this year, I think he either will be the same or slightly improve. But the slight improvement doesn't have to be much as you can see.

​

1. Scott Covington (1995-1998) - 58.9% his senior year, 56.5% for his career​

2. Ken Dorsey (1999-2002) - 56.5% his senior year, 57.9% for his career​

3. Brock Berlin (2003-2004) - 56% his senior year, 58% for his career at UM​

4. Kyle Wright (2004-2007) - 58.5% his senior year, 59.2% for his career​

5. Kirby Freeman (2005-2007) - 31% his junior year, 46.7% for his career at UM​

6. Robert Marve (2008) - 54.5% his only year at UM​

7. Jacory Harris (2008-2011) - 65% his senior year, 60.1% for his career​

8. Stephen Morris (2010-2013) - 57.6% his senior year, 57.7 for his career​

9. Brad Kaaya - (2014-2016) - 62% his junior year, 60.6% for his career​

​

We averaged 3.6 3rd downs a game. That ranked 129th out of 130. I don't care if he completes 50% of his passes, as long as they are 3rd down conversions for 1st downs. We will NEVER be a championship caliber team while getting 3.6 3rd downs a game. That is far and away the most damning stat from last season.

 

[boxtonenyc]

You seem to be a one man band, playing the same one note song, over and over and over again.

We get it.

This will be Rick’s third season. If he hasn’t found a QB better than Rosier by season 3 to start it’s 100% on him. Fair enough.

We got it.

What else you got?

Or are you going to repeat that 50 more times?

.

As long as people continue to promote their agenda of excusing coaches? You bet.

 

[umhurricane2511]

Gonna be a long offseason

 

[OriginalCanesCanesCanes]

As long as people continue to promote their agenda of excusing coaches? You bet.

What agenda?

The only agenda I’m seeing now is your obsessive agenda of repeating the same thing over and over again, like someone with OCD.

Rick is the head guy, so yeah, he’s responsible for everything. Buck stops with him. What else is new?

I mean, I don’t know. What else would you like to add?

Are you suggesting pitchforks? Tarring and feathering? A protest? Where exactly are you going with this?

Or do you just want to jump up and down and whine?

 

[itsacanething]

We

We averaged 3.6 3rd downs a game. That ranked 129th out of 130. I don't care if he completes 50% of his passes, as long as they are 3rd down conversions for 1st downs. We will NEVER be a championship caliber team while getting 3.6 3rd downs a game. That is far and away the most damning stat from last season.

agree with both these posts. its a combination of clutch plays and increased completion percentage. what we really need to see is a stat on keeping drives alive (i guess that is third down conversions) because malik gives us a dimension that no other UM QB has given. Bottom line a little improvement from Malik and the others around him and this is a pretty good football team.

 

[OptimusCreampie]

Game changing play, IMO. If we score there the entire complexion of the game changes. At the very least we make the game competitive.

Yea it does and the fumble at the beginning if it rolls our way but Can't play the what if game we are reloaded this season I'm excited to see what we are about. That play though is one of a couple reasons makes me think that richt can open it up playbook wise that's why I want to give him this season atleast before I write him off as oc because it's year 3 and it should yield results

 

[DTP]

Here's the thing, NO QB in UM history has every completed passes at that rate. Now you want a 2 star QB, who was never supposed to play a down of football, or even be here to begin with to be the most efficient passer in UM history now? None of our 4 and 5 star QB could completed 65% of there passes, ****, no QB in UM history is even close that for there career, but let's ask the most unheralded starter we have ever had at QB to be the first to do it.

Historically we have NEVER had QB's who complete at a high percentage rate. Out of our 9 starting QBs in the last 20 years, only 2 of those 9 have a career completion percentage of over 60%. And it's not like they were completing 63, 64, 65, they were just above 60%.

First, as was done with Dorsey and Berlin, both who had career 58% or less at UM, you can clearly win and succeed with a QB who does not complete a high percentage of passes, if, he has enough talent around him. All Rosier needs to do to be better than Covington, Dorsey, Berlin, Wright, Morris in his senior year is average 1.75 more completions per 32 attempts than he did his junior year. That is EXTREMELY doable. I am by no means a fan of Rosier. ****, I would love to see ANY, yes, ANY of the current QB's unseat him if they truly are going to give us a better chance at winning, but, if they don't, it's not like Rosier has to DRASTICALLY improve on his completion percentage. ****, just alone in dropped passed last year, if those are cut in half, Malik completes 56% of his passes instead of 54%.

The more I look at our past QB's rate of completion percentages, the more I think that Malik is getting a really bad rap. He already gives us a dimension at a true threat running the ball, if he can just complete 1.75 more passes this year for every 32 attempts, he is at 59%. And I don't believe he regresses this year, I think he either will be the same or slightly improve. But the slight improvement doesn't have to be much as you can see.

​

1. Scott Covington (1995-1998) - 58.9% his senior year, 56.5% for his career​

2. Ken Dorsey (1999-2002) - 56.5% his senior year, 57.9% for his career​

3. Brock Berlin (2003-2004) - 56% his senior year, 58% for his career at UM​

4. Kyle Wright (2004-2007) - 58.5% his senior year, 59.2% for his career​

5. Kirby Freeman (2005-2007) - 31% his junior year, 46.7% for his career at UM​

6. Robert Marve (2008) - 54.5% his only year at UM​

7. Jacory Harris (2008-2011) - 65% his senior year, 60.1% for his career​

8. Stephen Morris (2010-2013) - 57.6% his senior year, 57.7 for his career​

9. Brad Kaaya - (2014-2016) - 62% his junior year, 60.6% for his career​

​

Not a good analogy. You can't compare QB numbers from 15-20 years ago to QB numbers today. The rules are different and offenses have changed drastically. There's much less downfield contact allowed and offenses are more likely to use screens and underneath routes out of spread formations. ****, Richt called at least 4 to 5 WR screens per game last year. That should be 5 free completions. A much better comparison would be comparing Rosier's completion % in 2017 to other FBS QBs in 2017. When you do that, you see he is drastically lacking in that category. 55% in 2018 won't cut the mustard.

 

[OptimusCreampie]

The excuse machine is warming up. “Rosier sucks thats why the offense doesnt work”.

Hes had three recruiting classes plus the transfer wire and JUCOs to get a QB that isnt a baseball player.

He put all his eggs in the Perry basket, and if Perry sucks, thats terrible evaluation.

Bottom line is in year 3 Richt owns this team. Anyone who is arguing otherwise is not a Cane fan, but a Richt fan.

I agree with this to a degree but cmon you gotta give the man a chance golden gave him absolutely nothing to work with