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Our defense is bizarre

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The stats don’t lie and tell you everything you need to know, and everything we already knew, about this defense heading into the season. 8th in rush defense, 11th in sacks….63rd in pass defense. The D-Line is elite, but once you get to the LB’s, and eventually the secondary it continues to fall off. The #1 priority for Mario going into next year is improving the back end of this defense and infusing it with as much talent as possible. This is one of the most explosive offenses I’ve ever seen, but I get the feeling we’re all anxious with the feeling that somewhere, eventually, that secondary is going to cost us a game.
 
flips said:
Our run defense has been a lot like our pass defense though: successful most of the time but when unsuccessful we're in a class by ourseleves.

Y-AXIS: Run Play Explosives defense X-AXIS: Run Play Success rate Defense (bottom left corner where you want to be)

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Y-AXIS: Pass Play Explosives Defense X-AXIS: Pass play success rate Defense
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I still have no idea why VTech threw the ball (incomplete) on first down on their second to last drive of the game. They had run on us the whole game, and on their prior drive (TD) they were killing us in the run game too. Had the long TD called back for holding, and Drones misread an RPO later on in that drive - had he handed it off the RB was gone up the middle for a long TD.

You're right about late in the Cal game, but we were selling out against the run in the 4th quarter with 3 linebackers on the field plus a safety in the box.

We've been so bad defending the pass in ACC play that teams haven't tried to run the ball down our throats like VT had success doing. Our interior run defense has been a big concern of mine since that game, especially with Mesidor at DT.
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**** this is crazy, hopefully we can find some middle ground because giving up that much explosives could keep teams in games unnecessarily like we have saw
 
Its pretty simple the offenses we have faced are bad and they simply flame out in the 2nd half. Also helps that our offense goes nuclear and teams are playing catch up
 
hurricaneman said:
Against ACC opponents:

Quarter 1: 28 points
Quarter 2: 62 points
Quarter 3: 24 points
Quarter 4: 34 points

This removes the pick 6 from Cam against Cal and the kickoff return against Louisville. You could make an argument to reduce 7 from the 4th quarter when FSU scored in garbage time against the second team.

Guidry needs to figure out the second quarter. If we normalized it to the rest we'd be gaining a TD a game. That's the difference between giving up 27 ppg against ACC teams and 20 ppg. Here's the points given up by the defense, by team, in quarters 1, 3, and 4:

VT: 17
Cal: 14
Louisville: 21
FSU: 7
Duke: 17

This is not great but if the second quarter looked like these I'd feel WAY better about this team.
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I think the title of this thread is spot on. Our defense is weird. We play a large portion of our games at a very adequate level. Not incredible but solid and more than good enough to win with our offense. But we have weird portions where we can’t stop anything and basic plays gash us for huge gains. I’m sure some things could get shored up with some coverage changes and I don’t think our personnel is THAT bad. Teams with lesser players get better results than us all the time. I get that our DBs aren’t awesome but we shouldn’t consistently get roasted by mediocre quarterbacks
 
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“You have to stay calm. We’re at war, and in war there are going to be casualties. There are going to be things that you haven’t expected, things that go wrong that you work on a lot, but you just reiterate to them go back to your rules, to your techniques, fundamentals, calm it down and then it starts clicking. There’s no magic to it, you just have to keep working through it. Sometimes it’s a little psychological, you know? It really is.”

Lance Guidry, talking about the confusion his defense shows on some plays
 
Hoyacane1620 said:
“You have to stay calm. We’re at war, and in war there are going to be casualties. There are going to be things that you haven’t expected, things that go wrong that you work on a lot, but you just reiterate to them go back to your rules, to your techniques, fundamentals, calm it down and then it starts clicking. There’s no magic to it, you just have to keep working through it. Sometimes it’s a little psychological, you know? It really is.”

Lance Guidry, talking about the confusion his defense shows on some plays
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he really said this? this dude doesn't have a single answer. hes just not a p4 DC.
 
DTP said:
I think the title of this thread is spot on. Our defense is weird. We play a large portion of our games at a very adequate level. Not incredible but solid and more than good enough to win with our offense. But we have weird portions where we can’t stop anything and basic plays gash us for huge gains. I’m sure some things could get shored up with some coverage changes and I don’t think our personnel is THAT bad. Teams with lesser players get better results than us all the time. I get that our DBs aren’t awesome but we shouldn’t consistently get roasted by mediocre quarterbacks
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there is only one good offense that we've played the entire season.
 
flips said:
We've been so bad defending the pass in ACC play that teams haven't tried to run the ball down our throats like VT had success doing. Our interior run defense has been a big concern of mine since that game, especially with Mesidor at DT.
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Not really the case. Virginia Tech mauled us with the outside run game, not in between the tackles. Also Louisville had some success running but had to abandon the run to keep up with our offense. They didn’t have a choice. Cal averaged 2.9 yards per carry.. Duke averaged 3.0. FSU averaged 4.8 but that’s mostly because they had a 40 yard run on a botched quarterback sneak. Otherwise they would have gotten 3.4 yards per carry.

Ironically, the one game we couldn’t stop the run was our best defensive performance against the pass in conference play (not counting FSU’s garbage quarterbacks). Drones threw the ball 33 times but only averaged 5.5 yards per attempt.
 
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E1k said:
**** this is crazy, hopefully we can find some middle ground because giving up that much explosives could keep teams in games unnecessarily like we have saw
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that first duke td drive was the worst defense ive ever seen. even Doritos D put up more resistance than that
 
hoops156 said:
there is only one good offense that we've played the entire season.
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Depends what your definition of “good offense” is. Cal and Duke are below average. They are 80 and 81 in scoring offense so bad but not FSU bad. . Louisville and VT both score over 30 a game so they’re better than average.

My point being is that we find ourselves in shootouts with teams almost every week but we’ve given up over 400 yards only twice and one of them was Duke who had 405.

Being 19th in total defense but 52nd in scoring defense is very weird. Teams aren’t moving the ball tremendously well but they somehow manage to score at a ver high rate
 
DTP said:
Depends what your definition of “good offense” is. Cal and Duke are below average. They are 80 and 81 in scoring offense so bad but not FSU bad. . Louisville and VT both score over 30 a game so they’re better than average.

My point being is that we find ourselves in shootouts with teams almost every week but we’ve given up over 400 yards only twice and one of them was Duke who had 405.

Being 19th in total defense but 52nd in scoring defense is very weird. Teams aren’t moving the ball tremendously well but they somehow manage to score at a ver high rate
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To add to this, there have been points scored against us that don't fall on our defense. In several games, there have been turnovers that put the opponent in scoring range.

USF got their only TD after starting inside our 30 from an Int. VT scored twice after turnovers that flipped the field. Cal got 7 from a pick 6, Louisville had a kickoff return for a TD and they scored when Fletcher fumbled in our territory. Both Louisville and fsu scored meaningless TD's under a minute when the game was basically secure.

The Duke game was concerning because they drove the length of the field on their scoring drives.
 
DTP said:
I think the title of this thread is spot on. Our defense is weird. We play a large portion of our games at a very adequate level. Not incredible but solid and more than good enough to win with our offense. But we have weird portions where we can’t stop anything and basic plays gash us for huge gains. I’m sure some things could get shored up with some coverage changes and I don’t think our personnel is THAT bad. Teams with lesser players get better results than us all the time. I get that our DBs aren’t awesome but we shouldn’t consistently get roasted by mediocre quarterbacks
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Here’s a deeper philosophical question that I’ll pose to you, and one I’ve been thinking about a lot recently: When you have an offense that’s on the level of explosivenesses like this Miami team, or 2019 LSU, is it even possible to have an elite, top ten caliber of a defense? #1 you’re scoring so fast that the defense doesn’t have a lot of time to catch their breath #2 and I think this is the bigger point, when you have an offense that’s this doggone explosive isn’t it just human nature to relax, take your foot off the gas a bit, and relalize no matter what we do the offense will just bail us out? So, while some of it can be rationally explained, I do think there is some of that over-confidence in Cam and the offense seeping into the heads of some of our defensive guys.
 
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DoctorKrazey said:
Here’s a deeper philosophical question that I’ll pose to you, and one I’ve been thinking about a lot recently: When you have an offense that’s on the level of explosivenesses like this Miami team, or 2019 LSU, is it even possible to have an elite, top ten caliber of a defense? #1 you’re scoring so fast that the defense doesn’t have a lot of time to catch their breath #2 and I think this is the bigger point, when you have an offense that’s this doggone explosive isn’t it just human nature to relax, take your foot off the gas a bit, and relalize no matter what we do the offense will just bail us out? So, while some of it can be rationally explained, I do think there is some of that over-confidence in Cam and the offense seeping into the heads of some of our defensive guys.
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this is close to LSU 2023 not LSU 2019 which had a much better defense than ours and played better offenses (Tuas bama, Pitts Trask UF)
 
DoctorKrazey said:
Here’s a deeper philosophical question that I’ll pose to you, and one I’ve been thinking about a lot recently: When you have an offense that’s on the level of explosivenesses like this Miami team, or 2019 LSU, is it even possible to have an elite, top ten caliber of a defense? #1 you’re scoring so fast that the defense doesn’t have a lot of time to catch their breath #2 and I think this is the bigger point, when you have an offense that’s this doggone explosive isn’t it just human nature to relax, take your foot off the gas a bit, and relalize no matter what we do the offense will just bail us out? So, while some of it can be rationally explained, I do think there is some of that over-confidence in Cam and the offense seeping into the heads of some of our defensive guys.
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This topic has come up a few time when we talk about modern offenses. You have to throw traditional metrics of what a “good defense” is out the window in the modern game. It’s still the defenses job to get stops. The opposition may get a few more possessions but if the defense is still getting stops on 70% of the drives, you’re going to be doing just fine. The time of possession thing is misleading too because while we do score a lot and often quickly, we are 6th in the nation in time of possession. You control the clock by getting first downs, not by playing at a snail’s pace. Our defense gets PLENTY of time off between possessions.

Your second point is interesting. I’m sure the defense probably gets a little too nonchalant because they trust that the offense will get those points right back. How do you combat that?
 
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DTP said:
Not really the case. Virginia Tech mauled us with the outside run game, not in between the tackles. Also Louisville had some success running but had to abandon the run to keep up with our offense. They didn’t have a choice. Cal averaged 2.9 yards per carry.. Duke averaged 3.0. FSU averaged 4.8 but that’s mostly because they had a 40 yard run on a botched quarterback sneak. Otherwise they would have gotten 3.4 yards per carry.

Ironically, the one game we couldn’t stop the run was our best defensive performance against the pass in conference play (not counting FSU’s garbage quarterbacks). Drones threw the ball 33 times but only averaged 5.5 yards per attempt.
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Last part is why TrumpyCane doesn't want Drones next year, he's not a good passer at all
 
When you have an offense that’s on the level of explosivenesses like this Miami team, or 2019 LSU, is it even possible to have an elite, top ten caliber of a defense?
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Kiko getting beat in man to man coverage is something you live with. Guys completely blowing their assignments 9 games into the season has nothing to do with the offense.
 
When was the last time you felt like we recognized a play and beat the offense to the spot? When was the last time we had a Bandy like play where DB read/recognized a play and jumped for INT( Mesh at USF).

Why are we constantly outflanked? Duke ran a bunch formation play on 3rd and 4, and we sent went on guy to defend against 3 and they easily picked up the 1st.(Play where Kiko punched the guy)
 
What im having trouble understanding is. CIS has come up with several “patch” solutions over past 3-4weeks theoretically. And i would never doubt the wisdom of the psychos on this board, but how the **** has the D minds of jason taylor, Nichols, guidry, DB coach, etc not figured out the patch fix?!?!
 
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