NFL: Seantrel Dominant in 1-on-1 but doesn't know Football!

[hollyhood27]

Why does it matter if he doesn't know the formations? (95% of the time it doesn't affect the OL). Especially for tempo teams.

 

[gfer1988]

People said the same about orlando franklin and he ended up pretty **** good for the broncos.there has long been a huge issue with not teaching our players technique. you can tell from the interviews of coaches that they are putting more emphasis on being bigger and physically dominant then improving the skill set of guys. Donofrio even stated that he wasn't going to teach his dlinemen any other techniques because he wanted to focus on mastering one technique. look at stephen morris as another example of this year's draft. they basically allowed him to be a one-read quarterback. the only guys that develop their game at UM are those that are crazy self-motivated which believe it or not is unusual of college football players. we basically allow our guys to think they can really on physical gifts instead of working on their technique to improve. If Seantrel doesn't get in legal trouble in the NFL, look for him to be a hall of famed

We have almost an entire staff of recruiters. It's not a secret that, for some time now, our guys are simply behind the curve when it comes to the technical aspect of football.

However, I'm not sure Seantrel is a good example of this issue. He's not exactly the most diligent player or student of the game. If he wants to ride the wave now as yet another excuse, I think that shows more about him than it reveals about the way our program is structured.

 

[OldhamA]

People said the same about orlando franklin and he ended up pretty **** good for the broncos.there has long been a huge issue with not teaching our players technique. you can tell from the interviews of coaches that they are putting more emphasis on being bigger and physically dominant then improving the skill set of guys. Donofrio even stated that he wasn't going to teach his dlinemen any other techniques because he wanted to focus on mastering one technique. look at stephen morris as another example of this year's draft. they basically allowed him to be a one-read quarterback. the only guys that develop their game at UM are those that are crazy self-motivated which believe it or not is unusual of college football players. we basically allow our guys to think they can really on physical gifts instead of working on their technique to improve. If Seantrel doesn't get in legal trouble in the NFL, look for him to be a hall of famed

We have almost an entire staff of recruiters. It's not a secret that, for some time now, our guys are simply behind the curve when it comes to the technical aspect of football.

However, I'm not sure Seantrel is a good example of this issue. He's not exactly the most diligent player or student of the game. If he wants to ride the wave now as yet another excuse, I think that shows more about him than it reveals about the way our program is structured.

This is evidently not true. Most of the players Golden has brought in have improved technically.

Henderson just seems like a kid that either has a learning disability or simply isn't interested. Morris just doesn't have it.

 

[Bennubird]

Actually, I think cane2 and Lu are both correct. I think our guys are not technicians of the game and that they don't develop to the extent that they should while playing for us, but Seantrel is not a good example because he had maturity issues in addition to other things like injuries that were beyond his control.

Our OL struggles have persisted for a long time now. Not sure who said it last year, but the quote was something to the effect that the parts do not equal the whole. I totally agree with that. I love Kehoe as a Cane, but I honestly believe we could get more production out of our offensive line with better coaching. Canes that throw out the fact that he has a lot of rings, which is not deniable and that I in fact applaud, seem however to discount or perhaps overlook the contributions to those titles of the other units.

 

[LuCane]

So let's play the game. Sam shields didn't know how to watch film after one year of playing defense even tho he's been in the program for four years. Blame previous regime.

Henderson doesn't know formations after 3 years under current regime. Blame the player.


See the pattern.

Interesting.

The ****? Sam Shields didn't know how to watch film because he was bounced around positions - not necessarily his choice. Henderson doesn't know formations despite playing the same Tackle position for 4 years. Also, while he may be singing a different tune now because it's $ time, he's on record as someone who wasn't putting everything into his craft. And, by everything, let's not even get into the facts. That wouldn't be helpful to Seantrel.

This is nonsense.

Shields didn't bounce around. He finally switched his last year after years of trying to get him to convert. I honestly think the staff did a great job his last year. They didn't overload him and let him go out there and showcase his talent. If they would have I believe he would have been thinking to much and hesitant like our current defense.

And lets not act like Sam was putting in his all just like Seantrel. We all saw his last two years was when he finally got his act together. Stared on special teams his junior year and then did a good job for us at db is senior year.

But either way I just wanted to show the pattern of where blame is placed. I believe this situations are identical. Two players who didn't put in their all here. Difference is one cleaned his act up and played a new position is senior year.

I didn't write "bounce around" to mean anything other than he played his final position for merely one year at the end of his time in College. Shields should have been moved earlier, but we couldn't do that because of roster mismanagement of the WR position. At one point during his time here, we had Brian Monroe, our Punter, taking WR snaps. These are pretty important factual pieces to lay out before comparing the situations, I think.

 

[LuCane]

Why does it matter if he doesn't know the formations? (95% of the time it doesn't affect the OL). Especially for tempo teams.

I take it to mean that he doesn't know how to prepare to act on what he sees.

 

[gfer1988]

want a list of guys that either never improved much or regressed over time from both a statistical or skill set point of view?

seantrel, Chickillo, jalen grumble, curtis porter, stephen morris, eduardo clements, linder, shane mcdermott, malcom bunche, rayshawn scott, asante cleveland, shay on green, olson pierre, kelvin cain, jelani hamilton, dwayne hoilett, raphael kirby, earl moore, corey king, luther robinson. **** i might even say that denzel perryman looked much more promising as a freshmen. if you actually do your research quite a few of the guys i mentioned were 4 star athletes. i believe grimble was even listed a a 5 star by one site as well as chickillo. it appears as if the only position unit that seems to improve is our defensive backs which is saying a lot considering we had kacy rodgers and high smith to work with. i love our fan base. we say we don't get all the four star and five star guys and complain but when we have and they don't work out, it's because we don't trust the star system lol. but you're right about seantrel, he has time and time again displayed immaturity and a lack of motivation. just think it's odd how so many of our star recruits have not panned out in comparison to other respectable college football programs.

People said the same about orlando franklin and he ended up pretty **** good for the broncos.there has long been a huge issue with not teaching our players technique. you can tell from the interviews of coaches that they are putting more emphasis on being bigger and physically dominant then improving the skill set of guys. Donofrio even stated that he wasn't going to teach his dlinemen any other techniques because he wanted to focus on mastering one technique. look at stephen morris as another example of this year's draft. they basically allowed him to be a one-read quarterback. the only guys that develop their game at UM are those that are crazy self-motivated which believe it or not is unusual of college football players. we basically allow our guys to think they can really on physical gifts instead of working on their technique to improve. If Seantrel doesn't get in legal trouble in the NFL, look for him to be a hall of famed

We have almost an entire staff of recruiters. It's not a secret that, for some time now, our guys are simply behind the curve when it comes to the technical aspect of football.

However, I'm not sure Seantrel is a good example of this issue. He's not exactly the most diligent player or student of the game. If he wants to ride the wave now as yet another excuse, I think that shows more about him than it reveals about the way our program is structured.

This is evidently not true. Most of the players Golden has brought in have improved technically.

Henderson just seems like a kid that either has a learning disability or simply isn't interested. Morris just doesn't have it.

 

[Pingozzi]

It's not the school it's the student. I bet you Linder does not have this problem. Although Art could be a better teacher he is a good teacher and Stoutland has a reputation for being an excellent coach.

 

[Da_U_85]

So let's play the game. Sam shields didn't know how to watch film after one year of playing defense even tho he's been in the program for four years. Blame previous regime.

Henderson doesn't know formations after 3 years under current regime. Blame the player.


See the pattern.

Interesting.

The ****? Sam Shields didn't know how to watch film because he was bounced around positions - not necessarily his choice. Henderson doesn't know formations despite playing the same Tackle position for 4 years. Also, while he may be singing a different tune now because it's $ time, he's on record as someone who wasn't putting everything into his craft. And, by everything, let's not even get into the facts. That wouldn't be helpful to Seantrel.

This is nonsense.

Shields didn't bounce around. He finally switched his last year after years of trying to get him to convert. I honestly think the staff did a great job his last year. They didn't overload him and let him go out there and showcase his talent. If they would have I believe he would have been thinking to much and hesitant like our current defense.

And lets not act like Sam was putting in his all just like Seantrel. We all saw his last two years was when he finally got his act together. Stared on special teams his junior year and then did a good job for us at db is senior year.

But either way I just wanted to show the pattern of where blame is placed. I believe this situations are identical. Two players who didn't put in their all here. Difference is one cleaned his act up and played a new position is senior year.

I didn't write "bounce around" to mean anything other than he played his final position for merely one year at the end of his time in College. Shields should have been moved earlier, but we couldn't do that because of roster mismanagement of the WR position. At one point during his time here, we had Brian Monroe, our Punter, taking WR snaps. These are pretty important factual pieces to lay out before comparing the situations, I think.

Actually shields didn't move earlier because of "roster mismanagement". He didn't move because he refused. He finally listen to Shannon is last year.


This is really all beside the point. I made this to point out the hypocrisy on these boards.

So much was made about shields not being able to study film in one year at a position but we have excuses for coaches on why a player can't give formations while here for 3 years.

 

[LuCane]

Interesting.

The ****? Sam Shields didn't know how to watch film because he was bounced around positions - not necessarily his choice. Henderson doesn't know formations despite playing the same Tackle position for 4 years. Also, while he may be singing a different tune now because it's $ time, he's on record as someone who wasn't putting everything into his craft. And, by everything, let's not even get into the facts. That wouldn't be helpful to Seantrel.

This is nonsense.

Shields didn't bounce around. He finally switched his last year after years of trying to get him to convert. I honestly think the staff did a great job his last year. They didn't overload him and let him go out there and showcase his talent. If they would have I believe he would have been thinking to much and hesitant like our current defense.

And lets not act like Sam was putting in his all just like Seantrel. We all saw his last two years was when he finally got his act together. Stared on special teams his junior year and then did a good job for us at db is senior year.

But either way I just wanted to show the pattern of where blame is placed. I believe this situations are identical. Two players who didn't put in their all here. Difference is one cleaned his act up and played a new position is senior year.

I didn't write "bounce around" to mean anything other than he played his final position for merely one year at the end of his time in College. Shields should have been moved earlier, but we couldn't do that because of roster mismanagement of the WR position. At one point during his time here, we had Brian Monroe, our Punter, taking WR snaps. These are pretty important factual pieces to lay out before comparing the situations, I think.

Actually shields didn't move earlier because of "roster mismanagement". He didn't move because he refused. He finally listen to Shannon is last year.


This is really all beside the point. I made this to point out the hypocrisy on these boards.

So much was made about shields not being able to study film in one year at a position but we have excuses for coaches on why a player can't give formations while here for 3 years.

Whether or not he refused (he did want to be a WR early on), he couldn't have been moved after his Frosh season regardless. We didn't have the numbers. I'll stop going back and forth with you as to why Sam Shields was kept at WR.

And, my point was really that the situations are different, so using this as an example of the hypocrisy you see looks flawed.

 

[Canesbball]

linder isn't exactly a stud. i mean he is good but lets be real, he has gotten blown up a few times. Flowers is the best nfl prospect we have.

Flowers had Anton of potential but didn't play like a future first rounder last year.

This. I don't know how everyone views Flowers as a sure fire top 2 round pick.

 

[Leland]

People said the same about orlando franklin and he ended up pretty **** good for the broncos.there has long been a huge issue with not teaching our players technique. you can tell from the interviews of coaches that they are putting more emphasis on being bigger and physically dominant then improving the skill set of guys. Donofrio even stated that he wasn't going to teach his dlinemen any other techniques because he wanted to focus on mastering one technique. look at stephen morris as another example of this year's draft. they basically allowed him to be a one-read quarterback. the only guys that develop their game at UM are those that are crazy self-motivated which believe it or not is unusual of college football players. we basically allow our guys to think they can really on physical gifts instead of working on their technique to improve. If Seantrel doesn't get in legal trouble in the NFL, look for him to be a hall of famed

We have almost an entire staff of recruiters. It's not a secret that, for some time now, our guys are simply behind the curve when it comes to the technical aspect of football.

However, I'm not sure Seantrel is a good example of this issue. He's not exactly the most diligent player or student of the game. If he wants to ride the wave now as yet another excuse, I think that shows more about him than it reveals about the way our program is structured.

 

[LuCane]

linder isn't exactly a stud. i mean he is good but lets be real, he has gotten blown up a few times. Flowers is the best nfl prospect we have.

Flowers had Anton of potential but didn't play like a future first rounder last year.

This. I don't know how everyone views Flowers as a sure fire top 2 round pick.

I'm willing to take a bet. Let me know if you're in.

 

[kendallcanes]

2013: 6 Tackles taken in first two rounds
2012: 6 Tackles taken in first two rounds
2011: 7 Tackles taken in first two rounds
2010: 6 Tackles taken in first two rounds

Would you consider Flowers a top 6 tackle in all of college football?

 

[LuCane]

2013: 6 Tackles taken in first two rounds
2012: 6 Tackles taken in first two rounds
2011: 7 Tackles taken in first two rounds
2010: 6 Tackles taken in first two rounds

Would you consider Flowers a top 6 tackle in all of college football?

I believe he'll be a top 6 Tackle prospect, yes. Do you disagree?

 

[kendallcanes]

6'6 315lbs. Starter since Freshman year. Great feet, solid technique, natural athlete... That's a solid prospect.

His resume so far is pretty good, but I don't think he is a top 6 tackle in all of college football.

 

[epsilon06]

Flower's ranking in his class

http://nfldraftblitz.com/rankings-hssr.html

 

[LuCane]

6'6 315lbs. Starter since Freshman year. Great feet, solid technique, natural athlete... That's a solid prospect.

His resume so far is pretty good, but I don't think he is a top 6 tackle in all of college football.

He doesn't necessarily have to be one next year, but he might become one anyway. He's a smart, thoughtful dude. I suspect he'll do the draft advisory and see his projection. From what I've read around, he's already in the Top 10 Tackles for the 2016 draft. Of those 10, only 3 are his recruiting year (the rest are redshirts). I believe he has as much potential as any of the players in there with the obvious argument being Andrus Peat. If Flowers were down blocking and in a power run game ala Stanford (they're also winning), I bet he'd get more notoriety. I imagine that was part of the thinking from R. Gibbons' family.

In effect, the mixing of stretch/zone plays and power running that Flowers is doing here might make him less productive as a college player, but will catch some scout's eye for the NFL.

 

[TP801]

2013: 6 Tackles taken in first two rounds
2012: 6 Tackles taken in first two rounds
2011: 7 Tackles taken in first two rounds
2010: 6 Tackles taken in first two rounds

Would you consider Flowers a top 6 tackle in all of college football?

Barring injury.....No doubt. He really is THAT good. Was a true sophomore starting this year.

Andrus Peat(Bloodlines)-Stanford
Ereck Flowers-Miami
SimonnGoines-UCLA
Josh Garnett-Stanford
Scott quesenberry-UCLA
Caleb Bennenoch-UCLA
Germain Ifeidi-TAMU
Kyle Bosch-Michigan
Pat Miller-Auburn

 

[DMoney]

But i am NOT a fan of Kehoe the coach. I have been underwhelmed with how his lines performed and with their fundamentals. I thought our Oline got MUCH better when Stoutland came in and changed things. How well respected was Stoutland? He went to Bama and then the NFL.

Stoutland was a great recruiter, but his lines were pretty bad. Miami was 98th, 90th and 95th in sack percentage from 2007-2009.

That said, you raise legitimate concerns in your post. I can't figure out Kehoe. Some people don't respect him and some people swear by him. Louisville was a disaster, but the OL has been very good in pass protection the past two years. Statistically better than Alabama. The power running game has been a struggle, though. Is it Kehoe, personnel, offensive coordinator? Probably a little bit of all three.

One thing Kehoe doesn't get enough credit for is his development of the bottom of the roster. Jeremy Lewis went from the scout team to an NFL training camp. Wheeler will get a shot in an NFL camp. Ben Jones was playing really good football before he went down. These are guys who Kehoe has developed. He's also put more guys in the NFL than all but a few college line coaches.