Insight into $EC bag system

[canesproponent]

No but what is different are the players. Adidas funneling money to certain recruits to play for schools sponsored by them in an attempt to procure that person signing with said company down the line. The IRS doesn't care if Nassir Little goes to Miami or UNC, they care about the bottom line and Adidas is a big payday for them.

Where in College you have a booster (or potentially a "network" of boosters), maybe worth a few million, giving a few k to a select # of recruits a year. Instead of the IRS suing one huge billion dollar company in Adidas and claiming conspiracy, they would have to sue each and every booster claiming some type of tax issue and the costs would likely outweigh the returns. You could try to drag the schools into it but unless you can show some type of connection (high burden), it will just be a "rogue booster" and I cant say I disagree. If I decide to go drop a bag for a 2020 5* kid today with Miami having no knowledge and whether or not that kid goes to Miami, how can Miami be liable?

I also don't agree that paying players would result in bags not being thrown around.... Think of it in a real life scenario, would I take 100k to work in miami and be close to my family for 3-4 years, or would I take the same 100k salary, with a 100k "bonus" and live in bama for 3-4 years?

My only suggestion to fix it would be to tweak the finance laws so if these boosters or "foundations" get caught the punishment is severe and would hopefully deter them from continuing the practice.

I met the Head of the IRS' West Coast practice at a dinner and asked him why they did not pursue the SEC. He knew everything about "the Foundations", but said that there were ~22 US Senators that would block ANY investigation into these Foundations. The IRS was "able to attack basketball because the only nationally elected officials that cared were from Kentucky." He also said that "Kentucky basketball is impermeable and it is impossible to identify 'the ultimate location of the bags' ". Texas, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State also possess Foundations and would decimate any investigation into recruiting payments.

The SEC would be an IDEAL target for the IRS because the fraud comprises "at least $5M in payments per school, sans Vanderbilt, and over 20-years for some of these schools." It also includes all Southwestern schools (Pickens, etc...), the SEC and the Big 10. They need the revenue but lack political capital to attack. They are HIGHLY AWARE of the problem.

 

[pumbaa]

Reggie Bush vacated his Heisman because it was proven he took money from an agent. His issues had nothing to do with his high school recruitment.

The guys in college with the most cash are the guys who are getting it from agents.

Y’all are merging the 2. It’s not the same.

Just like DJ Fluker and the 5 kids they caught with the agent. Nothing happened to any of the schools obviously(SEC)

 

[Cribby]

Y'all did watch the smu documentary ? You know why they started cheating ? Everyone in the big 12 was spending close to the millions on recruiting. They were just trying to compete.

There's way more money in CFB now, and it's bigger than it's ever been. Some of you can't be this slow.

Like I said, I know for a fact this kids are getting six figures , with ease.

One of my best friends got 25,000 in the late 90's lol.

Living around Gainesville my entire life I know bull gators, and they would brag about the kids that were bought, and who they outbid. Like I mentioned earlier Percy was bought for six figures , and that was over a decade ago.

 

[Cookie917]

I met the Head of the IRS' West Coast practice at a dinner and asked him why they did not pursue the SEC. He knew everything about "the Foundations", but said that there were ~22 US Senators that would block ANY investigation into these Foundations. The IRS was "able to attack basketball because the only nationally elected officials that cared were from Kentucky." He also said that "Kentucky basketball is impermeable and it is impossible to identify 'the ultimate location of the bags' ". Texas, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State also possess Foundations and would decimate any investigation into recruiting payments.

The SEC would be an IDEAL target for the IRS because the fraud comprises "at least $5M in payments per school, sans Vanderbilt, and over 20-years for some of these schools." It also includes all Southwestern schools (Pickens, etc...), the SEC and the Big 10. They need the revenue but lack political capital to attack. They are HIGHLY AWARE of the problem.

I mean anyone with a pulse should be aware of the problem, where you lost me is "The SEC would be an IDEAL target for the IRS because the fraud comprises..." What would the SEC have to do with boosters giving players money? And when you say fraud are you talking about common law fraud? Wire Fraud? Mail Fraud? I just don't see the fraudulent aspect of it.

 

[gabednconfused]

all for starting a trust fund to do the same... ****it

 

[canesproponent]

I mean anyone with a pulse should be aware of the problem, where you lost me is "The SEC would be an IDEAL target for the IRS because the fraud comprises..." What would the SEC have to do with boosters giving players money? And when you say fraud are you talking about common law fraud? Wire Fraud? Mail Fraud? I just don't see the fraudulent aspect of it.

Well................... Any gift over $14,000 IS TAXABLE. We can start there. I know that Michel received $200,000, so that instance alone is $186,000 in "unreported gift income". If you are going to act like a lawyer show some common sense.

There are a MYRIAD of offenses they could utilize. You cannot GIVE someone hundreds of thousands of dollars and NOT pay tax on it. If you want a list of potential offenses, go to the FBI NCAA basketball filing.

Did you NOT read the "22-senators will oppose said investigation." They cannot attack the SEC or the Big 12 because they will have an enumerable number of politicians at the national level impairing the investigation.

Some day, this will end. Most illicit activity in the US eventually ends. Some reporter will write a book, LSU will file for bankruptcy but the football team will still be flush, millenials will refuse to take the place of Boomer Boosters, etc... Some of these Foundations have been running for 20+ years, they cannot abolish them easily.....

 

[Tit-e-skr]

No but what is different are the players. Adidas funneling money to certain recruits to play for schools sponsored by them in an attempt to procure that person signing with said company down the line. The IRS doesn't care if Nassir Little goes to Miami or UNC, they care about the bottom line and Adidas is a big payday for them.

Where in College you have a booster (or potentially a "network" of boosters), maybe worth a few million, giving a few k to a select # of recruits a year. Instead of the IRS suing one huge billion dollar company in Adidas and claiming conspiracy, they would have to sue each and every booster claiming some type of tax issue and the costs would likely outweigh the returns. You could try to drag the schools into it but unless you can show some type of connection (high burden), it will just be a "rogue booster" and I cant say I disagree. If I decide to go drop a bag for a 2020 5* kid today with Miami having no knowledge and whether or not that kid goes to Miami, how can Miami be liable?

I also don't agree that paying players would result in bags not being thrown around.... Think of it in a real life scenario, would I take 100k to work in miami and be close to my family for 3-4 years, or would I take the same 100k salary, with a 100k "bonus" and live in bama for 3-4 years?

My only suggestion to fix it would be to tweak the finance laws so if these boosters or "foundations" get caught the punishment is severe and would hopefully deter them from continuing the practice.

That should go full circle and involve the parents. If you really want to try and get it to stop then you need to find a way to criminally hold the parents responsible as well.

 

[canesproponent]

That should go full circle and involve the parents. If you really want to try and get it to stop then you need to find a way to criminally hold the parents responsible as well.

If the Senators did not support the Foundations so stoutly, they would have chosen football instead of basketball.

You need to live in a truly "Southern" city to understand how pivotal these teams are to the Southern US GDP.

The State of Louisiana can no longer provide the requisite funds to LSU and they are functioning on stop-gap measures. When interest rates rise, LSU is going to brutally cut its academic departments and football will continue to possess ample funding. Some enterprising reporters may uncover some evidence.

Look UNC is an elite school and the cheating at that institution is RAMPANT. They have honors students writing papers for the basketball team. They CAUGHT UNC. Twice....... Nothing happened. Certain schools get a pass. UM's administration cares more about academic and image than football. It is what it is.

 

[Cookie917]

Well................... Any gift over $14,000 IS TAXABLE. We can start there. I know that Michel received $200,000, so that instance alone is $186,000 in "unreported gift income". If you are going to act like a lawyer show some common sense.

There are a MYRIAD of offenses they could utilize. You cannot GIVE someone hundreds of thousands of dollars and NOT pay tax on it. If you want a list of potential offenses, go to the FBI NCAA basketball filing.

Did you NOT read the "22-senators will oppose said investigation." They cannot attack the SEC or the Big 12 because they will have an enumerable number of politicians at the national level impairing the investigation.

Some day, this will end. Most illicit activity in the US eventually ends. Some reporter will write a book, LSU will file for bankruptcy but the football team will still be flush, millenials will refuse to take the place of Boomer Boosters, etc... Some of these Foundations have been running for 20+ years, they cannot abolish them easily.....

hahaha ok I asked a simple, genuine question but because you want to act like a smart a$$ lets start there..... Any gift over 14k is taxable... correct, so Sony Michel received 186k in "unreported gift income" so would that not make Michel's family liable and NOT the SEC which was my point... the SEC did not get 200k. Most of these kids families have very little tax liability as it is and again where is the fraud? The Michels not declaring the gift as income on their taxes? Again that is not the SEC.

As to your second point, the FBI basketball investigation is apples to oranges. Adidas was funneling kids to go to a certain to school so they would have a better chance of signing the kid once in the NBA. Once a majority of these kids leave football, no booster is expecting to get his $ back, or sign the kid to a shoe deal. Also, I did not see many recruits families wound up in that investigation and being charged with "fraud" for not reporting their extra gift income. The only thing in common is recruits getting paid to go to a school which is where your simpleton analysis ended.

I did read the "22 senators will oppose" and so what? There are 100 senators last I checked. No doubt some individuals can "impair" an investigation but to think they can shut it down all together is nonsense and to think the head of the West Coast IRS would simply disclose this to you at dinner is also nonsense.

Lastly, yeah someday it probably will end, just like someday the sun might burn out. Both have high probability of occurring not in my lifetime.

 

[Tit-e-skr]

I met the Head of the IRS' West Coast practice at a dinner and asked him why they did not pursue the SEC. He knew everything about "the Foundations", but said that there were ~22 US Senators that would block ANY investigation into these Foundations. The IRS was "able to attack basketball because the only nationally elected officials that cared were from Kentucky." He also said that "Kentucky basketball is impermeable and it is impossible to identify 'the ultimate location of the bags' ". Texas, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State also possess Foundations and would decimate any investigation into recruiting payments.

The SEC would be an IDEAL target for the IRS because the fraud comprises "at least $5M in payments per school, sans Vanderbilt, and over 20-years for some of these schools." It also includes all Southwestern schools (Pickens, etc...), the SEC and the Big 10. They need the revenue but lack political capital to attack. They are HIGHLY AWARE of the problem.

If the Senators did not support the Foundations so stoutly, they would have chosen football instead of basketball.

You need to live in a truly "Southern" city to understand how pivotal these teams are to the Southern US GDP.

The State of Louisiana can no longer provide the requisite funds to LSU and they are functioning on stop-gap measures. When interest rates rise, LSU is going to brutally cut its academic departments and football will continue to possess ample funding. Some enterprising reporters may uncover some evidence.

Look UNC is an elite school and the cheating at that institution is RAMPANT. They have honors students writing papers for the basketball team. They CAUGHT UNC. Twice....... Nothing happened. Certain schools get a pass. UM's administration cares more about academic and image than football. It is what it is.

Ok, but if you want to put a dent in this sht then you need to hold everybody criminally responsible for the payouts. It would be need to be a federal statute because many of the states wouldn't dare pass a law like that.

 

[Tit-e-skr]

hahaha ok I asked a simple, genuine question but because you want to act like a smart a$$ lets start there..... Any gift over 14k is taxable... correct, so Sony Michel received 186k in "unreported gift income" so would that not make Michel's family liable and NOT the SEC which was my point... the SEC did not get 200k. Most of these kids families have very little tax liability as it is and again where is the fraud? The Michels not declaring the gift as income on their taxes? Again that is not the SEC.

As to your second point, the FBI basketball investigation is apples to oranges. Adidas was funneling kids to go to a certain to school so they would have a better chance of signing the kid once in the NBA. Once a majority of these kids leave football, no booster is expecting to get his $ back, or sign the kid to a shoe deal. Also, I did not see many recruits families wound up in that investigation and being charged with "fraud" for not reporting their extra gift income. The only thing in common is recruits getting paid to go to a school which is where your simpleton analysis ended.

I did read the "22 senators will oppose" and so what? There are 100 senators last I checked. No doubt some individuals can "impair" an investigation but to think they can shut it down all together is nonsense and to think the head of the West Coast IRS would simply disclose this to you at dinner is also nonsense.

Lastly, yeah someday it probably will end, just like someday the sun might burn out. Both have high probability of occurring not in my lifetime.

Thank you. I wondered if Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny were there too. No way this convo went down the way it was laid out, if at all.

 

[Cookie917]

Thank you. I wondered if Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny were there too. No way this convo went down the way it was laid out, if at all.

Precisely... and I agree with you on holding parents responsible. I could see how that might be a potential PR nightmare if for example the University of Alabama is able to work some type of slap on the wrist settlement yet some lower-income recruit's parents get seriously tagged but these "handlers" are just as much of the problem.

 

[bbcane]

They are selective about the bags. Lower income/ single parent families are usually the prime candidate(this is from top 25 coach). For example the Patrick surtains and mr quartermans of the world are less likely to be approached with bags.

 

[canesproponent]

hahaha ok I asked a simple, genuine question but because you want to act like a smart a$$ lets start there..... Any gift over 14k is taxable... correct, so Sony Michel received 186k in "unreported gift income" so would that not make Michel's family liable and NOT the SEC which was my point... the SEC did not get 200k. Most of these kids families have very little tax liability as it is and again where is the fraud? The Michels not declaring the gift as income on their taxes? Again that is not the SEC.

As to your second point, the FBI basketball investigation is apples to oranges. Adidas was funneling kids to go to a certain to school so they would have a better chance of signing the kid once in the NBA. Once a majority of these kids leave football, no booster is expecting to get his $ back, or sign the kid to a shoe deal. Also, I did not see many recruits families wound up in that investigation and being charged with "fraud" for not reporting their extra gift income. The only thing in common is recruits getting paid to go to a school which is where your simpleton analysis ended.

I did read the "22 senators will oppose" and so what? There are 100 senators last I checked. No doubt some individuals can "impair" an investigation but to think they can shut it down all together is nonsense and to think the head of the West Coast IRS would simply disclose this to you at dinner is also nonsense.

Lastly, yeah someday it probably will end, just like someday the sun might burn out. Both have high probability of occurring not in my lifetime.

I completely disagree with you. There are 13 SEC teams paying and another 4 in Texas and Oklahoma alone. Assuming a miniscule average payment of $25,000 per player, and 20 players signed, culminates in payments totaling $500,000 per team. Assume 20 teams pay and there is $10M of un-taxable payments per annum. Georgia's budget is at least $2M, or it was between 2011 and 2014......

The former Head of the IRS of the Southern region handles my parent's taxes. They have been well aware of "the Foundations" for at least 15-years, and were consistently thwarted in their efforts to open an investigation. He thinks that total payments for the system lie between $20M and $25M.

Go to Google and type in Highest Protective Trade Barriers. The result is not China but the USA's agricultural belt. There are 40 Senators forcing the US populace to pay extra taxes to protect US agriculture. Twenty Southern senators along with US congressman, and Governors, have ample power to protect college football payments, and they will do so until they absolutely cannot.

 

[Cookie917]

I completely disagree with you. There are 13 SEC teams paying and another 4 in Texas and Oklahoma alone. Assuming a miniscule average payment of $25,000 per player, and 20 players signed, culminates in payments totaling $500,000 per team. Assume 20 teams pay and there is $10M of un-taxable payments per annum. Georgia's budget is at least $2M, or it was between 2011 and 2014......

The former Head of the IRS of the Southern region handles my parent's taxes. They have been well aware of "the Foundations" for at least 15-years, and were consistently thwarted in their efforts to open an investigation. He thinks that total payments for the system lie between $20M and $25M.

Go to Google and type in Highest Protective Trade Barriers. The result is not China but the USA's agricultural belt. There are 40 Senators forcing the US populace to pay extra taxes to protect US agriculture. Twenty Southern senators along with US congressman, and Governors, have ample power to protect college football payments, and they will do so until they absolutely cannot.

Ok now you just have incomprehensible ramblings.... 13 SEC teams paying what? The recruits? players? You do realize there are two totally different dynamics between paying a recruit to choose a school, and then paying an enrolled player a "salary" for 3-4 years correct? Also the "$10M" of untaxable payments are not being funneled through the University to the Kids so what are you talking about Geogria "budgets" for?

And WAIT... you want us to believe the Head of the IRS of the Southern Region handles your mom and dads personal taxes? But you got your information from the IRS Head of the West Coast? And wait even harder, now its not just 22 Senators, there are congressman and State Governors now also thwarting a federal investigation? You have yet to answer my original questions I thought they were clear but to break it down further 1. How is the SEC as a conference, and not individual schools implicated in any of this? and 2. What was the "fraud" committed?

 

[canesproponent]

Ok now you just have incomprehensible ramblings.... 13 SEC teams paying what? The recruits? players? You do realize there are two totally different dynamics between paying a recruit to choose a school, and then paying an enrolled player a "salary" for 3-4 years correct? Also the "$10M" of untaxable payments are not being funneled through the University to the Kids so what are you talking about Geogria "budgets" for?

And WAIT... you want us to believe the Head of the IRS of the Southern Region handles your mom and dads personal taxes? But you got your information from the IRS Head of the West Coast? And wait even harder, now its not just 22 Senators, there are congressman and State Governors now also thwarting a federal investigation? You have yet to answer my original questions I thought they were clear but to break it down further 1. How is the SEC as a conference, and not individual schools implicated in any of this? and 2. What was the "fraud" committed?

Your grammatical skills are those of a '28 year old' high school student who is trying to pass his GRE for the umpteenth time. Time to place you on ignore with the gnome............

You are also becoming hysterical. Take a valium or something......

I worked for a hedge-fund based out of Atlanta for 4-years. The CEO of the Fund contributed $100,000 per annum to the 'Dawg Foundation. The funds were solely and STRICTLY to be used to pay players during the recruiting process. I suffered through the Michel recruiting saga, knowing that they paid him $200,0000....................

If you cannot understand how these payments are grossly illegal, then I cannot help you. I read through the NCAA basketball docket and there are ample charges with which to charge these teams.

Any payment over $14,000 is taxable. If you cannot comprehend the ramifications of that, then we cannot help you. Continue your ramblings ad nauseum.

 

[canesproponent]

Ok, but if you want to put a dent in this sht then you need to hold everybody criminally responsible for the payouts. It would be need to be a federal statute because many of the states wouldn't dare pass a law like that.

They should attack the parents, advisors and/or street agents. That would be my strategy. These parties would capitulate quickly and then build your case from there. If 25 parents say that Alabama paid them during 2018, then you can start "following the money". The ones steeriing the kids are the weakest link.

It is easy prosecution. You can attack on unpaid taxes..............

 

[MIATL]

Miami fans ...

Read the Shapiro recruiting details, and can’t believe how small the infractions are.

Watch The U documentaries about guys taking “hit money” and committing crime on campus during the most successful period in football history.

Fast forward to today’s continued mediocre performances.

Other schools are just paying too much for kids. SMH

Never mind the fact that THE SCHOOLS ARE NOT PAYING THE PLAYERS.

Boosters provide extra benefits. Players and the their immediate circle receive the benefits.

But boosters are not writing $500K checks to ANYONE! It’s much more nuanced than y’all understand, which is why this topic is always comical.

“Everybody knows ______ was paid, and how much”. But nobody says anything ... Including rival fans? Lol

Rival fans cut down trees, get into brawls, and do all sorts of random things to rival fans and campus property. But no rival fan has been able to infiltrate “the bagman circle”, where “millions” are being openly traded?

And, somehow, the SEC is the braintrust of the “bagman world”?

I know Santa just came, but wow ...

 

[Andrew]

Cam didn't get money, his daddy though? Ohh he got a bunch of money, you don't have every single major news organization running reports when it didn't happen. They have testimony from a first hand witness that said his dad was asking 100k plus.

lol, if you were going to pay players you wouldn't start a foundation and you wouldn't make it easily linkable to the university. It would be a booster who couldn't be connected to the coaches or athletic department. Just look at Nevin.

 

[pumbaa]

lol, if you were going to pay players you wouldn't start a foundation and you wouldn't make it easily linkable to the university. It would be a booster who couldn't be connected to the coaches or athletic department. Just look at Nevin.

I never said the college paid him, it's always boosters or a team of boosters. If you watch all of the videos in this series they go into that. The coaches know but doesn't know basically.