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Golden vs. Shannon

I have read way too many of MiamiNights stupid *** posts. Miami Nights, you sir, are clinically retarded.
 
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Ghandi said:
It looks like we need to add a new s/n to Nites.

Look at the reply on Kareem Jackson to find what you need regarding his response to Saban/Carroll "killing" it in their first year recruiting. It is simply just not true.
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it's real simple. saban, in less time than what golden had, went out and found an impact frosh at a need position who ended up starting 12 of 13 games. jackson committed after saban came. not before.

Golden comes to Miami with plenty of time, get's mike williams who could only play on year and replaces al lious jean with finnie at a need position. so far he's failed.

saban went 12-2 in year 2 with a bunch of guys he recruited playing major roles. we'll see what golden does in year 2 since you guys like to compare him to saban.

shannon won 7 games in year 2 playing a bunch of young guys and 2 first year starting qb's so golden should be able to win atleast 8 if he's worth anything.
 
The only difference between Golden and Shannon one and a half years into their tenures is that Golden communicates with the media and fans 1000 times better.
 
losdogcane said:
The only difference between Golden and Shannon one and a half years into their tenures is that Golden communicates with the media and fans 1000 times better.
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You're not really paying attention, huh...

Chickillo's experience as an invited recruit pretty much tells all. Barely heard from Shannon, had a horrible experience even getting into the game, etc. The organization was a mess. Golden cleaned up a lot of the administrative side of the job, which is very important. He's connected better, as you post, with fans and the media. And he's repaired relationships with local schools and coaches. He's holding multiple summer camps, which has the following great effects: establishes relationships with upcoming recruits and schools, gives exposure to lesser known guys, and helps him better evaluate recruits. ETC.
 
Maybe you aren't paying attention;
The same things were being said about Shannon when he was supposedly cleaning up Cokers mess. As for administrative stuff that won't mean **** unless he is winning big by year 4! Your trying to compare Shannon's whole tenure with what Golden has done in A year and a half. The fact is that recruitment wise and record wise the are about even. I do believe that Golden will get it done.
 
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MiamiNites said:
Ghandi said:
It looks like we need to add a new s/n to Nites.

Look at the reply on Kareem Jackson to find what you need regarding his response to Saban/Carroll "killing" it in their first year recruiting. It is simply just not true.
Click to expand...

it's real simple. saban, in less time than what golden had, went out and found an impact frosh at a need position who ended up starting 12 of 13 games. jackson committed after saban came. not before.

Golden comes to Miami with plenty of time, get's mike williams who could only play on year and replaces al lious jean with finnie at a need position. so far he's failed.

saban went 12-2 in year 2 with a bunch of guys he recruited playing major roles. we'll see what golden does in year 2 since you guys like to compare him to saban.

shannon won 7 games in year 2 playing a bunch of young guys and 2 first year starting qb's so golden should be able to win atleast 8 if he's worth anything.
Click to expand...

I'm having a hard time following your thought process here, as are others, so its either you're smarter than everyone else in the room or you're the dumbest.

Why is the CB from BC the sticking point of your argument? He was average at best, sir. You keep talking about impact players, but that guy sucked **** at BC last year. What's your real point here sir?

Saban did not win a title with his players in 2008. Let me help you with that bit of missinformation:

-18 returning starters:

Offense
Player Class Position
John Parker Wilson Senior Quarterback
Terry Grant Sophomore Running back
Mike McCoy Junior Wide receiver
Travis McCall Senior Tight end
Nick Walker Senior Tight end
Antoine Caldwell Senior Center
Marlon Davis Senior Offensive tackle
Andre Smith Junior Offensive tackle
Mike Johnson Junior Offensive guard

Defense
Player Class Position
Brandon Deaderick Junior Defensive end
Lorenzo Washington Junior Nose tackle
Rolando McClain Sophomore Linebacker
Rashad Johnson Senior Safety
Kareem Jackson Sophomore Cornerback

Special teams
Player Class Position
P.J. Fitzgerald Junior Punter
Leigh Tiffin Junior Placekicker
Javier Arenas Junior Return specialist
Brian Selman Junior Long snapper

The only person in this thread putting him up against Golden is you...not anyone else.

What else do you have sir?
 
Nites

If your going to say that he's a way better CB then Finnie you should get his name right. Albert LOUIS-Jean i'm just saying

Also it's awesome how you just bypassed my reply on K. Jackson but thats cool I knew you would. I hate it too when FACTS get in the way of my points. I like the way you say ALJ to Finnie so far Golden has failed. I guess when you say so far it doesnt count Howard, Bush, Gunter, ect. I guess it only counts the 16 days Golden had to recruit. Remember Nites dead periods durning January.

Thanks for Not answering my question on what good things you think Al Golden has done.
 
Shannon recruited players that were read out of a magazine.They were talented but lacked effort,work ethic and football IQ.Al Golden will recruit kids with a chip on their shoulder and get us back to having gym rats in the weight room and dedicated kids in the film room.Tom Lemming voted Golden recruiter of the year back in the day at Temple,I think 2008 or 09.
 
losdogcane said:
Maybe you aren't paying attention;
The same things were being said about Shannon when he was supposedly cleaning up Cokers mess. As for administrative stuff that won't mean **** unless he is winning big by year 4! Your trying to compare Shannon's whole tenure with what Golden has done in A year and a half. The fact is that recruitment wise and record wise the are about even. I do believe that Golden will get it done.
Click to expand...

And all of it was fluff. Everything that was reported in Shannon's favor came from Shannon's party. You can already see and READ the difference when high school coaches and recruits talk about how much better the new regime is in terms of building and maintaining relationships. How many camps did Shannon have? One a year with a crazy price tag. Golden offers five affordable ones. And let's not even go into what a mess the situation was in terms of recruiting visits and the logistics behind it. Golden was incredulous when he took over and a grand total of 0 visits were scheduled. Or how about how Chickillo came away from his official game day visit disappointed and frustrated. Or how about having a recruit (O'Leary) come and visit and slap us in the face when he went into the visiting team's lockerroom, a product of frustration with the experience.

I think I am paying attention and I am seeing a world of difference off the field. Now all that's left is for the on-field product to catch up, but unlike most irrational fans that expect instant gratification, I understand a new coach usually needs a few years until he can truly call the team he fields his own. I gave Shannon the same amount of time, and he proved to be incompetent in almost all facets of head coaching.
 
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I'm not going to read the entire thread but those saying Golden and Shannon are equal in ability are just trying to stir **** up.

I can see the game day concerns, which are "really" the only thing that matters, but Shannon didn't have the depth chart or talent issues.....not to mention the NCAA sanctions looming. I will always like Shannon as a Cane, but the guy sucked as a coach. Some of you just need to be ok w/ that lol.
 
Ghandi said:
MiamiNites said:
Ghandi said:
It looks like we need to add a new s/n to Nites.

Look at the reply on Kareem Jackson to find what you need regarding his response to Saban/Carroll "killing" it in their first year recruiting. It is simply just not true.
Click to expand...

it's real simple. saban, in less time than what golden had, went out and found an impact frosh at a need position who ended up starting 12 of 13 games. jackson committed after saban came. not before.

Golden comes to Miami with plenty of time, get's mike williams who could only play on year and replaces al lious jean with finnie at a need position. so far he's failed.

saban went 12-2 in year 2 with a bunch of guys he recruited playing major roles. we'll see what golden does in year 2 since you guys like to compare him to saban.

shannon won 7 games in year 2 playing a bunch of young guys and 2 first year starting qb's so golden should be able to win atleast 8 if he's worth anything.
Click to expand...

I'm having a hard time following your thought process here, as are others, so its either you're smarter than everyone else in the room or you're the dumbest.

Why is the CB from BC the sticking point of your argument? He was average at best, sir. You keep talking about impact players, but that guy sucked **** at BC last year. What's your real point here sir?

Saban did not win a title with his players in 2008. Let me help you with that bit of missinformation:

-18 returning starters:

Offense
Player Class Position
John Parker Wilson Senior Quarterback
Terry Grant Sophomore Running back
Mike McCoy Junior Wide receiver
Travis McCall Senior Tight end
Nick Walker Senior Tight end
Antoine Caldwell Senior Center
Marlon Davis Senior Offensive tackle
Andre Smith Junior Offensive tackle
Mike Johnson Junior Offensive guard

Defense
Player Class Position
Brandon Deaderick Junior Defensive end
Lorenzo Washington Junior Nose tackle
Rolando McClain Sophomore Linebacker
Rashad Johnson Senior Safety
Kareem Jackson Sophomore Cornerback

Special teams
Player Class Position
P.J. Fitzgerald Junior Punter
Leigh Tiffin Junior Placekicker
Javier Arenas Junior Return specialist
Brian Selman Junior Long snapper

The only person in this thread putting him up against Golden is you...not anyone else.

What else do you have sir?
Click to expand...

SMH. Saban went 12-2 with A BUNCH OF GUYS HE RECRUITED. Leading wr in 2008? Julio Jones with 900+ yards. Mike McCoy contributed 16 catches for 191 yards. Which player contributed more?

Terrence Cody played a major role did he not? freshman RB Mark Ingram had over 700 yards rushing. The guy you emntioned (terry grant) had a lil over 100. Which player contributed more to the team?
 
Core Values said:
Nites

If your going to say that he's a way better CB then Finnie you should get his name right. Albert LOUIS-Jean i'm just saying

Also it's awesome how you just bypassed my reply on K. Jackson but thats cool I knew you would. I hate it too when FACTS get in the way of my points. I like the way you say ALJ to Finnie so far Golden has failed. I guess when you say so far it doesnt count Howard, Bush, Gunter, ect. I guess it only counts the 16 days Golden had to recruit. Remember Nites dead periods durning January.

Thanks for Not answering my question on what good things you think Al Golden has done.
Click to expand...


Bypased what replay about jackson? you didn't say anything perdinent to my point.

Saban needed help in the secondary and he went out and got jackson who came in and started 13 games as a true. FACT Your FACTS are meaningless and do not apply to my point.

As far as what good things Golden has done, you asked that question in another thread and I answer'd. if you're to lazy to find it that's your problem.
 
MiamiNites said:
Core Values said:
Nites

If your going to say that he's a way better CB then Finnie you should get his name right. Albert LOUIS-Jean i'm just saying

Also it's awesome how you just bypassed my reply on K. Jackson but thats cool I knew you would. I hate it too when FACTS get in the way of my points. I like the way you say ALJ to Finnie so far Golden has failed. I guess when you say so far it doesnt count Howard, Bush, Gunter, ect. I guess it only counts the 16 days Golden had to recruit. Remember Nites dead periods durning January.

Thanks for Not answering my question on what good things you think Al Golden has done.
Click to expand...


Bypased what replay about jackson? you didn't say anything perdinent to my point.

Saban needed help in the secondary and he went out and got jackson who came in and started 13 games as a true. FACT Your FACTS are meaningless and do not apply to my point.

As far as what good things Golden has done, you asked that question in another thread and I answer'd. if you're to lazy to find it that's your problem.
Click to expand...



Again playing the results with Jackson and BSing about Saban out recruiting people for Jackson. That's a Fact

Again thanks for NOT answering my questions and going around in circles. That's a Fact

You should take your meds. That's a Fact

take care Xavier
 
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I won't quote the response from Nites because then I'll be compelled to reply to it. I'm not sure how he could look at a list of 18 returning STARTERS and simply respond that they're involvement was not one or the main reason why Saban went 12-2. Instead this guy points to Julio Jones posting 750yds as a Fr, Ingram 700yds rushing as a RFr, and JUCO Terrence Cody.

Contributors yes, most definitely. But not the reason why they went 12-2. That team was lead by a suffocating defense that as the roster shows were there way before Saban got there.

Feel free to skip my post clown.
 
Also, feel free to address the differences between Thomas Finnie and ALJ. So far, I see two True FR CB's who barely played.

Why is ALJ a better player than Finnie?
 
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Nights uses mike williams as an example of who golden recruited in his first year but not chick or perryman. Haha thats dbc stupid right there.

Let me repeat it for you for the 1000 time. Nobody thinks golden is saban. People are saying saban wasnt great his first year either. how hard is that to understand? And did saban come into a massive ncaa investigation? Or terrible depth issues at key positions?

Damnit you and dbc need to only speak to each other.
 
I hate, just absolutely hate, the fact that Nites spends his time building strawman arguments only he can dismantle or understand. Once you catch her, she'll switch the argument on you. This thread is a perfect example.

-Kareeem Jackson was recruited by everyone and a big time recruit!
-Kareem Jackson was only lightly recruited, including Al Golden at Temple.
-Nites response: None, we move to 12-2 and ALJ argument regarding Thomas Finnie. Seems ilogical, but OK.

-ALJ is better than Thomas Finnie. Al Golden FAILED to get ALJ to stay. ALJ is a sutd player and Finnie blows.
-ALJ and Finnie had identical stats, with the exception of 1 INT for ALJ. I bring up the fact that neither has done nothing spectacular, backed by simple stats and game logs.
-Nites response: Once again, we get nothing on topic, instead goes on to rant about Saban and his ability to get "A BUNCH" of players to help him go 12-2 in 2008.

-Saban's recruits are the reason why 'Bama goes 12-2 in 2008.
-Once again, facts are introduced. In 2008, most of the returning starters were players Mike Shula brought in. I believe the number was 15-16.
-Nites response: Dismiss all of Shula's players and quickly states that the reason 'Bama goes 12-2 is because of Julio Jones, Mark Ingram, and Terrence Cody.

Classic.
 
crossover22[]_[];492235 said:
Nights uses mike williams as an example of who golden recruited in his first year but not chick or perryman. Haha thats dbc stupid right there.

Let me repeat it for you for the 1000 time. Nobody thinks golden is saban. People are saying saban wasnt great his first year either. how hard is that to understand? And did saban come into a massive ncaa investigation? Or terrible depth issues at key positions?

Damnit you and dbc need to only speak to each other.
Click to expand...

Thank u

Dude uses Mike Williams as the end all about Goldens db recruiting.Lets see what he does with this db class b4 calling him a failure. This argument is about Shannon vs Golden not Golden vs Saban. I sat there and watched ppl defend shannnons db recruiting while some of us laughed at his lack of building depth or quality depth. Thats my argument here. He didnt have a clue about recuiting solid players at arguably the most important position in major cfb.
 
No idea why anyone argues with this guy anymore. He's made it well known for years now he doesn't have a single clue about the sport, and has an obvious racial bias.
 
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