Charges dropped against Mark Walton

[bshaw28]

Right. Then Walton actually played, outperformed the other backs and became the starter.



Because the starter, Walton, got arrested.



They were all fringe guys. Walton was a level above them, which is why he became the starter, put up better numbers and was in line for an extension.

As for Drake, he got benched because he was getting traded.

AGAIN...

Statistically Laird & Gaskin put up similar stats as Walton. You said the difference was - "Walton started over them, played significantly more snaps and was clearly the favorite of the staff" - so that proves Walton was better?

Statistically Laird & Gaskin put up better stats than Ballage. Ballage started over them, played significantly more snaps and was clearly the favorite of the staff"- so that proves they're interchangeable?

Did I get that right?

Compare Walton's stats to any player I've compared him too - Mike James, Javarris James, Damien Berry, Matt Dayes, Myles Gaskin, Patrick Laird, Dexter Williams, Jordan Scarlett - you're not going to see a big difference in their stats. But you think I'm dead wrong on comparing their talent level.

Compare Walton's stats to any player you've compared him too - Christian McCaffery, Devonta Freeman, Duke Johnson, James White - you will see a big difference in their stats. But you still think you're 100% right on comparing their talent level.

I'm totally good with that. Based on Walton's actual performance and not your personal projection - Did I undersell Walton? Probably. But not by much. Did you oversell Walton? Definitely. By a lot.

 

[DMoney]

Statistically Laird & Gaskin put up similar stats as Walton. You said the difference was - "Walton started over them, played significantly more snaps and was clearly the favorite of the staff" - so that proves Walton was better?

Statistically Laird & Gaskin put up better stats than Ballage. Ballage started over them, played significantly more snaps and was clearly the favorite of the staff"- so that proves they're interchangeable?

Did I get that right?

I'll make it simple: Walton put up better stats than all three of those players, and started over them. He remained the starter until he got arrested.

Compare Walton's stats to any player I've compared him too - Mike James, Javarris James, Damien Berry, Matt Dayes, Myles Gaskin, Patrick Laird, Dexter Williams, Jordan Scarlett - you're not going to see a big difference in their stats. But you think I'm dead wrong on comparing their talent level.

Berry, Dayes, Gaskin, JJ, Williams and Scarlett have never started a game in the NFL. Their stats are worse than Walton and they got drafted lower, if they were drafted at all. Laird averaged 2.7 yards per carry and only started when Walton, who beat him out, got arrested. They are all inferior players.

Compare Walton's stats to any player you've compared him too - Christian McCaffery, Devonta Freeman, Duke Johnson, James White - you will see a big difference in their stats. But you still think you're 100% right on comparing their talent level.

You won't find a single post of mine comparing Walton to McCaffrey or Freeman. They do not exist.

I compared him to Duke and James White. Using his four games as a starter, Walton was on pace for 913 yards from scrimmage-- a typical season from Duke or James White.

Duke was a third rounder. White was a fourth rounder. I predicted Walton would be drafted in the 3rd or 4th round. He was drafted at the top of the 4th. The only thing I oversold was Walton's commitment to the law. Everything else was playing out as expected.

 

[Squid Bumciorek]

I don't recall Walton having any discipline problems at UM. Maybe they kept it under wraps (unlikely given the way the program is run). To have a sudden behavior change like he did, seems like he had a problem that didn't show up until he was a bit older- maybe drugs, psychological, who knows. I hope he gets the help he needs.

 

[bshaw28]

I'll make it simple: Walton put up better stats than all three of those players, and started over them. He remained the starter until he got arrested.



Berry, Dayes, Gaskin, JJ, Williams and Scarlett have never started a game in the NFL. Their stats are worse than Walton and they got drafted lower, if they were drafted at all. Laird averaged 2.7 yards per carry and only started when Walton, who beat him out, got arrested. They are all inferior players.



You won't find a single post of mine comparing Walton to McCaffrey or Freeman. They do not exist.

I compared him to Duke and James White. Using his four games as a starter, Walton was on pace for 913 yards from scrimmage-- a typical season from Duke or James White.

Duke was a third rounder. White was a fourth rounder. I predicted Walton would be drafted in the 3rd or 4th round. He was drafted at the top of the 4th. The only thing I oversold was Walton's commitment to the law. Everything else was playing out as expected.

Dude - Walton has 365 total yds, 0 TD's and 1 lost fumble in his career. He has a 3.5 ypc and 6.5 ypr. There's 10+ guys that were drafted or FA's behind Walton that have put up better numbers than that.

If you want to do your projections, that's fine - but actual stats aren't going to do you any favors

So Walton was on pace for 913 yards from scrimmage as a starter. Cool. Laird was on pace for 908 yards from scrimmage as a starter. So actually, maybe don't do your projections either.


Here's Walton/Gaskin/Laird's pre season numbers

Here's Walton/Gaskin/Laird's regular season numbers

The gap between all 3's performance is very minimal. It's just basic math. If you interpret it as a large gap, so be it.

If you still think Walton would've been "as good or better than Duke. in the pros" - that's fair enough. Your Tebow & Walton offense would be deadly!

 

[DMoney]

Dude - Walton has 365 total yds, 0 TD's and 1 lost fumble in his career. He has a 3.5 ypc and 6.5 ypr. There's 10+ guys that were drafted or FA's behind Walton that have put up better numbers than that.

If you want to do your projections, that's fine - but actual stats aren't going to do you any favors

So Walton was on pace for 913 yards from scrimmage as a starter. Cool. Laird was on pace for 908 yards from scrimmage as a starter. So actually, maybe don't do your projections either.


Here's Walton/Gaskin/Laird's pre season numbers

View attachment 116951

Here's Walton/Gaskin/Laird's regular season numbers

View attachment 116952

The gap between all 3's performance is very minimal. It's just basic math. If you interpret it as a large gap, so be it.

If you still think Walton would've been "as good or better than Duke. in the pros" - that's fair enough. Your Tebow & Walton offense would be deadly!

Laird averaged 2.7 yards per carry. He was awful. That's why he didn't get a single touch until Walton was gone.

The sad thing is we're arguing about four-game samples. It would have been great to see it play out on the field.

 

[apfenny3]

I don't recall Walton having any discipline problems at UM. Maybe they kept it under wraps (unlikely given the way the program is run). To have a sudden behavior change like he did, seems like he had a problem that didn't show up until he was a bit older- maybe drugs, psychological, who knows. I hope he gets the help he needs.

Was never a problem in the locker room and was a great teammate and hard worker. The only issue was the weird "impersonating an officer" arrest that went away very quickly

 

[Canesq]

No chance he gets another shot. How many chances can you give at best a backup running back? Plus there is a crop of new running backs that don’t have the baggage but have comparable talent.

 

[bshaw28]

Laird averaged 2.7 yards per carry. He was awful. That's why he didn't get a single touch until Walton was gone.

The sad thing is we're arguing about four-game samples. It would have been great to see it play out on the field.

Things you will mention
Walton started over Laird and had a 3.8 ypc compared to Laird's 2.7. I agree, Walton was definitely better here.

Things you won't mention

Yds per touch:
Laird - 4.4
Gaskin - 4.3
Walton - 4.3
Ballage - 2.3

Gaskin had a 3.7 ypc, Laird 2.7 ypc & Ballage had a 1.8 ypc - but you think Laird/Gaskin/Ballage are interchangeable. Doesn't seem consistent.
Gaskin had a 3.7 ypc. Seems pretty similar to Walton's 3.8 ypc
Walton had 5.9 ypr, Gaskin's 7.3 ypr, Laird 8.9 ypr. This is supposed to be Walton's strength, but he wasn't as good.

Speaking of Walton's strengths....
Walton lost 1 fumble. Laird & Gaskin - 0.
Walton gave up 1 sack. Laird & Gaskin - 0.
Walton scored 0 TD's. Laird & Gaskin - 1 TD each.
Walton had 0 ST tackles. Laird had 6 & recovered a fumble.

Walton's Top 5 total yd games - 75, 58, 54, 41 & 37 yds
P. Laird's Top 5 total yd games - 86, 69, 58, 54 & 48 yds. Advantage Laird, Laird, Laird, Laird & Laird.

Yet you've said Walton "outperformed the other backs by a mile". I agree it's a small sample size, but I don't think you're looking at this very realistically.

For another example of how you're not looking at Walton realistically, look at how you've commented on his arrest record:

Walton lost his starting job because he was suspended for 4 games due to 3 arrests before joining the Dolphins. He then got kicked off the team when he got arrested again for punching his pregnant girlfriend. Then it comes out he had beat her up previously as well and the cops hadn't followed up. Then Walton violates the courts restraining order by going to her place a 3am and having her call the cops on him. Ya know....just because the charges were dropped doesn't mean he didn't do that sh^t.

Yet you referred to these incidents as "off-field shenanigans". If you call 6 police incidents in 12 months "shenanigans" - I don't think you're being realistic.

And all this is just a re-hash of what we've already discussed in a thread where I asked plenty of questions you didn't answer -

https://www.canesinsight.com/threads/south-florida-rbs-in-the-playoffs.157662/page-3

 

[We the Boss]

I'll make it simple: Walton put up better stats than all three of those players, and started over them. He remained the starter until he got arrested.



Berry, Dayes, Gaskin, JJ, Williams and Scarlett have never started a game in the NFL. Their stats are worse than Walton and they got drafted lower, if they were drafted at all. Laird averaged 2.7 yards per carry and only started when Walton, who beat him out, got arrested. They are all inferior players.



You won't find a single post of mine comparing Walton to McCaffrey or Freeman. They do not exist.

I compared him to Duke and James White. Using his four games as a starter, Walton was on pace for 913 yards from scrimmage-- a typical season from Duke or James White.

Duke was a third rounder. White was a fourth rounder. I predicted Walton would be drafted in the 3rd or 4th round. He was drafted at the top of the 4th. The only thing I oversold was Walton's commitment to the law. Everything else was playing out as expected.

“The only thing I oversold was Walton's commitment to the law”

this is why is d$ is the man

 

[UMFarArcher]

Hope he can regain his career and stop sabotaging his future. He is an NFL back.

Lots of forks in the road of life - choices - second chances are more rare than two-dollar pistols.

It's all on him now.

 

[The Franchise]

Was never a problem in the locker room and was a great teammate and hard worker. The only issue was the weird "impersonating an officer" arrest that went away very quickly

That was weird, and I doubt there was zero basis in fact with the original arrest.

 

[gogeta4]

The weirdest part of the whole Walton saga was that he seemed like such a good kid at Miami. Was always a good interview, played like a warrior, and was a leader of the team.

he was young....dude like has bipolar depression...that sh*t sometimes kicks in post 20. Sh*t been downhill since his parent passed though.. One of my friends i grew up with was similar..nothing real crazy while growing up for years....then BOOM..dude started tripping out n doing all kind of sh*t until he caught an attempt murder charge n now is sitting for years in the pen. Just back to back sabotage behaviors from my boy.

 

[gogeta4]

That “main point” has changed every time he’s exceeded one of your predictions.

When he got in trouble, he was starting and about to be extended by a coach who loved him. Would he start for all 32 teams? Of course not. But he was right on track to meet his projection as a James White-type back who can block, catch and run.

Yea he was moving that goal post alot. I remember him sayng Myles Gaskin was better and he would be cut.

 

[gogeta4]

Why? Because Drake wanted out, and the Dolphins wanted Drake out. For a couple games Ballage started, then Walton, then Ballage again, then Laird. It was a revolving door of backup RB's, and Walton got a turn. Someone had to start.

Let's look at Flores & Kalen Ballage:

- At one point Kalen Ballage was #1, Walton was #3 and Gaskin was #5.
- Here's what Flores said in mid-November after a game where Ballage went 20 carries for 43 yds and 4 catches for 2 yds.
"Kalen works extremely hard. We keep giving it to him and I think it'll turn. We have a lot of confidence in him."
- True to his word, Ballage started the next 3 games and had 19 carries for 22 yds, and 6 catches for 21 yds.

Now ask yourself, why was that the case?

Is your stance that whatever Flores does/says is fact, regardless of actual on-field performance?

Because my Miami Dolphins fielded one of the worst offensive lines ive ever seen..later int he year with starters out?. Are u a dolphin fan?

 

[bshaw28]

Yea he was moving that goal post alot. I remember him sayng Myles Gaskin was better and he would be cut.

In what way have I moved the goal posts?

I never said Walton would be cut, but I do think it was a very, very real possibility. I do think Gaskin is better than Walton (but only by a small margin).

And Walton's numbers to that point more than back me up...

2018 Pre-season - 22 - 21 - 1.0 ypc
2018 Reg Season - 14 - 34 - 2.4 ypc
2019 Pre-Season - 29 - 75 - 2.6 ypc

Is it out the question thinking a RB with those numbers & has a league suspension coming might get cut? He was 65 - 130 2.0 ypc at that point.

Know who thought Walton the Bengals cutting Walton his rookie yr despite the fact he was a high 4th Round pick was more of a possibility than me?
@DMoney did - https://www.canesinsight.com/threads/siap-mark-walton-quiet-camp.135618/page-2

But I'm the one moving the goal posts?

Now compare Walton's pre-season to Laird & Gaskin

Laird - 25 - 114 - 4.6 ypc
Gaskin - 26 - 98 - 3.8 ypc
Walton - 29 - 75 - 2.6 ypc

Then you'll post "If I can remember you were saying Gaskin and Laird were better". Well, yes. If you look objectively, who wouldn't?

I can only give you Walton.s on-field performance - which I always do to back my position. If you guys want to use the personal narrative you've constructed for Walton's career, or your own projections - I can't do anything about that.

 

[BS85]

LOL y'all are so absurdly clueless, it's almost comical.

NFL GMs would sign OJ Simpson TODAY if they felt he could help them win. The ONLY thing that they won't touch is a Kaepernick type issue. Something causing racial/political divide...and actually, really just only things that would cause the white fans with money to take it elsewhere. NOTHING else matters.

I don't know whether or not Mark will get another shot in the NFL. What I do know, without a doubt, is that question will be answered by his talent and his talent ONLY. Not these arrest reports that no one outside of Miami even really know about.

Joe Mixon PUNCHED A WOMAN IN THE TEETH AT FULL FORCE ON VIDEO, and he's doing just fine. And it has nothing to do with "2nd chances" or anything like that. It's because he's a good football player. Period.

I disagree, players of similar ability have their character compared. Therefore, if you're a borderline talent like Walton, and more easily replaceable, it 100% matters.

 

[hoops156]

its a shame he messed up bc he was doing well in miami given the OL around him. i dont think he should be back in football until he fixes his life around him. he needs to seek help and get his **** in order. hope he finds help, but clearly there is more to the stuff going on with him (dropped or non dropped charges) even going back to UM and the false arrest situation. he wasnt good enough in miami to warrant keeping him around w the off field issues and there was a low investment in him unlike say a joe Mixon who did a horrific act years ago but has since remained out of trouble. if walton just had the one incident but stayed out of trouble since, he'd be fine. since he didnt and continued to find himself in situations where he shouldn't have been in, it makes it hard for anyone to sign an okay RB when theyre replaceable.

either way, any shot with miami is done. we have breita who is better and more invested in him in terms of money and have jordan howard. one of those two will get an extension based on this year and fins likely use a higher draft pick next year on a back when they go heavy on skill talent (etienne probably)

 

[Tijuana]

I will hire him holmes

 

[bshaw28]

Because my Miami Dolphins fielded one of the worst offensive lines ive ever seen..later int he year with starters out?. Are u a dolphin fan?

Yes - part of the reason Ballage put up bad stats behind a bad offensive line.

But the question is - if in the 4 games after Walton got suspended - Ballage averaged 1.7 ypc, Laird 2.3 ypc, Gaskin 4.3 ypc - then why was Ballage still 2 spots higher on the depth chart than Gaskin despite getting much worse results?

I would say the answer is a draft capital. Because Ballage was a 4th Round pick and Gaskin was a 7th round pick - IMO Ballage getting fed the ball so much was a reflection of where they were drafted, not a difference in their talent.

 

[OriginalCanesCanesCanes]

@DMoney there is no arguing the relative merits of Mark Walton with @bshaw28

He will carry his vendetta vs Walton with him to the grave. I think it has to be personal, it’s been going on for years.

You won’t get a stronger and more passionate argument from anyone on this board about anything, than you will from @bshaw28 vs Walton.

He and I went back and forth for years on him vs Scarlett in college. Bshaw loved him some Scarlett and hated Walton with a passion.