Strength Coach

[Canegrad89]

I disagree fully.

What about core work??

What about working the tiny muscles?

What about increased flexibility, balance and body symmetry? You get that from Yoga and Pilates.

What about recovery? You get that from cryotherapy and improved sleeping patterns

There must be a holistic approach to wellness in order to reach your fitness potential, especially for the modern athlete.

This is absolutely correct. If the players only lifted weights, they would be strong but stiff as a board (which would diminish speed and range of motion as well as lead to a ton of injuries).

Core work is critical for all of the reasons you mentioned as well as supporting the back. Looking at our OL last year (under the old S&C coach), it appeared to me that they weren't doing enough core work (they were carrying too much weight in their midsections). That limits explosiveness, mobility & can contribute to missed blocks etc.

Elite athletes in the NFL & NBA do extensive functional fitness work. I used to work out five days a week with a personal trainer in LA who worked with NFL & NBA athletes solely on functional fitness. They lifted extensively too but not with her. While we never called it yoga or Pilates, we incorporated a lot of that into our functional fitness routines (and it kicked my a@@ at times). We also stretched & worked on flexibility extensively.

You're absolutely correct that all of the above are tremendously important for achieving elite performance and preventing injuries.

 

[Kjdcanefan]

I agree with much of what you just wrote (especially chest flys, hammer curls, training for aesthetics etc) but I disagree on your stance on core work.

While I agree the core is trained on the lifts you mentioned, I disagree with your inference that those lifts would be enough to strengthen the core. I believe the core should be targeting specifically and strength trained like any other muscle group.

The core is too important to explosiveness in athletics (change of direction, power, explosion) to fail to Target. A strong core can be the difference between a 36 inch and 40 inch vertical leap or a 4.7 forty and a 4.5...it can be the difference between a linebacker having to change direction to catch a RB that made a cut back move and not quite getting there

This is crazy! Deadlifts not necessary???? What?!?

Craziest thing I've read all day. Most if not all Olympic lifts have a deadlift portion to them you know..

 

[GOCANES05]

To build POWER to fire out on OL and DL bench squats are the ultimate , here on the video my only change would be to STOP completely and sit for thousand 1 thousand 2 then explode up , this touch and go does NOTHING.

Work up to 3 sets of 5 with around 600 with thousand count , well you's be coming off the line of scrimmage convincingly , in all my years of training ALWAYS added bike riding and speed work training with track sprinters and loved basketball workouts also.



GOCANES

 

[canes614]

I disagree fully.

What about core work??

What about working the tiny muscles?

What about increased flexibility, balance and body symmetry? You get that from Yoga and Pilates.

What about recovery? You get that from cryotherapy and improved sleeping patterns

There must be a holistic approach to wellness in order to reach your fitness potential, especially for the modern athlete.

I don't disagree with anything you said....but I believe he was referring to types of lifts that improves overall strength...if your numbers increase it means you're becoming a stronger player....rest and cryotherapy is very important.....but you still gotta make sure you're getting enough protein and carbs "periodically" to recover properly....no disrespect...but it's not as complicated as you're making it to be...

This is absolutely correct. If the players only lifted weights, they would be strong but stiff as a board (which would diminish speed and range of motion as well as lead to a ton of injuries).

Core work is critical for all of the reasons you mentioned as well as supporting the back. Looking at our OL last year (under the old S&C coach), it appeared to me that they weren't doing enough core work (they were carrying too much weight in their midsections). That limits explosiveness, mobility & can contribute to missed blocks etc.

Elite athletes in the NFL & NBA do extensive functional fitness work. I used to work out five days a week with a personal trainer in LA who worked with NFL & NBA athletes solely on functional fitness. They lifted extensively too but not with her. While we never called it yoga or Pilates, we incorporated a lot of that into our functional fitness routines (and it kicked my a@@ at times). We also stretched & worked on flexibility extensively.

You're absolutely correct that all of the above are tremendously important for achieving elite performance and preventing injuries.

None of that don't mean $#i+ in the trenches if your cleans, bench and squat numbers are the same as hs kids...thats why our ol can't get a push....all of that you mention is good ...but you have to get stronger on that steel in those areas mentioned....flatout!

 

[Ammok]

No dead lifts prior???
More signs the total Shichtshow is over

 

[simplycanes]

I wonder how many CSCS certified guys are in here or with Kinesiology or Exercise Physiology degrees.

You mean signing up for CrossFit and shopping at Whole Foods doesn't qualify you to run a P5 S and C program?

 

[nobeastofburden]

I've been complaining about S&C coach since Moffitt left. We ain't been the big and nasty guys in a long long time. It wasn't recruiting, it was losing that edge. If you don't believe that compare LSU before he got there and after. That LSU team that killed us in the Peach Bowl was built exactly like our last title team. People outside Canes fans like to think our teams were small and just speed. LOLOLOL. We were big, fast, and nasty.

 

[SWFLSWAGG17]

Wow...I expected better from you...She doesn't have enough meat on her bones bro.

Works for me.

 

[203CT305]

Since no weight lifting occurs on the football field, there are no "essential" lifts. With every lift/exercise the cost/benefit has to be examined. There are only so many exercises any person can do. Almost everyone here wants the players deadlifting, squatting, benching, olympic lifting, jumping, sprinting, doing *** assistance exercise, etc. There's an unlimited amount to choose from but you can't do everything. Deadlifts make you a better deadlifter. In a very untrained individual it can improve other areas of strength. It's very unlikely the level at athlete at Miami is going to get faster by deadlifting more often or at all. Otherwise coaches would be scouring high school powerlifting and olympic lifting meets looking for the best lifters and asking them to play football.

There are certainly levels of strength that you would like to see in your players but it can be difficult to measure these. Every individual has different leverages. Just because Navaughn increases his deadlift by 150 pounds, this doesn't mean he's going to be a better football player. The key is to understand the physical requirements of the game of football and design a program that heightens competition results.

Based on what I've read and seen of Swasey, many of his efforts seemed misguided. The same goes for Felder. It seems like the new guy will have the players doing olympic and powerlifts, which is likely to yield more positive results than if Felder's program was still followed. It will keep the message boards and coaches happy, but the impact on the field will be difficult to measure.

It's also amusing to read the many "we deadlifted/cleaned/(insert any exercise) at my high school" comments. Meanwhile everyone was critical of Richt for running the same offense for as long as we can remember. Well maybe it's well passed the time that the exercises everyone is married to are re-examined and consider whether the success you experienced was because coach had you deadlifting, or cleaning, or doing yoga, or studying more film, or doing extra 300 yard shuttles, or washing hands before practice, etc.

 

[Kjdcanefan]

This is even crazier.

Having a “deadlift portion” is far different than doing a traditional deadlift, which is what the vast majority of posters, if not every (other?) poster in the thread, is referring to. What ALL Olympic lifts have in common is the that the weight is going from the ground to overhead.

A distinction and a difference.

At no point in a power clean does the weight go over your head. If it is you do the power clean wrong. The way you deadlift and the way you deadlift for a powerclean are exactly the same. Any Olympic lifter has deadlifts in their workout regimen. The jerk portion of a power clean and jerk has little carryover to what a football player does biomechanically.

 

[Dwinstitles]

 

[Dilber]

At no point in a power clean does the weight go over your head. If it is you do the power clean wrong. The way you deadlift and the way you deadlift for a powerclean are exactly the same. Any Olympic lifter has deadlifts in their workout regimen. The jerk portion of a power clean and jerk has little carryover to what a football player does biomechanically.

A power clean is not an olympic lift. The Olympic lifts are the clean and jerk, and the snatch. The clean and press used to be a lift but is no longer.

Also, deadlift and cleans are completely different movements with different technique and leverages. If you think they are the same, you are a ******
lifter. You are correct in that olympic lifters use deadlifts to train the bottom, but the jerk has some carryover to football (mainly in terms of power transfer through the core in an explosive movement).

 

[The Svengali]

I don't disagree with anything you said....but I believe he was referring to types of lifts that improves overall strength...if your numbers increase it means you're becoming a stronger player....rest and cryotherapy is very important.....but you still gotta make sure you're getting enough protein and carbs "periodically" to recover properly....no disrespect...but it's not as complicated as you're making it to be...



None of that don't mean $#i+ in the trenches if your cleans, bench and squat numbers are the same as hs kids...thats why our ol can't get a push....all of that you mention is good ...but you have to get stronger on that steel in those areas mentioned....flatout!

No disrespect taken, and I agree it’s not even remotely complicated. In fact, I think this is standard methods. The point I’m making is a modern approach to training is more of a holistic approach...all encompassing

 

[JSmoot]

I've been complaining about S&C coach since Moffitt left. We ain't been the big and nasty guys in a long long time. It wasn't recruiting, it was losing that edge. If you don't believe that compare LSU before he got there and after. That LSU team that killed us in the Peach Bowl was built exactly like our last title team. People outside Canes fans like to think our teams were small and just speed. LOLOLOL. We were big, fast, and nasty.

I was reading this and agreeing.. but I was interrupted every 3 words by that avitar.. scrolling back to stare again..

 

[Kjdcanefan]

A power clean is not an olympic lift. The Olympic lifts are the clean and jerk, and the snatch. The clean and press used to be a lift but is no longer.

Also, deadlift and cleans are completely different movements with different technique and leverages. If you think they are the same, you are a ******
lifter. You are correct in that olympic lifters use deadlifts to train the bottom, but the jerk has some carryover to football (mainly in terms of power transfer through the core in an explosive movement).

Uhm, uhhh, … you specifically referred to Olympic lifts, not power cleans which are more Olympic-styled, but not an actual Olympic lift.

And the way you deadlift and power clean ARE NOT exactly the same. Unless you’re doing them wrong.

What every almost every athlete does is explode from their hips while engaging the core. If you don’t think the Jerk portion of the lift accomplishes that … well, that brings our little “debate” to an end.

I know the differences between a power clean deadlift and a traditional deadlift. I never stated that the form was the same or even similar l. I'm sorry you didnt understand it the first time. Try reading that a little slower this time around.

If you've ever trained Olympic lifts for awhile you'd know the injury rate at the knee and shoulder joints is very high for anyone doing the lifts over the course of a year. The goal of a strength coach is to maximize results while preventing injury. I would hope you understand that as well.

 

[Kjdcanefan]

In addition to the injury rate, think of the complexity of all the lifts going overhead and the technique required to these 18year olds to lift well enough even for a minimal benefit. More of these kids have done an upright row(the stupidest exercise) before doing some sort of clean. Now think of the time required to detrain that bad habit of bent arms and retrain proper form. All for a little extra benefit of explosive power, that can be much easily achieved in other ways. You tell me if it is worth it. Smarter not harder, but hey, if your one goal in life is to have the best snatch lift then by all means religiously train that ***** and have the best form possible. Football players have more to work on. If you dont think the risks outweigh the benefit, that is fine. I'll leave your safe little bubble alone.

 

[swampcougar1]

May have missed it but have not seen this mentioned. A good strength and conditioning coach should diagnose what each player should be working on. A sprinter does not need the same workout as a lineman. One OL may be weaker in one area than another. . A coach that can successively do this will have great results.

 

[Kjdcanefan]

You @Kjdcanefan are one cowardly ****. You’re too embarrassed to admit that you’re wrong. I realized that you were an honorless clown with no code so I screenshot the exact post where your dumbass said that they were EXACTLY THE SAME. Not similar. Exactly the same.

Post #134

At no point in a power clean does the weight go over your head. If it is you do the power clean wrong. The way you deadlift and the way you deadlift for a powerclean are exactly the same. Any Olympic lifter has deadlifts in their workout regimen. The jerk portion of a power clean and jerk has little carryover to what a football player does biomechanically.

You don’t know ****!


I know Rangers. You are an embarrassment.

Semantics bro. You got me on that.
Edit: my choice of words doesn't change the fact that the snatch is unnecessary for all players to use and that the core lifts I mentioned in the beginning are what every player should be doing.
I'm glad you took a photo though remember it when you tell your friends about your message board war and how you called me a coward

 

[Dilber]

In addition to the injury rate, think of the complexity of all the lifts going overhead and the technique required to these 18year olds to lift well enough even for a minimal benefit. More of these kids have done an upright row(the stupidest exercise) before doing some sort of clean. Now think of the time required to detrain that bad habit of bent arms and retrain proper form. All for a little extra benefit of explosive power, that can be much easily achieved in other ways. You tell me if it is worth it. Smarter not harder, but hey, if your one goal in life is to have the best snatch lift then by all means religiously train that ***** and have the best form possible. Football players have more to work on. If you dont think the risks outweigh the benefit, that is fine. I'll leave your safe little bubble alone.

I specifically said earlier that they should be using hex bars to reduce injury risk as their is less lower back stress which is already impacted from getting hit all the time. You clearly aren't reading the thread, nor do you have any idea about S&C nor have you ever worked with D1 athletes. High level D1 athletes pick up coaching cues real ******* easy. It's not hard to train overhead movement, especially in a proper S&C environment. In a proper S&C environment, there are coaches giving cues during the lifts to ensure form is done correctly.

And I didn't say a snatch is the end all be all. There's many ways to skin a cat, and olympic lifting is merely a tool in the toolbox. I merely called you out on posting without knowing ****.

p.s. there is no such thing as a clean deadlift. There are power cleans, which are from the floor, and power hang cleans which start after that.

 

[Kjdcanefan]

I specifically said earlier that they should be using hex bars to reduce injury risk as their is less lower back stress which is already impacted from getting hit all the time. You clearly aren't reading the thread, nor do you have any idea about S&C nor have you ever worked with D1 athletes. High level D1 athletes pick up coaching cues real ******* easy. It's not hard to train overhead movement, especially in a proper S&C environment. In a proper S&C environment, there are coaches giving cues during the lifts to ensure form is done correctly.

And I didn't say a snatch is the end all be all. There's many ways to skin a cat, and olympic lifting is merely a tool in the toolbox. I merely called you out on posting without knowing ****.

p.s. there is no such thing as a clean deadlift. There are power cleans, which are from the floor, and power hang cleans which start after that.

If I said clean deadlift it is a typo. I agree the hex bar is better tool to reduce injury as well, the proper environment also helps. But all D1 athletes don't get lumped into the box of "they pick up coaching cues real ******* easy"