Off-Topic Stock Market & Crypto Discussion

And Bessent has been saying they NEED the 10y demand to go up for our $7T refinancing
It's actually more like $10t in debt, but the vast majority is in short term bills, which will be rolled over into new bills not 10-year+ debt. Bessent has already admitted as much: https://archive.ph/6hPqR

See here too:

With the tariffs, I don't see how terming out the debt wouldn't lead to spike in yields. Reducing trade deficits mean there will be less foreign capital buying treasuries, and the demand slack would have to be carried domestically (and the fed isn't doing QE - quite the opposite still running off their long-term holdings). If Bessent were to flood the mkt with some % of the ~$6t in expiring short term bills as 10y notes or 20+ year bonds, the price of that debt would go down and the yield would go up.
 

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It's actually more like $10t in debt, but the vast majority is in short term bills, which will be rolled over into new bills not 10-year+ debt. Bessent has already admitted as much: https://archive.ph/6hPqR

See here too:

With the tariffs, I don't see how terming out the debt wouldn't lead to spike in yields. Reducing trade deficits mean there will be less foreign capital buying treasuries, and the demand slack would have to be carried domestically (and the fed isn't doing QE - quite the opposite still running off their long-term holdings). If Bessent were to flood the mkt with some % of the ~$6t in expiring short term bills as 10y notes or 20+ year bonds, the price of that debt would go down and the yield would go up.

They are bills because the government was getting better rates on bills than bonds. The 10 years is starting to get below t bills which should allow the government to clock in on lower rates for 10 years before inflation kicks in from growth.

The big question: does the Fed do QE or Congress need to pass anything to help kickstart the next growth cycle.
 
They are bills because the government was getting better rates on bills than bonds. The 10 years is starting to get below t bills which should allow the government to clock in on lower rates for 10 years before inflation kicks in from growth.

The big question: does the Fed do QE or Congress need to pass anything to help kickstart the next growth cycle.

I agree with you, the yield curve is inverted, plus they want lower long term rates for the deficit, for housing and real estate in general.
 
They are bills because the government was getting better rates on bills than bonds. The 10 years is starting to get below t bills which should allow the government to clock in on lower rates for 10 years before inflation kicks in from growth.

The big question: does the Fed do QE or Congress need to pass anything to help kickstart the next growth cycle.
Sure, that's true, but another reason Yellen did so much bill issuance was to avoid blowing out the 10yr yield which would have sent mortgage rates even higher. My point here is this:
1. This isn't some sort of 4-D chess plan to bring long rates down to refinance debt. The last time SPY & QQQ were at current price levels (open on 08/05/24) the 10yr yield was 30 BPS lower. If this is being done on purpose, it isn't being done well, as long rates are higher than they were then (when there was no plan), and much more equity wealth has been wiped away since SPY and QQQ rallied 7-9% above their pre August '24 swoon highs.​
2. Terming out the expiring debt from bills to 10+ yr debt would spike yields quite substantially, which would raise mortgage rates. Bessent mentioned today that long rates going down should lead to a spike in mortgage applications/refis as those rates go down. They want more people to be able to buy homes. Terming out the debt is counter to that goal.​
3. Inducing a recession to refinance debt is a bonkers idea. Can we save money on future debt service costs? Sure a bit. Would we save more money than Treasury loses in tax receipts? I would wager no. Is it possible a "controlled demolition" spirals out of control? Yes.​
Stanley Druckenmiller's criticism of Biden/Yellen (where I believe all this stems from) was sound, IMO. They were derelict in not terming out the debt, as they had ~14 months when the economy was fine with the 10yr yield trading below pre-covid levels (and 2-300 BPS below where it is now)

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The Fed isn't going to do anything until credit markets break down and/or unemployment becomes an issue. At Trump's inauguration high-yield spreads were at their lowest level since before the GFC. They've gone up since then, but if history is any guide when they go up from as low of a base as they did now, in '97, and in '07 (dates may not be perfect am on phone) they have to rise to much higher levels than they're at now to cause the sort of stress that will get the Fed's attention. I think the health of the credit markets is a big reason why the Trump admin is swinging for the fences here. They do not care about highly levered speculators blowing up in equities, and they think they won't suffer much of a political hit from supporters who own equities because those folks will see lower energy costs and can get cheaper mortgages/refi them.

The tax cuts bill in Congress should help a bit, but without more certainty the immediacy of any growth effect will likely be more muted than in the first term as corporations will be disinclined to spend capital in such an uncertain environment.
 
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Not all tariffs are bad. Over the long term, some tariffs can help by pushing companies to bring production onshore and build more within the US. The problem with tariffs on EVERYTHING is that bringing production onshore for EVERYTHING is not feasible even in the long term. Even with goods it makes sense to bring onshore, a tariff will cause a temporary increase in cost of developing the product (which likely gets passed down to the consumer). But again, one could reasonably think that this is good in the long term. Another benefit could be punishing another country (e.g., we have sanctions on Russia and North Korea and I believe we do little to no trade with them).

The only hope is that Trump is using this purely as a negotiating tactic and will remove most of these added tariffs shortly. The risk is if not enough countries budge and his options are remove the tariffs and completely embarrass himself or push us deep into a recession.
Agree. What we have here is a good ole’ fashioned game of “chicken” and nobody wants to blink first. We’re still in the very early stages of this and you have to believe common sense and reason will eventually win out. No politician wants the markets crashing like this on their watch, or even worse a recession/depression. I’m still holding out hope this is one giant bluff by Trump. If so, well played Sir. If not, this is absolute insanity. Like you said, small, targeted tariffs make sense, but to target all products and every country is bat-**** crazy. Contrary to popular belief, little Jimmy and Joey won’t be lining up to make clothing or shoes for minimum wage in America.
 
SIAP>

Per the WSJ, Bill Ackman, the billionaire hedge-fund manager behind Pershing Square, called for a 90-day pause in the tariffs to negotiate with other countries, warning that the alternative was “a self-induced, economic nuclear winter.”

“We are in the process of destroying confidence in our country as a trading partner, as a place to do business, and as a market to invest capital,” Ackman wrote in a social-media post on X.

Ackman's been very pro-Trump for the last year or so, until now. Doesn't sound like Elon is really supportive of Trump's tariff approach either.
 
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They are bills because the government was getting better rates on bills than bonds. The 10 years is starting to get below t bills which should allow the government to clock in on lower rates for 10 years before inflation kicks in from growth.

The big question: does the Fed do QE or Congress need to pass anything to help kickstart the next growth cycle.
2 hours ago — “The recent tariffs will likely increase inflation and are causing many to consider a greater probability of a recession,” Dimon warned in his ...
I pick Congress for 500 Monte….the Fed won’t do anything soon.
 
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2 hours ago — “The recent tariffs will likely increase inflation and are causing many to consider a greater probability of a recession,” Dimon warned in his ...
I pick Congress for 500 Monte….the Fed won’t do anything soon.
“In the short run, I see this as one large additional straw on the camel’s back.”

Looks like he is saying Biden’s economy wasn’t strong like you keep saying.
 
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“In the short run, I see this as one large additional straw on the camel’s back.”

Looks like he is saying Biden’s economy wasn’t strong like you keep saying.
Dimon complained about debt. Let’s see where the debt is when Trump leaves. Reagan couldn’t do it. Be careful what you wish for. However, he will keep his tax cuts.
If Trump declares victory and pulls back the tariffs, I believe we get a V shaped recovery. Hopefully he can be convinced..
 
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