So about that Dade/Broward/Palm Beach talent ...

Yet more proof that while the LA, Atlanta, Dallas and Houston areas produce a lot really good football talent, Greater Miami is on a whole different level.

Standard Swag commentary follows, skip if you've heard this before....

Miami is definitely the top metro area in America for producing talent and I don't think it's particularly close, but this stat is apples and oranges with regards to DFW/Houston. Dallas and Houston kids don't get to transfer wherever they want like kids do in South Florida & almost every other school on that list (mad props to Glades Central). DFW powerhouses are lucky to get 1 impact transfer a season, and those are heavily scrutinized in the media, and often get vetoed by the school the kid left or flat out overturned by the UIL. The head coach at Desoto (which is on that list) is about to get ran out of town after winning the school's first state championship because the community is ****ed off at him trying to bring in outsider kids into the school (he supposedly found a QB/WR duo from Louisiana - allegedly). The school board has been in gridlock for over a week now after half of them tried to get him ousted. Texas football is much more community driven and the people - for the most part - don't want the mercenary programs. There's a price to pay for that - you don't see the schools with 15 D1 kids appear on their rosters as soon as they hire a Roland Smith or Ice Harris type guy - but it's also much better in some ways as well.

Let's be real - with the money and emphasis on football in DFW & GHA, if the rules got abolished and things got opened up with recruiting & private schools like they are in Florida, you would see STA type-factories all over Texas, too... not to mention, the inner city schools would get to come back, too. To the same degree as SoFla? Who knows, but the list would look a whole lot different.

I'm with you Miami metro is definitely the top metro area for producing fball talent. But man I've always been amazed by Florida's crazy transfer policy. I went to HS in Michigan where if you transfer to a school you have to sit out a whole academic year of sports from the time you transfer (like college). This leads to the only kids transferring high schools being kids that don't play/care much about sports. The kids that grow up playing in ****** districts just do school of choice when transitioning from middle school to high school to make sure they play at a bigger school. This is frustrating in a sense because I do think that kids should be able to play sports at whatever school they want to attend.

On the other hand, I think the mercenary/free agent culture of SoFla sports is not good for the kids. I mean how many kids have we seen through the years on here whose transcripts are so jacked up from attending 4 different schools in 4 years. It's insane. There has to be some sort of good middle ground.
 
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The ridiculous transfer rules in Florida are mostly a recent thing. When I was in high school in the 90's you couldn't transfer from one public school to another unless you moved or could prove residence in another district. The private schools always poached the top guys though. STA always had the top talent but at the time Cardinal Gibbons was a big player in "recruiting" local athletic talent. They've since stepped back from athletic "recruiting" but it hasn't stopped schools like Heritage and previously, University School from doing the same thing.
 
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Lots of good points here, but a couple things ...

1. You point out that high school football in Texas is community driven, which in conjunction with a very powerful HS Football Coaches Association and strict rules enforcement by the UIL (the Texas equivalent of the FHSAA), transfers are very limited.

That, of course, is the opposite of the free-for-all we see in Florida high school football.

BUT ... my question is this: If kids aren't allowed to transfer, why AREN'T inner-city schools in Houston and Dallas doing well? They're not losing kids right, other than a handful getting pulled by the non-UIL elite private high schools in those areas.

Where are former powerhouses like Dallas Carter or Houston Yates? They — or any other "inner city" schools — are nowhere to be found among the elite teams of the last couple decades

Football is absolutely dead in Dallas ISD, Fort Worth ISD, and Houston ISD. The power moved out to the suburbs in the mid 90s and will never come back barring major changes. Parents with the means found that they could move out to the suburbs legally by buying property in those places and moving their families (these aren't usually many of the inner city high D1 type kids, they're the D2 type kids who are great high school players with involved football-loving parents that can afford to legitimately uproot their family and buy property in the correct ISD when the kids are in grade school) and beat the inner city schools with just way better coaching and facilities combined with huge parental involvement. I have a family member who coaches at Southlake Carroll and it's not unusual for 3 or 4 kids in every single grade to have their own private QB coach as soon as they're playing flag football.

This disparity in resources and ability to bunch up talent was compounded by the huge no-pass/no-play emphasis that leaves so many inner city kids ineligible and got highlighted by news outlets in the late 90s and early 00s. Grades scandals at some of the inner city powerhouses put a giant spotlight on grade fixing and it became impossible (sort of like Miami being unable to drop bags because the NCAA holds us to the flame). The Carter and Yates types found themselves less and less competitive as grades casualties and suburban schools took hold. That really cemented the die off of inner city football in DFW and Houston. It sounds lame, but the no-huddle really hurt the inner city schools as well. Back when Art Briles, Sam Harrell, Todd Dodge, Que Brittain, and other head coaches of primarily white or suburban schools started throwing the ball 50 times a game in the late 90s/early 00s with plays coming directly from the sideline up tempo, they just started beating the tar out of some traditional powers via Xs and Os when those schools' staffs were outcoached. That stuff really blew up around the same time as the suburban flight and the grades stuff, so it all just compounded really quickly and the shift of power was complete.

These schools are not even CLOSE to competitive these days - if you play a DISD, HISD, or FWISD school and you are decent, you're winning by 50. Back in the old days, good football players in Dallas would go to Carter or a few others and they would ball out. Without the ability to play the kids with marginal grades or bunch up the best kids on the same teams Central/BTW/Southridge style, they just aren't as good. Coaches do NOT want to go coach anywhere near these inner city schools and it's avoided at all costs. Without the ability to recruit, you are just signing up for a lot of 2-8 seasons with kids who are half-hearted discipline problems and go into every significant game knowing they won't win. Inner city kids do not want to come out and play for loser programs. It has nothing to do with basketball emphasis. Texans don't give a **** about basketball, relatively speaking. There is no telling how much talent is just wasted in the Dallas and Houston ISDs every single year.
 
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Yet more proof that while the LA, Atlanta, Dallas and Houston areas produce a lot really good football talent, Greater Miami is on a whole different level.

Standard Swag commentary follows, skip if you've heard this before....

Miami is definitely the top metro area in America for producing talent and I don't think it's particularly close, but this stat is apples and oranges with regards to DFW/Houston. Dallas and Houston kids don't get to transfer wherever they want like kids do in South Florida & almost every other school on that list (mad props to Glades Central). DFW powerhouses are lucky to get 1 impact transfer a season, and those are heavily scrutinized in the media, and often get vetoed by the school the kid left or flat out overturned by the UIL. The head coach at Desoto (which is on that list) is about to get ran out of town after winning the school's first state championship because the community is ****ed off at him trying to bring in outsider kids into the school (he supposedly found a QB/WR duo from Louisiana - allegedly). The school board has been in gridlock for over a week now after half of them tried to get him ousted. Texas football is much more community driven and the people - for the most part - don't want the mercenary programs. There's a price to pay for that - you don't see the schools with 15 D1 kids appear on their rosters as soon as they hire a Roland Smith or Ice Harris type guy - but it's also much better in some ways as well.

Let's be real - with the money and emphasis on football in DFW & GHA, if the rules got abolished and things got opened up with recruiting & private schools like they are in Florida, you would see STA type-factories all over Texas, too... not to mention, the inner city schools would get to come back, too. To the same degree as SoFla? Who knows, but the list would look a whole lot different.


Naw...I got cousins that went to Dallas Carter and they had tons of transfers.

Same thing with Kyler Murray's high school team.
 
Yet more proof that while the LA, Atlanta, Dallas and Houston areas produce a lot really good football talent, Greater Miami is on a whole different level.

Standard Swag commentary follows, skip if you've heard this before....

Miami is definitely the top metro area in America for producing talent and I don't think it's particularly close, but this stat is apples and oranges with regards to DFW/Houston. Dallas and Houston kids don't get to transfer wherever they want like kids do in South Florida & almost every other school on that list (mad props to Glades Central). DFW powerhouses are lucky to get 1 impact transfer a season, and those are heavily scrutinized in the media, and often get vetoed by the school the kid left or flat out overturned by the UIL. The head coach at Desoto (which is on that list) is about to get ran out of town after winning the school's first state championship because the community is ****ed off at him trying to bring in outsider kids into the school (he supposedly found a QB/WR duo from Louisiana - allegedly). The school board has been in gridlock for over a week now after half of them tried to get him ousted. Texas football is much more community driven and the people - for the most part - don't want the mercenary programs. There's a price to pay for that - you don't see the schools with 15 D1 kids appear on their rosters as soon as they hire a Roland Smith or Ice Harris type guy - but it's also much better in some ways as well.

Let's be real - with the money and emphasis on football in DFW & GHA, if the rules got abolished and things got opened up with recruiting & private schools like they are in Florida, you would see STA type-factories all over Texas, too... not to mention, the inner city schools would get to come back, too. To the same degree as SoFla? Who knows, but the list would look a whole lot different.


Naw...I got cousins that went to Dallas Carter and they had tons of transfers.

Same thing with Kyler Murray's high school team.

What year did they go to Carter? Carter hasn't been significant in 20+ years.

Allen does get some transfers - typically the wealthy parents D2 type guys whose families pick up and buy a house in Allen ISD. Kyler himself was a transfer - his parents purchased a residence in Allen ISD to make it possible. I'm not suggesting transfers do not happen at all in Texas, you're missing the mark. You can't block transfers when people commit to buying a house in an ISD. I'm talking about wholesale, D1 types moving to and fro at will, particularly in the inner cities which is the major driver of high D1/NFL talent. There is absolutely no comparison between what happens at Allen and what happens at BTW, Central, STA, Southridge, etc. The closest comparison to those type of schools in Texas is Desoto which has been very fortunate to not get several high profile transfers blocked - and it shows, they are on the list. Southlake, Katy, Desoto, Duncanville, are 4 schools in the last 2 years off the top of my head who have had transfer candidates denied after being found to be driven by athletics. Southlake had to sit 2 kids after HIRING THEIR PARENT AS A COACH AT THE SCHOOL (this parent had legitimately coached at other schools for over a decade, it wasn't a hire just to get the kids, neither were college caliber football players). They actually had a coach on the staff whose 2 kids were living in Southlake and enrolled at Carroll but couldn't play. Meanwhile SoFla kids are hashtagging #blessed and announcing where they are taking their talents on Twitter.
 
Yet more proof that while the LA, Atlanta, Dallas and Houston areas produce a lot really good football talent, Greater Miami is on a whole different level.

Standard Swag commentary follows, skip if you've heard this before....

Miami is definitely the top metro area in America for producing talent and I don't think it's particularly close, but this stat is apples and oranges with regards to DFW/Houston. Dallas and Houston kids don't get to transfer wherever they want like kids do in South Florida & almost every other school on that list (mad props to Glades Central). DFW powerhouses are lucky to get 1 impact transfer a season, and those are heavily scrutinized in the media, and often get vetoed by the school the kid left or flat out overturned by the UIL. The head coach at Desoto (which is on that list) is about to get ran out of town after winning the school's first state championship because the community is ****ed off at him trying to bring in outsider kids into the school (he supposedly found a QB/WR duo from Louisiana - allegedly). The school board has been in gridlock for over a week now after half of them tried to get him ousted. Texas football is much more community driven and the people - for the most part - don't want the mercenary programs. There's a price to pay for that - you don't see the schools with 15 D1 kids appear on their rosters as soon as they hire a Roland Smith or Ice Harris type guy - but it's also much better in some ways as well.

Let's be real - with the money and emphasis on football in DFW & GHA, if the rules got abolished and things got opened up with recruiting & private schools like they are in Florida, you would see STA type-factories all over Texas, too... not to mention, the inner city schools would get to come back, too. To the same degree as SoFla? Who knows, but the list would look a whole lot different.


Naw...I got cousins that went to Dallas Carter and they had tons of transfers.

Same thing with Kyler Murray's high school team.

What year did they go to Carter? Carter hasn't been significant in 20+ years.

Allen does get some transfers - typically the wealthy parents D2 type guys whose families pick up and buy a house in Allen ISD. Kyler himself was a transfer - his parents purchased a residence in Allen ISD to make it possible. I'm not suggesting transfers do not happen at all in Texas, you're missing the mark. You can't block transfers when people commit to buying a house in an ISD. I'm talking about wholesale, D1 types moving to and fro at will, particularly in the inner cities which is the major driver of high D1/NFL talent. There is absolutely no comparison between what happens at Allen and what happens at BTW, Central, STA, Southridge, etc. The closest comparison to those type of schools in Texas is Desoto which has been very fortunate to not get several high profile transfers blocked - and it shows, they are on the list. Southlake, Katy, Desoto, Duncanville, are 4 schools in the last 2 years off the top of my head who have had transfer candidates denied after being found to be driven by athletics. Southlake had to sit 2 kids after HIRING THEIR PARENT AS A COACH AT THE SCHOOL (this parent had legitimately coached at other schools for over a decade, it wasn't a hire just to get the kids, neither were college caliber football players). They actually had a coach on the staff whose 2 kids were living in Southlake and enrolled at Carroll but couldn't play. Meanwhile SoFla kids are hashtagging #blessed and announcing where they are taking their talents on Twitter.

They played at Carter in the late 90's to Mid 2000's.
 
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Crazy. Some kids here will transfer away from the suburban schools because the football program sucks and they have a better chance to earn a scholarship at a powerhouse. Ryan Williams playing at Miramar is a good example. I believe he was supposed to attend Flanagan but at the time Flanagan had a joke football program and he wanted to play somewhere he would be able to impress scouts.
 
This is one subject I refuse to debate anybody about. (which is rare)

The evidence is overwhelming.

Nobody in the country plays football like we do in South Florida.


I knew Andrew was coming.....Macho Metro atl Football is pretty good....But I don't even know why folks try to debate this thing...its a proven fact...
 
Just to add:

I think the biggest difference is that football is unquestionably the No. 1 sport in inner-city Miami — no ifs, ands or buts about it.

There's really no other major city in America like it.

I think basketball has made big in-roads in both Dallas and Houston -- just look how many NBA players and college stars come from those two places.

It only follows to reason that more and more inner city kids in Texas are focusing on basketball.

I don't know DFW, but in ATL you don't see inner city schools win at football because they can't compete for coaches that single HS districts can. Looking at the 8 teams that won state last year, only one would I not send my kid too (Cedar Grove).

you should see the sh*t show in South Florida as coaches.....yet they still kick ***....IDK Drew...APS football for the most part wasn't that good when I lived in ATL BACK in 2002....around that time Parkview (outskirts), Stephenson (metro -outskirts) were hoarding talent...I think Westlake , Doug, Mays, Washington were solid teams then.
 
Anyone else surprised Norland is that high on the list?

naw the school is located on carol city border...they now call is (Miami Gardens)....That area has probably the best Optomist Programs in Dade County which leads to a good feeder program for Norland, CC, Miramar (Broward)...Even when they SUCK....they usually have talent. Like them having Antonio Brown running around at QB
 
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Lots of good points here, but a couple things ...

1. You point out that high school football in Texas is community driven, which in conjunction with a very powerful HS Football Coaches Association and strict rules enforcement by the UIL (the Texas equivalent of the FHSAA), transfers are very limited.

That, of course, is the opposite of the free-for-all we see in Florida high school football.

BUT ... my question is this: If kids aren't allowed to transfer, why AREN'T inner-city schools in Houston and Dallas doing well? They're not losing kids right, other than a handful getting pulled by the non-UIL elite private high schools in those areas.

Where are former powerhouses like Dallas Carter or Houston Yates? They — or any other "inner city" schools — are nowhere to be found among the elite teams of the last couple decades

Football is absolutely dead in Dallas ISD, Fort Worth ISD, and Houston ISD. The power moved out to the suburbs in the mid 90s and will never come back barring major changes. Parents with the means found that they could move out to the suburbs legally by buying property in those places and moving their families (these aren't usually many of the inner city high D1 type kids, they're the D2 type kids who are great high school players with involved football-loving parents that can afford to legitimately uproot their family and buy property in the correct ISD when the kids are in grade school) and beat the inner city schools with just way better coaching and facilities combined with huge parental involvement. I have a family member who coaches at Southlake Carroll and it's not unusual for 3 or 4 kids in every single grade to have their own private QB coach as soon as they're playing flag football.

This disparity in resources and ability to bunch up talent was compounded by the huge no-pass/no-play emphasis that leaves so many inner city kids ineligible and got highlighted by news outlets in the late 90s and early 00s. Grades scandals at some of the inner city powerhouses put a giant spotlight on grade fixing and it became impossible (sort of like Miami being unable to drop bags because the NCAA holds us to the flame). The Carter and Yates types found themselves less and less competitive as grades casualties and suburban schools took hold. That really cemented the die off of inner city football in DFW and Houston. It sounds lame, but the no-huddle really hurt the inner city schools as well. Back when Art Briles, Sam Harrell, Todd Dodge, Que Brittain, and other head coaches of primarily white or suburban schools started throwing the ball 50 times a game in the late 90s/early 00s with plays coming directly from the sideline up tempo, they just started beating the tar out of some traditional powers via Xs and Os when those schools' staffs were outcoached. That stuff really blew up around the same time as the suburban flight and the grades stuff, so it all just compounded really quickly and the shift of power was complete.

These schools are not even CLOSE to competitive these days - if you play a DISD, HISD, or FWISD school and you are decent, you're winning by 50. Back in the old days, good football players in Dallas would go to Carter or a few others and they would ball out. Without the ability to play the kids with marginal grades or bunch up the best kids on the same teams Central/BTW/Southridge style, they just aren't as good. Coaches do NOT want to go coach anywhere near these inner city schools and it's avoided at all costs. Without the ability to recruit, you are just signing up for a lot of 2-8 seasons with kids who are half-hearted discipline problems and go into every significant game knowing they won't win. Inner city kids do not want to come out and play for loser programs. It has nothing to do with basketball emphasis. Texans don't give a **** about basketball, relatively speaking. There is no telling how much talent is just wasted in the Dallas and Houston ISDs every single year.

Not to go too hard on you swag, but it is exactly what I thought it was...and what I have seen with their college programs.

These tX team/kids are now SOFT. The bolded regardless would never happen in S.FLA...football means too much. Win or lose they will play and continue to go at it.

Kids give their all against STA weekly knowing they are at a competitive disadvantage but want to show out in front of a scout.
 
Lots of good points here, but a couple things ...

1. You point out that high school football in Texas is community driven, which in conjunction with a very powerful HS Football Coaches Association and strict rules enforcement by the UIL (the Texas equivalent of the FHSAA), transfers are very limited.

That, of course, is the opposite of the free-for-all we see in Florida high school football.

BUT ... my question is this: If kids aren't allowed to transfer, why AREN'T inner-city schools in Houston and Dallas doing well? They're not losing kids right, other than a handful getting pulled by the non-UIL elite private high schools in those areas.

Where are former powerhouses like Dallas Carter or Houston Yates? They — or any other "inner city" schools — are nowhere to be found among the elite teams of the last couple decades

Football is absolutely dead in Dallas ISD, Fort Worth ISD, and Houston ISD. The power moved out to the suburbs in the mid 90s and will never come back barring major changes. Parents with the means found that they could move out to the suburbs legally by buying property in those places and moving their families (these aren't usually many of the inner city high D1 type kids, they're the D2 type kids who are great high school players with involved football-loving parents that can afford to legitimately uproot their family and buy property in the correct ISD when the kids are in grade school) and beat the inner city schools with just way better coaching and facilities combined with huge parental involvement. I have a family member who coaches at Southlake Carroll and it's not unusual for 3 or 4 kids in every single grade to have their own private QB coach as soon as they're playing flag football.

This disparity in resources and ability to bunch up talent was compounded by the huge no-pass/no-play emphasis that leaves so many inner city kids ineligible and got highlighted by news outlets in the late 90s and early 00s. Grades scandals at some of the inner city powerhouses put a giant spotlight on grade fixing and it became impossible (sort of like Miami being unable to drop bags because the NCAA holds us to the flame). The Carter and Yates types found themselves less and less competitive as grades casualties and suburban schools took hold. That really cemented the die off of inner city football in DFW and Houston. It sounds lame, but the no-huddle really hurt the inner city schools as well. Back when Art Briles, Sam Harrell, Todd Dodge, Que Brittain, and other head coaches of primarily white or suburban schools started throwing the ball 50 times a game in the late 90s/early 00s with plays coming directly from the sideline up tempo, they just started beating the tar out of some traditional powers via Xs and Os when those schools' staffs were outcoached. That stuff really blew up around the same time as the suburban flight and the grades stuff, so it all just compounded really quickly and the shift of power was complete.

These schools are not even CLOSE to competitive these days - if you play a DISD, HISD, or FWISD school and you are decent, you're winning by 50. Back in the old days, good football players in Dallas would go to Carter or a few others and they would ball out. Without the ability to play the kids with marginal grades or bunch up the best kids on the same teams Central/BTW/Southridge style, they just aren't as good. Coaches do NOT want to go coach anywhere near these inner city schools and it's avoided at all costs. Without the ability to recruit, you are just signing up for a lot of 2-8 seasons with kids who are half-hearted discipline problems and go into every significant game knowing they won't win. Inner city kids do not want to come out and play for loser programs. It has nothing to do with basketball emphasis. Texans don't give a **** about basketball, relatively speaking. There is no telling how much talent is just wasted in the Dallas and Houston ISDs every single year.

Not to go too hard on you swag, but it is exactly what I thought it was...and what I have seen with their college programs.

These tX team/kids are now SOFT. The bolded regardless would never happen in S.FLA...football means too much. Win or lose they will play and continue to go at it.

Kids give their all against STA weekly knowing they are at a competitive disadvantage but want to show out in front of a scout.

Then why are the SoFla kids flocking in droves to the same handful of winners every spring? I love you guys, but you're crazy thinking you have a monopoly on passion for football. Come to a few games over here sometime and watch a town close down. Did Houston look soft busting FSU in the mouth? College success is about coaching and quarterbacks. Art Briles, Tom Herman, and Gary Patterson proved that, winning at never-has-been/never-will-be programs with tier 3 Texas kids.
 
Lots of good points here, but a couple things ...

1. You point out that high school football in Texas is community driven, which in conjunction with a very powerful HS Football Coaches Association and strict rules enforcement by the UIL (the Texas equivalent of the FHSAA), transfers are very limited.

That, of course, is the opposite of the free-for-all we see in Florida high school football.

BUT ... my question is this: If kids aren't allowed to transfer, why AREN'T inner-city schools in Houston and Dallas doing well? They're not losing kids right, other than a handful getting pulled by the non-UIL elite private high schools in those areas.

Where are former powerhouses like Dallas Carter or Houston Yates? They — or any other "inner city" schools — are nowhere to be found among the elite teams of the last couple decades

Football is absolutely dead in Dallas ISD, Fort Worth ISD, and Houston ISD. The power moved out to the suburbs in the mid 90s and will never come back barring major changes. Parents with the means found that they could move out to the suburbs legally by buying property in those places and moving their families (these aren't usually many of the inner city high D1 type kids, they're the D2 type kids who are great high school players with involved football-loving parents that can afford to legitimately uproot their family and buy property in the correct ISD when the kids are in grade school) and beat the inner city schools with just way better coaching and facilities combined with huge parental involvement. I have a family member who coaches at Southlake Carroll and it's not unusual for 3 or 4 kids in every single grade to have their own private QB coach as soon as they're playing flag football.

This disparity in resources and ability to bunch up talent was compounded by the huge no-pass/no-play emphasis that leaves so many inner city kids ineligible and got highlighted by news outlets in the late 90s and early 00s. Grades scandals at some of the inner city powerhouses put a giant spotlight on grade fixing and it became impossible (sort of like Miami being unable to drop bags because the NCAA holds us to the flame). The Carter and Yates types found themselves less and less competitive as grades casualties and suburban schools took hold. That really cemented the die off of inner city football in DFW and Houston. It sounds lame, but the no-huddle really hurt the inner city schools as well. Back when Art Briles, Sam Harrell, Todd Dodge, Que Brittain, and other head coaches of primarily white or suburban schools started throwing the ball 50 times a game in the late 90s/early 00s with plays coming directly from the sideline up tempo, they just started beating the tar out of some traditional powers via Xs and Os when those schools' staffs were outcoached. That stuff really blew up around the same time as the suburban flight and the grades stuff, so it all just compounded really quickly and the shift of power was complete.

These schools are not even CLOSE to competitive these days - if you play a DISD, HISD, or FWISD school and you are decent, you're winning by 50. Back in the old days, good football players in Dallas would go to Carter or a few others and they would ball out. Without the ability to play the kids with marginal grades or bunch up the best kids on the same teams Central/BTW/Southridge style, they just aren't as good. Coaches do NOT want to go coach anywhere near these inner city schools and it's avoided at all costs. Without the ability to recruit, you are just signing up for a lot of 2-8 seasons with kids who are half-hearted discipline problems and go into every significant game knowing they won't win. Inner city kids do not want to come out and play for loser programs. It has nothing to do with basketball emphasis. Texans don't give a **** about basketball, relatively speaking. There is no telling how much talent is just wasted in the Dallas and Houston ISDs every single year.

Not to go too hard on you swag, but it is exactly what I thought it was...and what I have seen with their college programs.

These tX team/kids are now SOFT. The bolded regardless would never happen in S.FLA...football means too much. Win or lose they will play and continue to go at it.

Kids give their all against STA weekly knowing they are at a competitive disadvantage but want to show out in front of a scout.

Then why are the SoFla kids flocking in droves to the same handful of winners every spring? I love you guys, but you're crazy thinking you have a monopoly on passion for football. Come to a few games over here sometime and watch a town close down. Did Houston look soft busting FSU in the mouth? College success is about coaching and quarterbacks. Art Briles, Tom Herman, and Gary Patterson proved that, winning at never-has-been/never-will-be programs with tier 3 Texas kids.

You do MNW, Central and Norland all get talent from the same area, right? It's not a case of players flocking from all over South Florida to those schools. They are all sharing talent from the same part of Miami. Despite that fact they are 3 of the top 5 teams on that list.
 
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Lots of good points here, but a couple things ...

1. You point out that high school football in Texas is community driven, which in conjunction with a very powerful HS Football Coaches Association and strict rules enforcement by the UIL (the Texas equivalent of the FHSAA), transfers are very limited.

That, of course, is the opposite of the free-for-all we see in Florida high school football.

BUT ... my question is this: If kids aren't allowed to transfer, why AREN'T inner-city schools in Houston and Dallas doing well? They're not losing kids right, other than a handful getting pulled by the non-UIL elite private high schools in those areas.

Where are former powerhouses like Dallas Carter or Houston Yates? They — or any other "inner city" schools — are nowhere to be found among the elite teams of the last couple decades

Football is absolutely dead in Dallas ISD, Fort Worth ISD, and Houston ISD. The power moved out to the suburbs in the mid 90s and will never come back barring major changes. Parents with the means found that they could move out to the suburbs legally by buying property in those places and moving their families (these aren't usually many of the inner city high D1 type kids, they're the D2 type kids who are great high school players with involved football-loving parents that can afford to legitimately uproot their family and buy property in the correct ISD when the kids are in grade school) and beat the inner city schools with just way better coaching and facilities combined with huge parental involvement. I have a family member who coaches at Southlake Carroll and it's not unusual for 3 or 4 kids in every single grade to have their own private QB coach as soon as they're playing flag football.

This disparity in resources and ability to bunch up talent was compounded by the huge no-pass/no-play emphasis that leaves so many inner city kids ineligible and got highlighted by news outlets in the late 90s and early 00s. Grades scandals at some of the inner city powerhouses put a giant spotlight on grade fixing and it became impossible (sort of like Miami being unable to drop bags because the NCAA holds us to the flame). The Carter and Yates types found themselves less and less competitive as grades casualties and suburban schools took hold. That really cemented the die off of inner city football in DFW and Houston. It sounds lame, but the no-huddle really hurt the inner city schools as well. Back when Art Briles, Sam Harrell, Todd Dodge, Que Brittain, and other head coaches of primarily white or suburban schools started throwing the ball 50 times a game in the late 90s/early 00s with plays coming directly from the sideline up tempo, they just started beating the tar out of some traditional powers via Xs and Os when those schools' staffs were outcoached. That stuff really blew up around the same time as the suburban flight and the grades stuff, so it all just compounded really quickly and the shift of power was complete.

These schools are not even CLOSE to competitive these days - if you play a DISD, HISD, or FWISD school and you are decent, you're winning by 50. Back in the old days, good football players in Dallas would go to Carter or a few others and they would ball out. Without the ability to play the kids with marginal grades or bunch up the best kids on the same teams Central/BTW/Southridge style, they just aren't as good. Coaches do NOT want to go coach anywhere near these inner city schools and it's avoided at all costs. Without the ability to recruit, you are just signing up for a lot of 2-8 seasons with kids who are half-hearted discipline problems and go into every significant game knowing they won't win. Inner city kids do not want to come out and play for loser programs. It has nothing to do with basketball emphasis. Texans don't give a **** about basketball, relatively speaking. There is no telling how much talent is just wasted in the Dallas and Houston ISDs every single year.

Not to go too hard on you swag, but it is exactly what I thought it was...and what I have seen with their college programs.

These tX team/kids are now SOFT. The bolded regardless would never happen in S.FLA...football means too much. Win or lose they will play and continue to go at it.

Kids give their all against STA weekly knowing they are at a competitive disadvantage but want to show out in front of a scout.

Then why are the SoFla kids flocking in droves to the same handful of winners every spring? I love you guys, but you're crazy thinking you have a monopoly on passion for football. Come to a few games over here sometime and watch a town close down. Did Houston look soft busting FSU in the mouth? College success is about coaching and quarterbacks. Art Briles, Tom Herman, and Gary Patterson proved that, winning at never-has-been/never-will-be programs with tier 3 Texas kids.

You do MNW, Central and Norland all get talent from the same area, right? It's not a case of players flocking from all over South Florida to those schools. They are all sharing talent from the same part of Miami. Despite that fact they are 3 of the top 5 teams on that list.

Of course. The second sentence in my original post about Miami is one that some of you guys like to think that I don't get just because I point out the differences.

Miami's unrivaled. Texas just has some major hinderances that don't help them on a list like OP posted, I was pointing those things out. It really is apples/oranges. Check out the NFL draft - there are kids I know personally who got tackled by the #1 , #3 , and #6 overall draftpicks. All 3 went to schools that never win anything significant and are within a 15 minute drive of each other. With Florida rules, decent chance at least 2 of those guys would have played on the same team. Instead, they each individually played for 3 average programs that don't have a prayer of ever ending up on these lists.
 
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Lots of good points here, but a couple things ...

1. You point out that high school football in Texas is community driven, which in conjunction with a very powerful HS Football Coaches Association and strict rules enforcement by the UIL (the Texas equivalent of the FHSAA), transfers are very limited.

That, of course, is the opposite of the free-for-all we see in Florida high school football.

BUT ... my question is this: If kids aren't allowed to transfer, why AREN'T inner-city schools in Houston and Dallas doing well? They're not losing kids right, other than a handful getting pulled by the non-UIL elite private high schools in those areas.

Where are former powerhouses like Dallas Carter or Houston Yates? They — or any other "inner city" schools — are nowhere to be found among the elite teams of the last couple decades

Football is absolutely dead in Dallas ISD, Fort Worth ISD, and Houston ISD. The power moved out to the suburbs in the mid 90s and will never come back barring major changes. Parents with the means found that they could move out to the suburbs legally by buying property in those places and moving their families (these aren't usually many of the inner city high D1 type kids, they're the D2 type kids who are great high school players with involved football-loving parents that can afford to legitimately uproot their family and buy property in the correct ISD when the kids are in grade school) and beat the inner city schools with just way better coaching and facilities combined with huge parental involvement. I have a family member who coaches at Southlake Carroll and it's not unusual for 3 or 4 kids in every single grade to have their own private QB coach as soon as they're playing flag football.

This disparity in resources and ability to bunch up talent was compounded by the huge no-pass/no-play emphasis that leaves so many inner city kids ineligible and got highlighted by news outlets in the late 90s and early 00s. Grades scandals at some of the inner city powerhouses put a giant spotlight on grade fixing and it became impossible (sort of like Miami being unable to drop bags because the NCAA holds us to the flame). The Carter and Yates types found themselves less and less competitive as grades casualties and suburban schools took hold. That really cemented the die off of inner city football in DFW and Houston. It sounds lame, but the no-huddle really hurt the inner city schools as well. Back when Art Briles, Sam Harrell, Todd Dodge, Que Brittain, and other head coaches of primarily white or suburban schools started throwing the ball 50 times a game in the late 90s/early 00s with plays coming directly from the sideline up tempo, they just started beating the tar out of some traditional powers via Xs and Os when those schools' staffs were outcoached. That stuff really blew up around the same time as the suburban flight and the grades stuff, so it all just compounded really quickly and the shift of power was complete.

These schools are not even CLOSE to competitive these days - if you play a DISD, HISD, or FWISD school and you are decent, you're winning by 50. Back in the old days, good football players in Dallas would go to Carter or a few others and they would ball out. Without the ability to play the kids with marginal grades or bunch up the best kids on the same teams Central/BTW/Southridge style, they just aren't as good. Coaches do NOT want to go coach anywhere near these inner city schools and it's avoided at all costs. Without the ability to recruit, you are just signing up for a lot of 2-8 seasons with kids who are half-hearted discipline problems and go into every significant game knowing they won't win. Inner city kids do not want to come out and play for loser programs. It has nothing to do with basketball emphasis. Texans don't give a **** about basketball, relatively speaking. There is no telling how much talent is just wasted in the Dallas and Houston ISDs every single year.

Not to go too hard on you swag, but it is exactly what I thought it was...and what I have seen with their college programs.

These tX team/kids are now SOFT. The bolded regardless would never happen in S.FLA...football means too much. Win or lose they will play and continue to go at it.

Kids give their all against STA weekly knowing they are at a competitive disadvantage but want to show out in front of a scout.

Then why are the SoFla kids flocking in droves to the same handful of winners every spring? I love you guys, but you're crazy thinking you have a monopoly on passion for football. Come to a few games over here sometime and watch a town close down. Did Houston look soft busting FSU in the mouth? College success is about coaching and quarterbacks. Art Briles, Tom Herman, and Gary Patterson proved that, winning at never-has-been/never-will-be programs with tier 3 Texas kids.

You do MNW, Central and Norland all get talent from the same area, right? It's not a case of players flocking from all over South Florida to those schools. They are all sharing talent from the same part of Miami. Despite that fact they are 3 of the top 5 teams on that list.


I really don't think they realize how close these schools are down here...Kids can literally walk from CC to Miramar...from MNW to Central...but I digest. Its not really hoarding of the talents, because the surrounding schools are STILLL competitors. It isn't what your saying is going on in TX...when WHOLE Inner City districts SUCK..thats just terrible.
 
Football is absolutely dead in Dallas ISD, Fort Worth ISD, and Houston ISD. The power moved out to the suburbs in the mid 90s and will never come back barring major changes. Parents with the means found that they could move out to the suburbs legally by buying property in those places and moving their families (these aren't usually many of the inner city high D1 type kids, they're the D2 type kids who are great high school players with involved football-loving parents that can afford to legitimately uproot their family and buy property in the correct ISD when the kids are in grade school) and beat the inner city schools with just way better coaching and facilities combined with huge parental involvement. I have a family member who coaches at Southlake Carroll and it's not unusual for 3 or 4 kids in every single grade to have their own private QB coach as soon as they're playing flag football.

This disparity in resources and ability to bunch up talent was compounded by the huge no-pass/no-play emphasis that leaves so many inner city kids ineligible and got highlighted by news outlets in the late 90s and early 00s. Grades scandals at some of the inner city powerhouses put a giant spotlight on grade fixing and it became impossible (sort of like Miami being unable to drop bags because the NCAA holds us to the flame). The Carter and Yates types found themselves less and less competitive as grades casualties and suburban schools took hold. That really cemented the die off of inner city football in DFW and Houston. It sounds lame, but the no-huddle really hurt the inner city schools as well. Back when Art Briles, Sam Harrell, Todd Dodge, Que Brittain, and other head coaches of primarily white or suburban schools started throwing the ball 50 times a game in the late 90s/early 00s with plays coming directly from the sideline up tempo, they just started beating the tar out of some traditional powers via Xs and Os when those schools' staffs were outcoached. That stuff really blew up around the same time as the suburban flight and the grades stuff, so it all just compounded really quickly and the shift of power was complete.

These schools are not even CLOSE to competitive these days - if you play a DISD, HISD, or FWISD school and you are decent, you're winning by 50. Back in the old days, good football players in Dallas would go to Carter or a few others and they would ball out. Without the ability to play the kids with marginal grades or bunch up the best kids on the same teams Central/BTW/Southridge style, they just aren't as good. Coaches do NOT want to go coach anywhere near these inner city schools and it's avoided at all costs. Without the ability to recruit, you are just signing up for a lot of 2-8 seasons with kids who are half-hearted discipline problems and go into every significant game knowing they won't win. Inner city kids do not want to come out and play for loser programs. It has nothing to do with basketball emphasis. Texans don't give a **** about basketball, relatively speaking. There is no telling how much talent is just wasted in the Dallas and Houston ISDs every single year.

Not to go too hard on you swag, but it is exactly what I thought it was...and what I have seen with their college programs.

These tX team/kids are now SOFT. The bolded regardless would never happen in S.FLA...football means too much. Win or lose they will play and continue to go at it.

Kids give their all against STA weekly knowing they are at a competitive disadvantage but want to show out in front of a scout.

Then why are the SoFla kids flocking in droves to the same handful of winners every spring? I love you guys, but you're crazy thinking you have a monopoly on passion for football. Come to a few games over here sometime and watch a town close down. Did Houston look soft busting FSU in the mouth? College success is about coaching and quarterbacks. Art Briles, Tom Herman, and Gary Patterson proved that, winning at never-has-been/never-will-be programs with tier 3 Texas kids.

You do MNW, Central and Norland all get talent from the same area, right? It's not a case of players flocking from all over South Florida to those schools. They are all sharing talent from the same part of Miami. Despite that fact they are 3 of the top 5 teams on that list.

Of course. The second sentence in my original post about Miami is one that some of you guys like to think that I don't get just because I point out the differences.

Miami's unrivaled. Texas just has some major hinderances that don't help them on a list like OP posted, I was pointing those things out. It really is apples/oranges. Check out the NFL draft - there are kids I know personally who got tackled by the #1 , #3 , and #6 overall draftpicks. All 3 went to schools that never win anything significant and are within a 10 mile radius. With Florida rules, decent chance at least 2 of those guys would have played on the same team.

You're talking out of both sides of your mouth though. It's not going unnoticed.
 
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