Patrick Joyner

[Cribby]

Very realistic.

And Miami is recruiting him strictly as a linebacker, not DE

Pete I hear he's always talking up fsu and recruiting for them on Twitter. Is there serious legit interest from him?

Joyner and Louis are my favorite lb's film in this class. I'd love to get at least one.

 

[TheToadSage]

I only know of 2 in the next class we are targeting, Brooks and Mikel Jones. Who are some others?

Samuel Brooks, Jesiah Pierre, Jeramy Passmore, Diamante Howard, Jahmar Brown, Anthony Solomon, Dorian Jones, Darius Williams, Joe Smith, James Gordon IV & more.

Not saying we're recruiting all of them, but those are some of the best available in FLA alone, not even mentioning some of the top OOS LB's for 2019 as well.

The 2019 LB class is loaded like the 2018 DB class.

Ahhh I forgot about them lol

 

[Bigtip]

I'm pretty sure it's been said that the staff wants two linebackers this class... Joyner and Rosendo Louis

As of now they are only looking at 1 in the class

Why not both? We are pretty thin after our top 3 right now

 

[The Franchise]

I'm pretty sure it's been said that the staff wants two linebackers this class... Joyner and Rosendo Louis

As of now they are only looking at 1 in the class

Why not both? We are pretty thin after our top 3 right now

We're not thin. We're young and unproven. But we're not thin. You don't fix young and unproven by bringing in more young and unproven guys.

 

[brock]

I'm pretty sure it's been said that the staff wants two linebackers this class... Joyner and Rosendo Louis

As of now they are only looking at 1 in the class

Why not both? We are pretty thin after our top 3 right now

We are not thin after our top 3

Pinckney
Owens
Gordinier
Steed

Quarterman
Smith
Jennings

Mccloud
Perry
Wilder
......

 

[AlaskaCane]

I'm pretty sure it's been said that the staff wants two linebackers this class... Joyner and Rosendo Louis

whats our chances of landing Rosendo?? i have seen predictions of him going elsewhere... to me we are not in crisis mode where we need 2 for this class with the crazy amount of talent at that position for next year but i will leave that one up to the staff, whatever they feel we need i will rock with it... we are young and unproven but the potential is there to do some serious damage sooner than later!!! keep our boys healthy out there and we will be good to go!!!


im hearing lost of chatter that Rosendo is better than Joyner and some say its actually kind of obvious... i think both are solid players and i would be happy having either one rocking Canes gear

 

[337CaneNation]

Adding Brooks would give us 3 LBs for Surge19' but I really think it would be best for the Storm18' class to get 2 LBs (ILB & OLB)!! To me it just makes more sense getting 2 and that would definitely give us depth because after the 2018 season, I think the 3 Amigos will be League bound!! BUT the Surge19' class will definitely be loaded at LB, so if Miami doesn't get the recruits they want this cycle next year they will have a bigger selection to pick from..

 

[brock]

Joyner just got offered by bama

 

[tyrn]

Anybody else see a pass rusher when they look at Joyner? I don't see a backer at all. Was really surprised a few months ago when I heard Miami was trying to sell him on the prospect of playing backer. FSU is recruiting him to have his hand in the dirt. Can this kid play in space?

And yes, I know Diaz knows a lot more than I do. Save that narrative. Just strikes me as a little odd that, even in a down year at the position, the only LB we're wanting to take is a pretty big question mark at the position.

He has movement skills and length and Miami has seen him up close in a camp setting to verify. Not sure he has the frame to really but a hand in the ground pass rusher at the next level.

Not saying Diaz is wrong or anything, but seeing him play in space in a camp setting is way different than playing a traditional OLB position where you have to read OLineman (whether they come out run blocking or drop into pass pro) then locate the ball and shed a block from those big OLinemen, FB or TE. This does not happen in a camp setting.

Having to do that all in a split second is why most pass rush specialists have such a hard time adjusting to playing LB.

I have seen way too many great South FL pass rushing tweeners (too small to play DE, but perfect body and speed for LB, but no experience or instincts at the position) come in here and try to learn to play LB for 4 years never to make a significant enough impact to be holding up the scholarship from a real LB.

Think of all the greatest LBs to play here.

None were DEs in HS, and most were undersized at under 6'2 205 coming in (Lewis, Vilma, Spence, Perryman).

I would personally rather see us take Rosendo Louis if it is between him and Joyner.

I really want Sherwood in this class, but it seems like we are pretty much out of it at this point since he has his heart set on playing Safety.



Side Note: It is much easier for a Safety to transition to LB, than a DE b/c Safeties make similar reads and also have to play in space and cover.
DEs just rush into the backfield.

 

[yeaman]

Is Rousseau a LB as well?

 

[Peter Ariz]

Is Rousseau a LB as well?

They're recruiting him as a DE. Kool sees him in the Jason Taylor mold.

 

[AUcane]

love OP name

 

[Combo]

Anybody else see a pass rusher when they look at Joyner? I don't see a backer at all. Was really surprised a few months ago when I heard Miami was trying to sell him on the prospect of playing backer. FSU is recruiting him to have his hand in the dirt. Can this kid play in space?

And yes, I know Diaz knows a lot more than I do. Save that narrative. Just strikes me as a little odd that, even in a down year at the position, the only LB we're wanting to take is a pretty big question mark at the position.

He has movement skills and length and Miami has seen him up close in a camp setting to verify. Not sure he has the frame to really but a hand in the ground pass rusher at the next level.

Not saying Diaz is wrong or anything, but seeing him play in space in a camp setting is way different than playing a traditional OLB position where you have to read OLineman (whether they come out run blocking or drop into pass pro) then locate the ball and shed a block from those big OLinemen, FB or TE. This does not happen in a camp setting.

Having to do that all in a split second is why most pass rush specialists have such a hard time adjusting to playing LB.

I have seen way too many great South FL pass rushing tweeners (too small to play DE, but perfect body and speed for LB, but no experience or instincts at the position) come in here and try to learn to play LB for 4 years never to make a significant enough impact to be holding up the scholarship from a real LB.

Think of all the greatest LBs to play here.

None were DEs in HS, and most were undersized at under 6'2 205 coming in (Lewis, Vilma, Spence, Perryman).

I would personally rather see us take Rosendo Louis if it is between him and Joyner.

I really want Sherwood in this class, but it seems like we are pretty much out of it at this point since he has his heart set on playing Safety.



Side Note: It is much easier for a Safety to transition to LB, than a DE b/c Safeties make similar reads and also have to play in space and cover.
DEs just rush into the backfield.

I agree 100%. Converting H.S. DEs to LB frequently doesn't work, no matter how talented and athletic they may be.

 

[Salt]

How realistic of a chance do we have of flipping him from Florida State, and how does he project for the next level, as he can play both linebacker and defensive end.


[video]http://www.hudl.com/v/23UhSs[/video]

Currently "committed" to FSU but 247 has him cb'd to Miami. Go figure.

Tape looks to be strictly rush type end. Maybe could be molded to play lb by good coaching. A lot has to do as well with body type and how these guys physically develop with strength and nutrition programs at next level. He may outgrow the lb position once in college.

There might be better lb prospects out there for us to go all in on him.

 

[D_Canes]

Anybody else see a pass rusher when they look at Joyner? I don't see a backer at all. Was really surprised a few months ago when I heard Miami was trying to sell him on the prospect of playing backer. FSU is recruiting him to have his hand in the dirt. Can this kid play in space?

And yes, I know Diaz knows a lot more than I do. Save that narrative. Just strikes me as a little odd that, even in a down year at the position, the only LB we're wanting to take is a pretty big question mark at the position.

He has movement skills and length and Miami has seen him up close in a camp setting to verify. Not sure he has the frame to really but a hand in the ground pass rusher at the next level.

Not saying Diaz is wrong or anything, but seeing him play in space in a camp setting is way different than playing a traditional OLB position where you have to read OLineman (whether they come out run blocking or drop into pass pro) then locate the ball and shed a block from those big OLinemen, FB or TE. This does not happen in a camp setting.

Having to do that all in a split second is why most pass rush specialists have such a hard time adjusting to playing LB.

I have seen way too many great South FL pass rushing tweeners (too small to play DE, but perfect body and speed for LB, but no experience or instincts at the position) come in here and try to learn to play LB for 4 years never to make a significant enough impact to be holding up the scholarship from a real LB.

Think of all the greatest LBs to play here.

None were DEs in HS, and most were undersized at under 6'2 205 coming in (Lewis, Vilma, Spence, Perryman).

I would personally rather see us take Rosendo Louis if it is between him and Joyner.

I really want Sherwood in this class, but it seems like we are pretty much out of it at this point since he has his heart set on playing Safety.



Side Note: It is much easier for a Safety to transition to LB, than a DE b/c Safeties make similar reads and also have to play in space and cover.
DEs just rush into the backfield.

Good post. And generally I agree...but did you watch his film? He shows ability to play in space. He's not a "plug-n-play" kid at LB, but we won't need him to be. What he is, is a kid we have to get. Give him the looks at LB and take it from there.

Based on his film, I agree with Diaz. He can be an explosive and fast LB here.

 

[TheMatador]

Is Rousseau a LB as well?

They're recruiting him as a DE. Kool sees him in the Jason Taylor mold.

How different is this current Miami defense from the defense installed thirty some years ago by Jimmy Johnson? To me, it seems not that much. I don't know if we run what used to be called the 4-3 slide, but I think the personnel concept is the same. What do I mean?

JJ once described his defense as a five LB defense. The two DE's were small and fast. Maybe they couldn't play in space as true LBs, but they could sure create havoc.

When Alonzo Highsmith finished at UM, JJ said he never would have switched Alonzo to RB. He talked about the idea of having Danny Stubbs and Alonzo with their hands on the ground and rushing the QB. To JJ, it would have been beyond belief, the kind of attacking they could do from that personnel lineup.

So, it seems to me, we might be returning to an emphasis on DE's who can really get upfield and force good plays. So, in a sense, it is not true four down linemen, it is emphasizing some fast guys outside.

 

[TheMatador]

Anybody else see a pass rusher when they look at Joyner? I don't see a backer at all. Was really surprised a few months ago when I heard Miami was trying to sell him on the prospect of playing backer. FSU is recruiting him to have his hand in the dirt. Can this kid play in space?

And yes, I know Diaz knows a lot more than I do. Save that narrative. Just strikes me as a little odd that, even in a down year at the position, the only LB we're wanting to take is a pretty big question mark at the position.

He has movement skills and length and Miami has seen him up close in a camp setting to verify. Not sure he has the frame to really but a hand in the ground pass rusher at the next level.

Not saying Diaz is wrong or anything, but seeing him play in space in a camp setting is way different than playing a traditional OLB position where you have to read OLineman (whether they come out run blocking or drop into pass pro) then locate the ball and shed a block from those big OLinemen, FB or TE. This does not happen in a camp setting.

Having to do that all in a split second is why most pass rush specialists have such a hard time adjusting to playing LB.

I have seen way too many great South FL pass rushing tweeners (too small to play DE, but perfect body and speed for LB, but no experience or instincts at the position) come in here and try to learn to play LB for 4 years never to make a significant enough impact to be holding up the scholarship from a real LB.

Think of all the greatest LBs to play here.

None were DEs in HS, and most were undersized at under 6'2 205 coming in (Lewis, Vilma, Spence, Perryman).

I would personally rather see us take Rosendo Louis if it is between him and Joyner.

I really want Sherwood in this class, but it seems like we are pretty much out of it at this point since he has his heart set on playing Safety.



Side Note: It is much easier for a Safety to transition to LB, than a DE b/c Safeties make similar reads and also have to play in space and cover.
DEs just rush into the backfield.

Good post. And generally I agree...but did you watch his film? He shows ability to play in space. He's not a "plug-n-play" kid at LB, but we won't need him to be. What he is, is a kid we have to get. Give him the looks at LB and take it from there.

Based on his film, I agree with Diaz. He can be an explosive and fast LB here.

Did John Square have the frame to put his hand on the ground? How much did he weigh? Not much more than 200, but he was quick and could get upfleid very fast.

Wasn't there a track guy, a little over 200 lbs that we made into a pass-rushing DE about ten or so years ago?

That was all before we brought in Golden and his passive defense.

 

[The Franchise]

Anybody else see a pass rusher when they look at Joyner? I don't see a backer at all. Was really surprised a few months ago when I heard Miami was trying to sell him on the prospect of playing backer. FSU is recruiting him to have his hand in the dirt. Can this kid play in space?

And yes, I know Diaz knows a lot more than I do. Save that narrative. Just strikes me as a little odd that, even in a down year at the position, the only LB we're wanting to take is a pretty big question mark at the position.

He has movement skills and length and Miami has seen him up close in a camp setting to verify. Not sure he has the frame to really but a hand in the ground pass rusher at the next level.

Not saying Diaz is wrong or anything, but seeing him play in space in a camp setting is way different than playing a traditional OLB position where you have to read OLineman (whether they come out run blocking or drop into pass pro) then locate the ball and shed a block from those big OLinemen, FB or TE. This does not happen in a camp setting.

Having to do that all in a split second is why most pass rush specialists have such a hard time adjusting to playing LB.

I have seen way too many great South FL pass rushing tweeners (too small to play DE, but perfect body and speed for LB, but no experience or instincts at the position) come in here and try to learn to play LB for 4 years never to make a significant enough impact to be holding up the scholarship from a real LB.

Think of all the greatest LBs to play here.

None were DEs in HS, and most were undersized at under 6'2 205 coming in (Lewis, Vilma, Spence, Perryman).

I would personally rather see us take Rosendo Louis if it is between him and Joyner.

I really want Sherwood in this class, but it seems like we are pretty much out of it at this point since he has his heart set on playing Safety.



Side Note: It is much easier for a Safety to transition to LB, than a DE b/c Safeties make similar reads and also have to play in space and cover.
DEs just rush into the backfield.

Good post. And generally I agree...but did you watch his film? He shows ability to play in space. He's not a "plug-n-play" kid at LB, but we won't need him to be. What he is, is a kid we have to get. Give him the looks at LB and take it from there.

Based on his film, I agree with Diaz. He can be an explosive and fast LB here.

Did John Square have the frame to put his hand on the ground? How much did he weigh? Not much more than 200, but he was quick and could get upfleid very fast.

Wasn't there a track guy, a little over 200 lbs that we made into a pass-rushing DE about ten or so years ago?

That was all before we brought in Golden and his passive defense.

John Square was terrible here. Turns out he didn't have the frame to play anywhere. Came in about 200 pounds and left about the same.

 

[grover]

I have no issue with Joyner coming in as an LB or a DE. He's clearly got some serious talent. But if LB, I hope we take one more classic kid, ideally a Mike like Louis or a LB/Safety hybrid like Sherwood (I think Reese can play there too) who can move around well in space. I know we have a couple of those guys already on roster. But we need to add at least one of each to prepare for after 2018. ... On the other hand, if you're telling me the spots are going to another 2-3 DTs and one more DE based on talent & interest, I won't argue, as we need more depth there, too.

 

[TheToadSage]

I'm pretty sure it's been said that the staff wants two linebackers this class... Joyner and Rosendo Louis

As of now they are only looking at 1 in the class

Pete, with taking only 1 lb, how does the rest of the class project # wise?