OT: Corruption in NCAA BBAll

[JoNJoN]

Between the news trickling out and this thread....

 

[brock]

Basketball recruiting is far more dirty than football and it’s not even close

 

[jhtheking]

But you're not trying to have a discussion.

You made sure to post a declarative statement that this is "our last good year of basketball." Your words.

That's not discussion worthy. That's you stating your opinion as an irrefutable fact.

You posted that as an absolute statement of fact, which it cannot possibly be, because no one knows the outcome.

All of which makes you a fear mongering cūnt with an agenda to make people think that the only possible outcome is the end of Miami basketball.

You are real mad over this aren't you? I never said end of Miami basketball, stop it with the straw man argument. We all understand you're trying to justify your public meltdown, but no one gives a **** except you.

What's worse?

a) "Man, Miami is going to suck for at least a few years from this."

b) "UHH that's not an opinion you cūnt. You are a fear mongering cūnt and you're ruining the discussion. That was a statement of fact and clearly is not a fact because we don't know yet so stop it you cūnt"

 

[OriginalCanesCanesCanes]

"our last good year of basketball"

 

[Tad Footeball]

"our last good year of basketball"

To be fair, the Louisville prostitution scandal crippled their program. What'd they go? Like .500 following the fallout from that? Sure, they were still cheating but I digress....

Short of Larranaga being involved and/or this touching any kids currently on the team (which is a big IF but also not as unreasonable as people projecting doomsday scenarios) then I don't see how our situation is worse than the LAST Louisville scandal.

Larranaga currently has us positioned to be an upper tier team in the top conference in the country. You realllly have to be slapped hard to be hurt longterm by any punishment. One or two missed recruits that weren't even close to being guaranteed commits ain't going to do that.

 

[MedleyCane]

My sources tell me it is going to be so bad that we will eventually end up with Skechers as our apparel sponsor and supplier.

 

[Tad Footeball]

My sources tell me it is going to be so bad that we will eventually end up with Skechers as our apparel sponsor and supplier.

They won't outbid Spalding.

 

[OriginalCanesCanesCanes]

"our last good year of basketball"

To be fair, the Louisville prostitution scandal crippled their program. What'd they go? Like .500 following the fallout from that? Sure, they were still cheating but I digress....

Short of Larranaga being involved and/or this touching any kids currently on the team (which is a big IF but also not as unreasonable as people projecting doomsday scenarios) then I don't see how our situation is worse than the LAST Louisville scandal.

Larranaga currently has us positioned to be an upper tier team in the top conference in the country. You realllly have to be slapped hard to be hurt longterm by any punishment. One or two missed recruits that weren't even close to being guaranteed commits ain't going to do that.

If you recall, that was an actual coach arranging the pay for play for prositutes, and Louisville was so shook, they continued to cheat. You have to realize that their recruit was paid off, and he's on campus (suspended now). Several other schools had coaches actually arrested, as you well know.

Right now for Miami, all we have is a coach, not himself on tape, but mentioned by others on tape. Now, I'm not naïve enough to think that this definitely won't turn out to be bad, or that something else can be uncovered. Anything is possible. But when you look at what's happening in at least more than a half a dozen other schools, adding to that the Alabama firing, and the Nike subpoenas, we may end up being a small cog in a big wheel when this is all over.

But again anything is possible, even a really bad outcome for us.

But the bottom line is this, as it stands right now we're small potatoes compared to the other stuff. That could change. But why is it that people assume, and then try to convince everyone else that this is for sure the death of Miami basketball. There's too much unknown at this point to assume anything, good or bad.

 

[Tad Footeball]

"our last good year of basketball"

To be fair, the Louisville prostitution scandal crippled their program. What'd they go? Like .500 following the fallout from that? Sure, they were still cheating but I digress....

Short of Larranaga being involved and/or this touching any kids currently on the team (which is a big IF but also not as unreasonable as people projecting doomsday scenarios) then I don't see how our situation is worse than the LAST Louisville scandal.

Larranaga currently has us positioned to be an upper tier team in the top conference in the country. You realllly have to be slapped hard to be hurt longterm by any punishment. One or two missed recruits that weren't even close to being guaranteed commits ain't going to do that.

If you recall, that was an actual coach arranging the pay for play for prositutes, and Louisville was so shook, they continued to cheat. You have to realize that their recruit was paid off, and he's on campus (suspended now). Several other schools had coaches actually arrested, as you well know.

Right now for Miami, all we have is a coach, not himself on tape, but mentioned by others on tape. Now, I'm not naïve enough to think that this definitely won't turn out to be bad, or that something else can be uncovered. Anything is possible. But when you look at what's happening in at least more than a half a dozen other schools, adding to that the Alabama firing, and the Nike subpoenas, we may end up being a small cog in a big wheel when this is all over.

But again anything is possible, even a really bad outcome for us.

But the bottom line is this, as it stands right now we're small potatoes compared to the other stuff. That could change. But why is it that people assume, and then try to convince everyone else that this is for sure the death of Miami basketball. There's too much unknown at this point to assume anything, good or bad.

Agreed and I also don't think this will even end up resulting in some sport-wide reform either. No past scandal has. So basically the status-quo will continue once this is all brushed under the rug incrementally by the NCAA (with Louisville and maybe one other top school- probably/hopefully Arizona- getting hammered) so as to lessen the overall attention.

I can almost understand the doomsdayers to a point based on the sheer number of years we've recently been associated with NCAA scandal. Where I diverge from their panic is if you look at the actual results/effects of those scandals. Larranaga (a competent leader) navigated them fine. The football program could have too with a real coach that didn't use them as a crutch everytime he **** the bed due to complete incompetence. So the doomsdayers ptsd involving this stuff isn't in the end remotely justified.

 

[g8rh8rMD]

This is not some Yahoo reporter with salacious allegations or even the NCAA swinging their massive rule book at Miami, this is the FBI who has full authority to subpoena and investigate as far as their leads take them. Miami coaches were involved in the bribery scheme and were named in the indictment, maybe not by name (coach #3 ), but they were implicated as being directly involved. It does not matter that he was not arrested (yet) nor that he wasn't on a wiretap or that it involved a 2019 recruit, they had enough evidence to include him in the indictment as having alleged to commit a crime which gives them full subpoena power of that coach and the University, and now we have confirmation that the FBI has indeed notified the University that they are under investigation. And this isn't the NCAA who you can lie to and withhold information, this is a Federal investigation, Under Oath, which means full cooperation or go to jail kind of power. This has the potential (and a high likelihood) to get much, much worse not only for Coach #3 but Miami basketball as a whole. You think those 5-stars from last year won't be interviewed? Think this is the first time Adidas has helped these schools land big time prospects? Criminal charges aside, the NCAA has a long precedent of not looking too kindly on pay for play schemes and they will have the ability to leverage the FBIs investigation which can go much further than the NCAA would normally be able to. Very dark days are ahead for Miami basketball.

Worst. Post. Ever. And I didn't even read it because it is so poorly structured, but I got the gist. The sky is falling, the Feds are literally going to perp walk the BUC (or whatever it's called now), yep, that's right, they are going to arrest and incarcerate the basketball arena itself, that's how bad this is. We should go ahead and take our program out back and shoot it right between it's cute and loving little eyes.

WTF happened to you people to think like this? There is a major scandal here, which we have all known has been going on for decades at essentially every major athletics program in the country, and we know little to NOTHING about what allegations or evidence there is on our program. Maybe that guy in Office Space was on to something with his "Jump to Conclusions" game mat! Seems a lot of Canes "fans" really enjoy that game...

Slow down, take a breath, and wait for some actual facts to come out before you shoot your cute little puppy. Could be it just had a little fart and not full blown rabies. Be a shame to blow a cute little puppy's head off just because you couldn't help yourself from jumping to conclusions.

 

[jhtheking]

"our last good year of basketball"

"our last good year of basketball at Miami for the foreseeable future"

 

[OriginalCanesCanesCanes]

"our last good year of basketball"

"our last good year of basketball at Miami for the foreseeable future"

What's the difference?

It's the same negative Nancy bullshīt. Foreseeable future could be 5-6 years. That's a long fūcking time.

Nobody knows what's going to happen, but feel free to go ahead and white knight for Dr. Doom.

 

[jhtheking]

"our last good year of basketball"

"our last good year of basketball at Miami for the foreseeable future"

What's the difference?

It's the same negative Nancy bullshīt. Foreseeable future could be 5-6 years. That's a long fūcking time.

Nobody knows what's going to happen, but feel free to go ahead and white knight for Dr. Doom.

The difference is exactly why you decided to take me out of context you douche. Foreseeable is 3-4 years, or the lifecycle of a basketball team imo.

 

[BigCaneAl]

Sorry for the stupid question, but what actual criminal acts is the FBI charging people with. As far as I know, NCAA violations do not equate with illegal activity. Outside possible tax implications there is no reason Addidas or anyone can't give money to a player legally, even if it's an NCAA violation. What am I missing? I know they mention fraud and conspiracy, but as a non-lawyer I do not follow what was actually illegal.

 

[KrazyCane]

Fck the FBI what the **** they got to do with the business of college athletics??

 

[KrazyCane]

Sorry for the stupid question, but what actual criminal acts is the FBI charging people with. As far as I know, NCAA violations do not equate with illegal activity. Outside possible tax implications there is no reason Addidas or anyone can't give money to a player legally, even if it's an NCAA violation. What am I missing? I know they mention fraud and conspiracy, but as a non-lawyer I do not follow what was actually illegal.

This

 

[Squid Bumciorek]

Sorry for the stupid question, but what actual criminal acts is the FBI charging people with. As far as I know, NCAA violations do not equate with illegal activity. Outside possible tax implications there is no reason Addidas or anyone can't give money to a player legally, even if it's an NCAA violation. What am I missing? I know they mention fraud and conspiracy, but as a non-lawyer I do not follow what was actually illegal.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...rested-fbi-fraud-corruption-scheme/703295001/

It's not a stupid question. The honest answer? It's grandstanding by the SDNY US Attorney. That particular office is well known for launching political careers. The case basically revolves around corruption of coaches and "advisors" taking bribes to steer players to schools. The feds don't actually care much about Adidas or Nike, it's more that universities receive federal funds.
The corruption deprives the universities of a player's honest services. The universities and the fed government are the "victims" of fraud. Really. That's the link to a criminal enterprise. It makes for a great news segment, but this sh#t would go nowhere in court. These guys are realistically looking at probation if somehow they end up convicted in court (and I will bet money nobody actually gets convicted in court). The feds goal is to get the people they arrested to flip and expose the list of other involved individuals, which would then get leaked, other involved coaches get fired (note : not convicted) and the SDNY USA gets to claim he helped clean up corruption.

The feds aren't likely going to share info with the NCAA because the NCAA is so inept that they will almost certainly bungle the case and lead to evidence getting thrown out and /or endless appeals. On top of that, the ncaa's whole business model would collapse if it dug too deeply. You think they really want the sponsors to stay away from the sports? Come on. The low hanging fruit is the coaches who directly accepted bribes. They are toast and the schools who had coaches who accepted "bribes" or acted as bagmen for the players will be made an example of. Miami isn't accused of either offense. So far the story is that two dirty individuals were discussing how much to offer a recruit and one of them claims a Miami coach told him Nike was offering 150k. Didn't say the Miami coach would serve as a bagman or needed a little $$$ to make things happen. Just that he allegedly told them that another company was paying a player. What's the phrase the kids use nowadays? That's a nothingburger.

This isn't leading to huge sweeping reforms. Nothing is changing in the world of shamateur athletics. Money talks, my friends.

 

[BigCaneAl]

Sorry for the stupid question, but what actual criminal acts is the FBI charging people with. As far as I know, NCAA violations do not equate with illegal activity. Outside possible tax implications there is no reason Addidas or anyone can't give money to a player legally, even if it's an NCAA violation. What am I missing? I know they mention fraud and conspiracy, but as a non-lawyer I do not follow what was actually illegal.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...rested-fbi-fraud-corruption-scheme/703295001/

It's not a stupid question. The honest answer? It's grandstanding by the SDNY US Attorney. That particular office is well known for launching political careers. The case basically revolves around corruption of coaches taking bribes to steer players to schools. The feds don't actually care much about Adidas or Nike, it's more that coaches are paid by universities that receive federal funds.
The corruption deprives the universities of a player's honest services. The universities and the fed government are the "victims" of fraud. Really. That's the link to a criminal enterprise. It makes for a great news segment, but this sh#t would go nowhere in court. These guys are realistically looking at probation if somehow they end up convicted in court (and I will bet money nobody actually gets convicted in court). The feds goal is to get the people they arrested to flip and expose the list of other involved individuals, which would then get leaked, other involved coaches get fired (note : not convicted) and the SDNY USA gets to claim he helped clean up corruption.

The feds aren't likely going to share info with the NCAA because the NCAA is so inept that they will almost certainly bungle the case and lead to evidence getting thrown out and /or endless appeals. On top of that, the ncaa's whole business model would collapse if it dug too deeply. You think they really want the sponsors to stay away from the sports? Come on. The low hanging fruit is the coaches who directly accepted bribes. They are toast and the schools who had coaches who accepted "bribes" or acted as bagmen for the players will be made an example of. Miami isn't accused of either offense. So far the story is that two dirty individuals were discussing how much to offer a recruit and one of them claims a Miami coach told him Nike was offering 150k. Didn't say the Miami coach would serve as a bagman or needed a little $$$ to make things happen. Just that he allegedly told them that another company was paying a player. What's the phrase the kids use nowadays? That's a nothingburger.

This isn't leading to huge sweeping reforms. Nothing is changing in the world of shamateur athletics. Money talks, my friends.

Thanks, I read the article and honestly thought there was little difference between what a lobbyist does and what they are accusing the coaches of doing. I know it's somewhat different, but hardly seems criminal.

 

[OriginalCanesCanesCanes]

"our last good year of basketball"

"our last good year of basketball at Miami for the foreseeable future"

What's the difference?

It's the same negative Nancy bullshīt. Foreseeable future could be 5-6 years. That's a long fūcking time.

Nobody knows what's going to happen, but feel free to go ahead and white knight for Dr. Doom.

The difference is exactly why you decided to take me out of context you douche. Foreseeable is 3-4 years, or the lifecycle of a basketball team imo.

Only an actual douche like you would say a nebulous term like foreseeable has a specific number attached to it. Somebody else could say foreseeable future is ten years. Or 20. Or 5. The term is basically irrelevant because its subject to such wide interpretation. Therefore, leaving an irrelevant term out means it wasn't taken out of context, because forseeable future is meaningless in this context.

So the takeaway from the doom merchants is this: "our last good year of basketball at Miami". That's what you're peddling.

 

[SpikeUM]

There were numerous violations of federal laws, across state lines, which is why the FBI is involved. To start with, bribes are illegal, and there is a whole lot of tax evasion going on, by coaches, "advisors" and players.