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James Williams' projection for 2022 and beyond

Coach Macho said:
How many 6'5" Safeties are playing football right now?

There's a reason for that.

You think James Williams is a once-in-a-lifetime talent that somehow defies athletic physics?

Stop bringing up Sean.
Sean was 6'2" 230 not 6'5" 240+.
We've seen other Safeties the size of Sean. We've NEVER seen a Safety the size of JW.

First and foremost, James Williams struggles to tackle in space while running downhill. I've seen him get shook out of his cleats. That's one big issue right there.
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George Iloka, Obi Melifonwu, Jayron Kearse, Pat Watkins all NFL safeties 6’4 or 6’5
 
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Maskoff407 said:
Smh. I just don’t understand y’all level of rational thinking. ****!! 😂😂😂 Okay. So is J-Will as good as Sheldrick Redwine, Brandon Meriweather, or Kenny Phillps?
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As a pure DB…. No. U know why because he would get smoked trying to play as a pure safety in the NFL.
 
Theedy50 said:
George Iloka, Obi Melifonwu, Jayron Kearse, Pat Watkins all NFL safeties 6’4 or 6’5
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Every guy you just named is 225lbs or less.
And only Watkins is 6'5".

James Williams is 6'5" and a happy meal away from 245lbs.

Also, tell me what kind of schemes they play in, because that makes a difference as well.
 
LuCane said:
Would love to hear from some of you who are closer to the players what the feeling is around Williams' physical progress. Naturally, I ask because he's a giant kid with a big frame. I know he's been intent on remaining a Safety. I also realize defenses continue to be evolve as more "positionless."

Nonetheless, someone close to him mentioned he had been dieting or restricting natural growth to remain under a certain size. Is that true?

Next season, our deepest position might be Safety. We'll have JWilliams, AWilliams, KKinchens, Balom (if healthy), Washington, maybe Frierson, maybe Keontra as a hybrid, Harrell, and Markeith Williams (True Frosh). I may have missed someone.

When I re-watched some of our games, James looked best getting after the passer. Clearly, that's why he was used that way on 3rd down subpackages. A lot of how he's used will depend on the DC, we realize. But, Mario has already said "multiple" about 345 times. We can reasonably expect odd and even fronts, and varying subpackages. For those who understand the LB position behind odd fronts better than I, any thoughts on what a transition might look like?

Ray Ray Armstrong made the move too late, but still put together a ~10-year NFL career. JWilliams is bigger right now than Ray Ray was going into the NFL and *may* be stunting his growth (according to some).

Look forward to thoughts on how this situation unfolds.
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If in nickel packages, he will be the nickel. Whatever position, just keep him on the field
 
Correct me if I’m wrong, but it seems in todays game, not giving opponents offenses something to think about pre snap sets you up for failure. So moving JW all over will make the O have adjust to account for him, and he could always back out of that. Also would eat into opponents preparation time in have to account for him in different areas in different situations.
 
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Coach Macho said:
Every guy you just named is 225lbs or less.
And only Watkins is 6'5".

James Williams is 6'5" and a happy meal away from 245lbs.

Also, tell me what kind of schemes they play in, because that makes a difference as well.
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As a Viking fan I can tell you George Iloka, Jayron Kearse played the big nickel/slot position more than anything else. The guy you were responding to kind of made your point for you because most of those guys don't play traditional safety. Not sure how Kearse's role has changed with the cowboys tho..
 
However they line it all up, James, Avantae, Kinchens, and Chase Smith need to be on the field. James makes the most sense in that striker/nickel spot with Chase playing the more traditional LB in my opinion.
 
Coach Macho said:
He needs to be moved around, but ultimately he should spend the majority of his time near the line of scrimmage.

I'm a 3-4 Cover-3 fan, mainly because it's a symmetrical, versatile and easily adjustable.

Regardless, in any scheme his best fit is probably at the Sam OLB/Nickel spot. (or what Manny called Striker)
This is the strong side apex defender. There's a lot of different things you can do with that guy. He can play the flats, play man on TE's or slots, blitz off the edge, etc.

Offensive football is about utilizing space these days. Thus defensive football should be about TAKING AWAY SPACE. With his length and athleticism, his ability to take away grass (space) is a huge benefit for the defense. He can literally cover curl-to-flat at the same time, by himself. You can also forget about throwing bubble screens because he is going to manhandle the WR blocking him.

The whole reason defenses don't use Sam OLB's any more is because most offenses are spread, and LB's aren't athletic enough to play out there in space...so they sub in a Nickel. With subbing in a Nickel, you gain athleticism but you lose some physicality and size. You can exploit this by flexing a TE out, running bubble screens at the smaller Nickel back, running zone/read or option and forcing the Nickel to tackle the run, etc etc etc.

I've been saying for years, if you could ever find a guy big/physical enough to play LB, but athletic enough to play DB, he would be the prototype Nickel in today's defense. A guy whose long/athletic enough to play short/intermediate zones, physical enough to blow up bubbles, tough enough to play the run, large enough to cover TE's and aggressive enough to blitz the edge.
An athlete like James Williams is your fvckin' guy!

You make that his PRIMARY position.
From there you can put him in other spots via sub packages. He can run spot duty at Will LB or even Free Safety, rolling down in the box, blitzing, etc. He can be a Linebacker on Dime packages where he'll play man on RB's, spy the QB, blitz, etc.

Keep in mind, his ability to grasp all these different assignments will also determine how he's used.


He's definitely not a Safety in a 2-high scheme, not at this level of football. He'll get roasted. A single high structure provides a lot more flexibility for him.

Watch this kid's tape and how I used him in different spots, and you'll get an idea of what I mean. He was my Swiss army knife. A 6'1" 192lb LB/DB hybrid type. He does EVERYTHING on this tape. He sets the edge, he blitzes, he plays flats, he plays man, he plays high safety, he plays in the box, etc.


After watching that tape, picture a 6'5" 235lb 4.5/4.6 type of athlete doing those things.
I think James Williams can thrive in a role like that.
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Solid post. Even those who disagree (I am not one) can easily understand your reasoning.
 
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I think Kam Chancellor is the type of potential James has. In the box safety that's athletic enough to play high safety and cover TEs one on one down the seam.

James also has ability as a biltzer.

Main point: plus athlete that allows versatility on defense and can deal with spread or run based teams.
 
Coach Macho said:
Every guy you just named is 225lbs or less.
And only Watkins is 6'5".

James Williams is 6'5" and a happy meal away from 245lbs.

Also, tell me what kind of schemes they play in, because that makes a difference as well.
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So if James is around 245 right now would it be possible that by spring camp he could be in the 255-260 range and have a look at DE??? I think that's where he's going to eventually end up when he goes pro... From what I've seen thus far he's much better coming in after the QB that he is in coverage... And believe me by no means am I downplaying what he did this past season as a safety ...
It just looks like from a progression standpoint that's where things are headed.... Just glad to have him on our team and hope the best for him going forward...
 
Just move him around. First he isn't the athletic freak Isaiah Simmons is. People make that comparison, but he isn't running a 4.39.

He can play deep
Safety on some plays.

If teams flex a TE let him man him up.

Bring him in the box when you think a team is running it Heavy.

Blitz him
Off edge from an OLB position.
 
aleahy said:
However they line it all up, James, Avantae, Kinchens, and Chase Smith need to be on the field. James makes the most sense in that striker/nickel spot with Chase playing the more traditional LB in my opinion.
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One of the main reasons for this thread was that I was making lineups (base, Nickel, 3rd and long) with our projected 2022 players and, beyond how being versatile optimizes James Williams' individual development, our team just really needs him in multiple spots.

If Tyrique returns, that gives us 5 high level players on the backend. If we can get Couch to play some decent Nickel/Dime and get him to remember how to tackle at least to the level of 2020, we're a corner or two away from something manageable for next season. That could come from the Portal, what's on the roster (worrisome), or incoming Freshman (hope they learn *really* fast, though they'll inevitably have their ups and downs).

Mario and crew can focus their attention on finding us a 0/1 DT (ideally, Jordan Miller is a rotation guy), a reliable Edge (or somehow develop Harvey and another from within), and maximize our relative strength with 3Ts and 5Ts (Leonard Taylor, JHH, USC transfer, Elijah Roberts and hopefully Shemar Stewart).

Holy **** we're thin overall.
 
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JHallCanes said:
Safety is a lot of space to cover

He’s so explosive in short spaces and such a big kid I think it’s a natural move. He’s such a good athlete he can be a really good safety though too no doubt but the need might dictate it
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Agree I think he’s a good safety but would make more of an impact at LB, he just plays different when he is closer to the line of scrimmage
 
Atom Atlas said:
So if James is around 245 right now would it be possible that by spring camp he could be in the 255-260 range and have a look at DE??? I think that's where he's going to eventually end up when he goes pro... From what I've seen thus far he's much better coming in after the QB that he is in coverage... And believe me by no means am I downplaying what he did this past season as a safety ...
It just looks like from a progression standpoint that's where things are headed.... Just glad to have him on our team and hope the best for him going forward...
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He has nowhere the strength for DE. He would get stonewalled left and right. No matter where he ends up though, he'll be a force for sure.
 
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SayWhat said:
He has nowhere the strength for DE. He would get stonewalled left and right. No matter where he ends up though, he'll be a force for sure.
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That's why I added the progression part... I mean I don't see it this coming season but by his Junior year I could see it... And yes he would have to get stronger which if he hits the 260 range he should be considerably stronger...
 
Im torn on this, if he grows or not it doesn't matter. Its only if it starts to restrict his lateral movement. He is pretty lanky even though he is tall. So for now he is fine at Safety. But eventually maybe he will be better served in the box. Safeties have to cover smaller quick players alot of times.
 
Canesfan1899 said:
They are two different players.
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Yeah yeah yeah. Save it. You all say that because you’ve witnessed ST story already play out. I do agree ST was a beast, but J-Will doesn’t have to be ST. He just needs to be a great safety! Which he will be. I Never compared J-Will to ST from the start. I’m just stating the facts that today, going into 2022, at 6’3 230 coming into college… without knowing his future… you all would put ST at LB. maybe even DE. Never mind what he did in HS or camps… you would move him down to the line because of his size. That’s just what y’all do… base it on size lol. THATS A FACT! It’s alright. I’m done with this convo now. It’s actually dumb topic seeing as no one here can do **** but watch lol.
 
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