Dapper or other Lawyers; thoughts on NCAA stuff

[Problem2]

Is this real life?

As if the NCAA's University of Miami investigation hasn't been a big enough head-scratcher, CBSSports.com has learned that the NCAA has not even contacted Sean Allen as part of its own investigation into the investigation.

Allen, a former Miami equipment room staffer who had been the middle man for Nevin Shapiro, had been deposed as part of the rogue booster's bankruptcy case by an attorney Maria Elena Perez that, turns out, had been hired by the NCAA. CBS first reported Allen's story and the NCAA investigators' involvement in the deposition last September.

According to Allen, NCAA investigator Ameen Najjar was in the room when he arrived that day in 2011. Allen asked that Najjar leave the room, but Shapiro's attorney still grilled Allen, under oath, with many questions the NCAA had fed her. Among the questions, Perez asked Allen about were Al Golden and (former Miami offensive coordinator) Jedd Fisch's recruiting tactics even though Shapiro was already in jail for months by the time both coaches were hired by UM.

What is curious is that the NCAA in its review of the “stunning” and “shocking” news as NCAA President Mark Emmert termed it a few weeks ago – even though as colleague Dennis Dodd reported it really wasn't so stunning to the NCAA at the time after all – no one as part of this investigation has gone back to Allen to inquire about any conversations that he may have had with Perez or Najjar as part of all this. Keep in mind Najjar, one of the central figures of the NCAA's investigation of the Miami investigation, was Allen's main contact with the NCAA and conducted hours of interviews with him.

Emmert's quote from last month: "We cannot have the NCAA bringing forward an allegation ... that was collected by processes none of us could stand for. We're going to move it as fast as possible, but we have to get this right."

Maybe questions to Allen about his involvement with Perez or Najjar would yield nothing for the NCAA on this front, but it still would seem odd that NCAA wouldn't even reach out to try and ask about it if, in fact, Emmert and his people are so determined to "get this right."

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefoo...acted-allen-as-part-of-its-latest-miami-probe

 

[Problem2]

Their whole investigation of themselves is a ******* joke. Nothing will come out of it and they are still going to try and hammer us.

Do something already Shalala.

 

[Bigtip]

Their whole investigation of themselves is a ******* joke. Nothing will come out of it and they are still going to try and hammer us.

Do something already Shalala.

I think she is already. I doubt that they will try to hammer us now. I believe that whatever comes out in the NOA (if we get one) will be pre-agreed upon by UM and the NCAA and it will be a favorable situation for UM.

 

[Picksix]

Lawyers are the lowest forms of scum on the planet. Passing the bar means you are barred from telling the truth "just let the process unfold". These scummy focks have zero morals or ethics. Lie, lie, lie, deny, deny, deny... That's lawyerism 101. Produce nothing and rob, lie, cheat, and steal is how these parasites make their money.

Thank you, do all Jews have horns or just the ones that haven't had the surgery to remove them.

Jews? Where did I mention Jews? Oh let me guess, you're ****** and have the ****** guilt? Whoa is me! Using the antisemetism card are we? Pathetic...

 

[The Franchise]

The NCAA does not need much to find your guilt. They came out and said that allot of info they got from him during the deposition they already knew.

Of course, that's going to be their PUBLIC statement. Do you think they'd go to the public and state that the majority of their case against UM came via fraudulent, coercive, and extortive means? Their entire wrap to the public is going to be that 99.9999% of their case was built through proper investigatory procedures. Most of us, however, know that's not the case.

 

[The Franchise]

Lawyers are the lowest forms of scum on the planet. Passing the bar means you are barred from telling the truth "just let the process unfold". These scummy focks have zero morals or ethics. Lie, lie, lie, deny, deny, deny... That's lawyerism 101. Produce nothing and rob, lie, cheat, and steal is how these parasites make their money.

Thank you, do all Jews have horns or just the ones that haven't had the surgery to remove them.

Everybody always says stuff like this......and then the day comes when they need a lawyer.

My law partner and I get a kick out of dudes like this. Lawyers and the legal system are the most evil entities in the world until they need to make use of either to vindicate their rights.

 

[Consigliere]

Lawyers are the lowest forms of scum on the planet. Passing the bar means you are barred from telling the truth "just let the process unfold". These scummy focks have zero morals or ethics. Lie, lie, lie, deny, deny, deny... That's lawyerism 101. Produce nothing and rob, lie, cheat, and steal is how these parasites make their money.

Thank you, do all Jews have horns or just the ones that haven't had the surgery to remove them.

Everybody always says stuff like this......and then the day comes when they need a lawyer.

My law partner and I get a kick out of dudes like this. Lawyers and the legal system are the most evil entities in the world until they need to make use of either to vindicate their rights.

Motherfuccccccccccccking Pro Se

 

[Consigliere]

Why doesn't Miami hire its own firm to investigate the NCAA?

I am then going to hire my own firm to investigate the investigation that Miami did on the NCAA.

 

[The Franchise]

Why doesn't Miami hire its own firm to investigate the NCAA?

I am then going to hire my own firm to investigate the investigation that Miami did on the NCAA.

Be prepared for my investigation of your investigation of the investigation of Miami's investigation of the NCAA.

 

[Consigliere]

Why doesn't Miami hire its own firm to investigate the NCAA?

I am then going to hire my own firm to investigate the investigation that Miami did on the NCAA.

Be prepared for my investigation of your investigation of the investigation of Miami's investigation of the NCAA.

I already hired a *** guy named Levin on retainer. He will be investigating why Gary Ferman's mouth smells like Seamen and ******* 24/7.

Please note I have no idea what seamen smells like.

 

[The Franchise]

Why doesn't Miami hire its own firm to investigate the NCAA?

I am then going to hire my own firm to investigate the investigation that Miami did on the NCAA.

Be prepared for my investigation of your investigation of the investigation of Miami's investigation of the NCAA.

I already hired a *** guy named Levin on retainer. He will be investigating why Gary Ferman's mouth smells like Seamen and ******* 24/7.

Please note I have no idea what seamen smells like.

Or what it's spelled like.

 

[jakeman1]

Maybe seamen's *****?

 

[Supcanes]

Why doesn't Miami hire its own firm to investigate the NCAA?

I am then going to hire my own firm to investigate the investigation that Miami did on the NCAA.

Be prepared for my investigation of your investigation of the investigation of Miami's investigation of the NCAA.

I already hired a *** guy named Levin on retainer. He will be investigating why Gary Ferman's mouth smells like Seamen and ******* 24/7.

Please note I have no idea what seamen smells like.

Or what it's spelled like.

Lulz

 

[DapperSlapper]

Thanks for a seriously solid post.

Your point about Perez possibly knowing weakenesses in Shapiro's case or the NCAA's case is freakin glorious. If this ends up in court, and UM can prove that Perez, the NCAA and/or Shapiro possibly waived the privilege, wow, would that be a freakin bombshell.

I read that article as saying that Humphrey, who works in enforcement, said (when she first notified parties over the phone that the NCAA had been involved with Perez) that the NCAA was going to claim attorney client privilege. In the same conversation she said basically said the NCAA got great info from working with Perez (obviously, that isn't going to mean anything) and that they would claim attorney client privilege with respect to dealings with Perez (this could also be outdated at this point). The whole call was enforcement flexing its muscles - just like they tried to do in paying Perez in the first place. At this point, I wouldn't attach any significance to anything Humphrey said during that call, unless Emmert comes out and says the same thing.

Based on the news he reported, I have no idea why the author felt he had to talk to a lawyer and ask about attorney client privilege. There is nothing to this story at this point.

Agree with that reading. This doesn't seem like anything new to me.

I don't think it is anything particularly new, but I do wonder how the NCAA is going to be able to claim an expectation of confidentiality in connection with any communications with Perez, given that she was representing and presumably reporting to Shapiro at the same time. The NCAA would find itself, at a minimum, with substantial egg on its face if it took the position that it shared interests with a person it is investigating and who has acknowledged that his motivation is to bring down the UM Athletic Program. That's walking right into the investigatory bias argument--never mind the issues regarding improper use of the bankruptcy proceedings.

Perez herself made comments immediately after Emmert revealed the relationship that suggested that she did not perceive there to be an attorney-client relationship. While that latter point means little, particularly given the questions that surround her ability to perceive much of anything in general, it just further suggests that there likely was little thought of attorney-client privilege and confidentiality in communications at the time of those communications. I'd expect that she revealed what the NCAA now would claim to be privileged information to Shapiro--and the NCAA likely would have expected her to do so or, at least, should have assumed that she would do so, absent contrary instruction.

Man, I'd love to see the conflict waivers on this one (and I doubt anyone wrote one up). What if she discovered something in her efforts on behalf of the NCAA that negatively impacted the investigation, Shapiro's credibility or Shapiro's legal position? Was she going to reveal it to Shapiro? To the NCAA? What a mess.

At bottom, this just seems like the NCAA is trying to keep Perez from continuing to yap to the media and others about the matter to avoid further embarrassment. But, it points up the nature of the problem the NCAA confronts.

My point was the only time anyone from the NCAA said anything about privilege was before this fiasco became public. At the time Humphrey said that, the NCAA had not acknowledged any wrongdoing - it was before Emmert's teleconference/press conference. I don't think there's any reason to discuss anything relative to the prior claim of privilege until the NCAA takes that position. At this point, it is absolutely clear that the NCAA has not endorsed anything Humphrey said in those calls.

 

[borncane]

Dapper -

Do you know if she has a Florida Bar inquiry into her as a result of this? --- Saying she does, how does that impact the NCAA ability to keep her mouth shut? --- Will any attempt she makes to save her own skin with the Bar, be available for Miami's use?

Thx!

Honestly man anyone can file an ardc inquiry. Could have been someone on this board. Doesn't mean the committee will take it up

 

[borncane]

Lawyers are the lowest forms of scum on the planet. Passing the bar means you are barred from telling the truth "just let the process unfold". These scummy focks have zero morals or ethics. Lie, lie, lie, deny, deny, deny... That's lawyerism 101. Produce nothing and rob, lie, cheat, and steal is how these parasites make their money.

The NCAA came and stated they had to have an investigation into their own inner workings due to fraudulent BS. Then they hired a "private investigative firm" to clean up the mess and low and behold nothing happened? GTFOOH! Lawyer scum is going to lawyer scum...

Lol until someone injures you or your family and then they are the best thing around. I love how people think we are the scum until they need us.

 

[Awsi Dooger]

This is not discussed much but Shapiro told everyone he had another "Ace"

Shapiro made sure the NCAA was at the deposition to hear this new "Ace" info.

This is the reason all this went down. This was suppose to be the death penalty ace. and this had legs

Shapiro gambled and placed bets on UM games and he claimed that he changed the outcome of games because of what he told/paid players to do and not to do. This was asked during the deposition but Sean Allen denied under oath knowing anything about it.

This is why Emerett said repeatedly we didn't get any big info here. They were not there to confirm or get info they already had. EVERYTHING they got from that deposition they already knew.

NCAA could not collaborate this piece of information.

I think it would be hilarious if an obsession with gambling triggered the NCAA's implosion in this matter. As I've posted previously, even otherwise very intelligent people fall for the cynical nonsense that a high percentage of games are manipulated, and that so-called inside information will place you on "the right side."

Boxing is one thing, Two combatants. One ref. Three judges. Each one has a potentially high stake in the outcome, although obviously it has to reach a decision for the judges to play a role. Basketball is a manageable dump, the best target but hardly a sure thing. Once you get into football, with 22 players and so many permutations, outside the quarterback it would be next to impossible to guarantee a manipulated outcome. If the NCAA failed to grasp something like that, they are truly desperate and pathetic, even beyond than my impression while following the course of the investigation.

I did witness evidence of the Tulane basketball fix in 1985 and Arizona State in 1994. In early '85 I was new to Las Vegas and a regular at Caesar's Palace sportsbook every night. One night I had Memphis -6 at Tulane, among at least a dozen other wagers. A guy in a suit and with a briefcase sat down in the front row, not far from me. I hadn't been in town long but this guy clearly looked out of place. Fidgety and silent. I tried to engage him in conversation but he all but ignored me. Finally the games started and he wanted to know if Memphis and Tulane were on any of the television monitors. I looked around and said no. I tried to jokingly say I was happy about it, that I bet Memphis and preferred not to watch, but merely wait for the scores. He didn't react at all. In those days the ticker only gave college scores four times per game -- midway first half, halftime, midway second half, and final. When the 10 minute score came in with Tulane ahead, this guy fidgeted even more than normal. I asked if he had Memphis and he said yes, minus 6.5. He seemed reluctant to mention it. I told him it was early, not to worry. When the halftime score arrived about 20 minutes later, with Tulane building its advantage to 5 or 6, the guy threw his hands into the air and cursed under his breath. He stormed out of his seat and left the sportsbook. I never saw him again. Even in a crazy town like Las Vegas, that incident stood out in my mind. When news of the Tulane point shaving scandal broke, I immediately thought back to that night, knowing the Memphis game had to be involved. Memphis had rallied to cover every number. Sure enough, it was on the list. And the description of how the money was wagered throughout Las Vegas -- a few individuals carefully hitting spot after spot -- fit what I witnessed that night.

Arizona State 1994 was another matter entirely. There had been rumblings for weeks that something was up with that team. My friend Skinny stopped me at Imperial Palace on a Saturday afternoon and said to be careful opposing any move on that team, that the wagering patterns didn't make sense. Frankly I didn't pay much attention. Then roughly midnight a Friday night I was walking the Strip, making college basketball wagers for the next day. In that era virtually every joint stayed open all night on the weekend. Highly competitive and every casino had its own book...no satellite nonsense. Numbers moved when they were posted late Friday afternoon, otherwise everything settled until Saturday morning. You could take your time, picking off the best numbers here and there. I had interest in Arizona State hosting Oregon. It was -13, with nothing lower than -12.5. Then while checking numbers walking north on the Strip from (old) Aladdin to Harrah's, something happened that I never experienced before or since. All the games had painted pointspreads from joint to joint, except Arizona State/ Oregon. That number varied at every sportsbook. It was -13 at Aladdin, then -12.5 at Little Caesars, then -11.5 at Bally's, -11 at Barbary Coast, -10.5 at Flamingo Hilton, -9.5 at Imperial Palace, and finally a ridiculous -8.5 at Harrah's. I had no idea what was going on until I asked my friend Doug, who was graveyard sportsbook supervisor at Harrah's. He provided a comical account of several young college aged guys who were drunk and betting Oregon with no concern for the number. They wanted the limit, again and again, and really didn't care how far Doug dropped the number. That's how it reached -8.5, from -13 initially. The capper was when Doug told me several of them were wearing Arizona State garb. That's how reckless they were, unimaginably stupid. Walking from joint to joint, not caring where the left the number. Apparently they had gotten away with it so many times they believed it was free candy, and they no longer needed to conceal anything. A week or so later was the famous game against Washington State, when Arizona State trailed badly at halftime then supposedly were warned by investigators at halftime. They suddenly woke up in the second half, and covered every number.

Sorry for the lengthy detour. When high profile scandals like that occur, the public -- and no doubt the NCAA -- wants to believe there are far more of them that go undetected, including in football. I don't buy it. Imagine the NCAA's glee when they thought they could stain Miami with gambling allegations. That would strike a pretentious nerve with some segments of the public, far beyond paying for dinners, or hosting yacht trips, or even anything related to a prostitute.

The NCAA honchos might want to take some courses in basic probability.

 

[ThePorge]

This is a case closed statement. They have an agreement with UM in place. Now come out and say "Nothing to see here, move along". NOA comes out a bit later with nothing new. Punishment issued=time served.

That's my call until one of you lawyer types blows a whole into my theory.

 

[Consigliere]

Why doesn't Miami hire its own firm to investigate the NCAA?

I am then going to hire my own firm to investigate the investigation that Miami did on the NCAA.

Be prepared for my investigation of your investigation of the investigation of Miami's investigation of the NCAA.

I already hired a *** guy named Levin on retainer. He will be investigating why Gary Ferman's mouth smells like Seamen and ******* 24/7.

Please note I have no idea what seamen smells like.

Or what it's spelled like.

Touche'

 

[Mangum]

How could the NCAA call client attorney privileges if the the attorney abused her power in the first place?

Perez was hired by Shapiro
Perez was hired by the NCAA
The NCAA has no subpoena power
Perez has subpoena power.
Perez used her power of subpoena to gather information for the NCAA

Since both parties both abused their powers to gain / compel information against Miami, shouldn't that whole attorney / client union be dissolved?
Am I making sense? Miami likely has lawyers that would be able to blow that idea to Bolivia..