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WR recruiting and Dugans Evaluations

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Ecush said:
So for ***** and giggles I looked at the rivals database (because it was easiest to navigate) and looked at all WRs in the 17 and 18 classes that were from Florida and rated 3 stars or better. It is amazing how many of the total WRs in this category are from the state of Florida. It is also amazing how few of them have found success up to this point in college football. I'm starting to wonder if Florida boys are not cut out to be big time wide recievers with a few exceptions like Jeudy.
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I mentioned in another thread but I don't think it's an issue with South Florida. The issue is with Rivals and the recruiting websites who put too much emphasis on 7v7 camps and 40-times, when these are not really the traits that make a receiver successful at the college or pro level.

The camps overvalue the skinny fast/quick guy, but the best receivers have strength to run through defenders and complete their routes, and can make plays in traffic. The thing that camps don't tell you is their ability to make contested plays.

If anything, the lesson is don't put too much stock on 7v7 or camp performances. Evaluate players on how they play in actual football games.
 
Mcn
DMoney said:
George McDonald. He was good. He's at NC State now.
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McDonald was here for 2011 and 2012.he didnt recruit berrios.al golden and McDonald missing on amari cooper was the worst thing that happened to miami when it comes to sf wrs.after that it became a trend the top dawgs going to bama to become the next amari cooper. golden worst coach in Miami history.
 
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RightSaidFred said:
I mentioned in another thread but I don't think it's an issue with South Florida. The issue is with Rivals and the recruiting websites who put too much emphasis on 7v7 camps and 40-times, when these are not really the traits that make a receiver successful at the college or pro level.

The camps overvalue the skinny fast/quick guy, but the best receivers have strength to run through defenders and complete their routes, and can make plays in traffic. The thing that camps don't tell you is their ability to make contested plays.

If anything, the lesson is don't put too much stock on 7v7 or camp performances. Evaluate players on how they play in actual football games.
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I agree with this. Pope, Harley and Wiggins are all like 180. Way too small to be upperclassmen in a college program. They're not built for college ball. They shouldn't be our top three guys.
 
RiDLer80 said:
I agree with this. Pope, Harley and Wiggins are all like 180. Way too small to be upperclassmen in a college program. They're not built for college ball. They shouldn't be our top three guys.
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Agree. I've only seen Michael Redding play a few snaps of football so I can't say one way or the other... but the little I did see he pops off the screen. That's a guy that could have that potential. I'd like to see him get some more targets personally.

I haven't written Wiggins off totally but I'm getting close.

Pope and Harley just don't have it. It's not even really their fault... they were just overrated out of high school because they were camp 7v7 guys.
 
RightSaidFred said:
Agree. I've only seen Michael Redding play a few snaps of football so I can't say one way or the other... but the little I did see he pops off the screen. That's a guy that could have that potential. I'd like to see him get some more targets personally.

I haven't written Wiggins off totally but I'm getting close.

Pope and Harley just don't have it. It's not even really their fault... they were just overrated out of high school because they were camp 7v7 guys.
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I like Michael Redding & Keyshawn Smith upside. I think Payton is a future starter but he hasn’t come out yet. Just flashes here and there.
 
IcemanArcade said:
Recent lackluster performance of our upperclassmen WR core heading into the midpoint of their senior/junior season has me thinking and looking back at previous evaluations for WR recruiting. And boy did we strike out... A lot... Remember when we held Dugans and Hartley as our best recruiters on this staff a few years ago?... looking back at Dugans evaluations in which he was listed as either the P (primary) S (secondary) recruiter from 2016-2018. With the exception of Ahmon Richards and Jeff Thomas the first 3 weeks of the 2018 season (after the LSU loss) None have lived up to expectations or have played a significant snap/down for Miami. This group is what they are at this point. 2017-2018 core has had 3 different WR coaches and though Stubberfck was awful, we simply chalk it up to missed evaluations. (Pope/Hartley over Elijah Moore) We simply cannot expect to compete at a high level in P5 football with such a high bust rate at the WR position.

Looking back at hindsight those guys were Huge pickups after a 10-4 season. But in comparison Alabama picked up J.Juedy, D. Smith, H.Ruggs 3 first rounders in one class.... Cristobal and Burton are insane for that and we know they’re Bama but even then that’s impressive asf. The only other positional group even more lackluster is CB, and the only other with just has high of a bust rate is O-line. This simply cannot continue, Manny has the staff for it, so we’ll see but overall this isn’t a post to bash our current WRs. Few wanted Harley, Pope and Wiggins to succeed under Enos more than me. I say this as a reflection post because unfortunately Dugans and CMR set WR recruitment back a few years, hopefully Manny and Likens can bring us back to being competitive at that position with the 2020-2022 class. Need these freshmens to get some burn next few games tho.
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Again, ... evaluations.

Also, Manny does not appear to me to have a disciplined recruiting process. Been saying this. Hope he has great instincts.
 
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I said this yesterday on another thread but we hear year after year “ you should never have to leave S Fla for skill position players”.

Fact is we Evidently can’t recruit ( pay enough) for the Jeudy’s and Watkins of the world and we suck at recruiting and/or evaluating the rest of the wr down there cause 95% of all of the WR’s we’ve had here for the last decade or so have been slow,had hands of stone or both.

It kills me when I watch teams like Memphis and Houston running not one,not two but three and four receivers out there that are fast as fCk and don’t drop anything then watch us run out 4/5 receiver sets and have to pray the ball hits them in the chest or the DB covering them falls down so we can get a completion.We never win contested balls or make adjustments mid air.

Something is wrong when teams at a lower level cart out receiving corps like this and we struggle not Only to get whole WR corps like this but we can’t find one for Gods sake.

Something has to change when it comes to the recruiting for WR,LBers and DB’s or we can forget about ever worrying about being legitimate again none the less a NC contender.Im waiting to see if Manny has the balls to make the necessary changes.

I didn’t think Manny was the right choice for the HC job but said I was willing to give him a chance.Well he has made great strides in recruiting and on the coaching staff on the offensive side but I’m waiting to see if he is willing to get rid of others that need to go and to make the changes necessary to get us to the top again.

Tick Tock Manny.Tick Fcking Tock...
 
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rustywalkedaway said:
I think this is some revisionist history.

1. We recruited studs at WR.
2. We lost out on the highest profile guys, most regularly to Alabama. There will also ALWAYS be a South Florida guy like Atwell that we missed, for whatever reason, but who balls out elsewhere. Let's not get outlier obsessed.
3. We also signed some studs. Pope was a big get. Who didn't think Wiggins could play? The problem is they didn't become anything special and it hurts bad now.

IMO this really exposes two issues. First, we have had a **** of a time keeping the real tri-county studs home. Hopefully this class changes that trend. Second, our receivers just have not gotten much better during their time here. I don't see any change in that regard yet.
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We need one these four star WRs and CBs to get drafted in the first round. We’ve been extremely unlucky.

Richards had the measurables of a first round receiver. Henderson getting cussed out by Rumph cost us a first round CB.

We just need to catch a break with one of these young WR since we clearly don’t have a first round DB on the current roster.
 
"Daquris Wiggins- 6’3, 175 (Southridge)- Big frame with the room to add strength. Has very good body control and excels in jump ball situations. Southridge had an inconsistent QB and three other FBS targets, which limited Wiggins’ opportunities. But as a sophomore at Killian, you saw him show off his underrated speed (22.8 200M) on end-arounds and screens."

Ouch, excels at jump ball situations.

You don't perform in high school, you generally don't perform in college. The writing was on the wall for Wiggins. To your credit, the best play I've seen him on is an end around.

Njoku, still remember you guys going on about him. Evidence was about as unimpressive a prospect as could be.

Ezzard, reach city and slow as molasses. Would've been just like the current guys, no separation.

Pope, didn't understand how this twig would be a college superstar. Always been taking about his eighth grade body. To be fair, I hate how him and Harley are used here. It's a true disservice to them both.

I thought Harley would be a star here.

Was excited about Hightower, didn't work out.

Thomas, same thing, but still remember watching him on that show and thinking, this could be a problem.

Dugans, you guys used to ride him so hard. The Donk. I don't think he was bad, all things considered and the timing of it all.
 
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SayWhat said:
"Daquris Wiggins- 6’3, 175 (Southridge)- Big frame with the room to add strength. Has very good body control and excels in jump ball situations. Southridge had an inconsistent QB and three other FBS targets, which limited Wiggins’ opportunities. But as a sophomore at Killian, you saw him show off his underrated speed (22.8 200M) on end-arounds and screens."

Ouch, excels at jump ball situations.

You don't perform in high school, you generally don't perform in college. The writing was on the wall for Wiggins.

Njoku, still remember you guys going on about him. Evidence was about as unimpressive a prospect as could be.

Ezzard, reach city and slow as molasses. Would've been just like the current guys, no separation.

Pope, didn't understand how this twig would be a college superstar. Always been taking about his eighth grade body. To be fair, I hate how him and Harley are used here. It's a true disservice to them both.

I thought Harley would be a star here.

Was excited about Hightower, didn't work out.

Thomas, same thing, but still remember watching him on that show and thinking, this could be a problem.

Dugans, you guys used to ride him so hard. The Donk. I don't think he was bad, all things considered and the timing of it all.
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We were really calling Dugans our best recruiter alongside Hartley, and Hartley got us Brevin, Mallory, Payton and Hodges lmfaoo...
 
The reality is our offense has been bad for so long. We haven’t had a dominant receiver that teams had to game plan on since Dre. Everyone on this board keeps talking South Florida talent. Well that South Florida talent has left the building and gone to Bama, GA, etc. This is where our coaches need to be better evaluators of talent. Tutu Atwell is someone who could’ve helped this Wr group. He’s at Louisville. Think about that...Louisville. We haven’t had a consistent eye for talent since Butch.
 
IcemanArcade said:
Alabama had 3 different OCs calling plays all 3 years of jeudy collegiate career (Daboll/Locksley 2017, Locksley/Enos 2018, Steve Sarkisian 2019) Jeudy wouldn’t be a bust no matter where he go. You can’t teach what he got.
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Yes but he had quarterbacks and here he woulda been a blocking machine. He wouldn't have been as great here like he was at Alabama. He woulda been so so.
 
The three that got away, not talking the elites, were Moore, Atwell, and Schwartz.

We could've gotten Moore and Atwell. Schwartz was looking for the best of both worlds, football and T&F. If we could've landed him though, teams would've been terrified of the those three on the field at the same time.
 
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