Why I'm not concerned about our offensive scheme...yet

[ghost2]

> As good as UM looked in its hurry-up offense Saturday, don't start believing the Canes are married to it. "I was just trying to take our greatest advantage and widen that gap. I hope it helped. We stayed in it for quite some time because we felt it was helping, wearing down the defense," Golden said. "But every game plan is different."


Here's the thing - we ran those WR curls and slants into the ground on Saturday because they were there. All game long. Every time. I kept expecting BC to jump on it by the 3rd quarter, but they just never did. I can't imagine how frustrating it must have been for their DL/LBs having Morris drop back for half a second then dump it to Jenkins or Hurns for 4, 5, 6 yards at a clip every play. Kudos to Fisch for at least sticking with what was working.

Furthermore, I think this was EXACTLY the gameplan Morris needed for his first game as a full-time starter on the road vs. an ACC opponent. Drop back two feet and gun it to the sideline 30 times? Then pitch it to Duke Johnson and start the high-fives? You got it, boss! It had to be a nice little confidence boost to play like that all game long and have it work. Plus, the short curl/slant game really plays to Morris' strengths (arm strength, tight windows) and masks his weaknesses (multiple reads, touch passes)

Now, if we're still running the lateral offense exclusively vs. VTech, I agree we'll be in trouble. As one poster pointed out in a previous thread - it's like the whole gameplan was one big setup with no payoff. That said, if we can start mixing in some "payoff" in the next few games - seam passes to the TE, double-moves on the outside (sluggo with Jenkins would KILL, IMO) wheel routes for the RB, etc. - we can really keep defenses on their heels. The above quote from Golden gives me hope that the hurry-up horizontal offense is not necessarily our modus operandi for the year...

 

[skyman]

Im not worried with the offense at all. Fisch showed last year in our bigger games later in the season that he always had a good game plan. And that was with Jacory at the helm. We moved the ball against VT and FSU. One thing I think we have to keep in mind Fisch will get cute for a series or two every game, that will leave you scratching your head but he is still a young coordinator with alot of influences, I hope to see a more refined offense as the season moves on.


Plus his work with our qb the last couple years have been great, the reclaimation project of Jacory to atleast be serviceable was good and Morris I think will thrive in the second year of this offense. I really want to see what we do with Kansas st. as last year we seemed to kind of baby Jacory the first few games to build his confidence.

 

[JHallCanes]

No doubt we find out more about our team this week than last week.

 

[BWCD]

I think the gameplan for BC helped not only within the game, as all of this short stuff was wide open all day long--but it will help us in games later this year as teams will have to gameplan for the short stuff--which will draw defenses closer to the LOS and allow us to take more shots deep. Once the deep ball start working with this stuff, the middle of the field will open up...and then the TE's will get their catches we've been looking for. We put the short passing game on film for all of our opponents to see--and showed we could be dominant with it. Now they have to scheme for it. And we will in turn scheme to beat their adjustments (I would hope) by opening up the vertical passing game a little more.

I still think we could accomplish most of the same things we did Saturday from under center w/playaction, but the shotgun hurry-up isn't bad. And to those saying this is "the spread" and we're copying Oregon...it's really not. If nothing else, it's reminiscent of the K-Gun up-tempo offense that the Bills ran with Jim Kelly way back in the day. Even a few Jerry Glanville run & shoot "Red Gun" concepts are in there as well.

 

[TotesMagotes]

I hope so. 207 yards on 42 attempts is not efficient I don't care how often you're completing those passes.

The perception is the offense looked good. But when you take out the two Duke runs and the Perryman TD. You're looking at 280 yards of total offense at 3.6 yrds/play and 21 points. Against a mediocre, at best, ACC defense.

Duke is going to have to be superman every week if this offense is going to be this inconsistent drive for drive all year.

 

[jevoasis]

Also consider this game plan served to settle the young/unproven receivers down. They weren't being asked to do too much, and still had issues with their hands going into the 2nd half. As the receivers develop (and as Morris gets comfortable with them) the O will begin to open up considerably. I definitely think we see more vertical routes this week.

 

[JHallCanes]

Also consider this game plan served to settle the young/unproven receivers down. They weren't being asked to do too much, and still had issues with their hands going into the 2nd half. As the receivers develop (and as Morris gets comfortable with them) the O will begin to open up considerably. I definitely think we see more vertical routes this week.

Good point, especially after we were down 14 points right away. Still thought we would see more shots downfield in the second half but I will concede. We should see some wrinkles against KSU.

 

[gcane44]

I agree with the season long perspective in terms of "set-up" and "pay off" and I think (and hope) that it will show to be true and show Fisch's growth as an OC.

I think Fisch was figured out toward the end of last season and that's why the offense became more dependent on a few big plays to bail it out. I'm hoping this is the beginning of him incorporating a macro perspective to his already micro game planning of each game (i.e. understanding what the next DC likely sees from the tape and being ready to make him pay for it)

 

[DeadPoets]

Not sure why people say "multiple reads" for Morris is his weakness. I've seen him plenty of times go through his progressions without getting happy feet.
And he's hasd how many combined starts?

 

[wisecane]

I hope so. 207 yards on 42 attempts is not efficient I don't care how often you're completing those passes.

The perception is the offense looked good. But when you take out the two Duke runs and the Perryman TD. You're looking at 280 yards of total offense at 3.6 yrds/play and 21 points. Against a mediocre, at best, ACC defense.

Duke is going to have to be superman every week if this offense is going to be this inconsistent drive for drive all year.

And if my Aunt had balls she'd be my Uncle. You are assuming that if Duke doesn't hit those two runs, we would not have scored/gained anymore yards on those drives.

I see what your line of thinking is, and I sort of agree with it except that Duke did hit those big runs (just like Lamar last year, McGahee, Portis, Edge.....see where I'm going with this). We shouldn't bemoan our current successes because of so many past failures.

 

[FlipT]

We had the post and slants open all day ,but Fisch didn't trust the wrs. The pick came off of a deep post so I guess we just have to suck it up until catching the football at Greentree translates to game day.

 

[riceman]

We were a couple of drops away from breaking some huge numbers. We got some good numbers anyway. I look forward to when those drops turn into catches, I expect they will soon. We had guys in the right places a lot of times, just needs to turn that into production. We had a lot of jitters out there early on, that's got to get better.

 

[umhurricano]

We ran a lot of posts and slants, but they were defending those because they gave so much cushion to our receivers. If you watch the passing trees, and most of the outs and curls, Morris checked down from posts and slants to what was available in the flat. Additionally, think of all the dropped balls, which have nothing to do with scheming or Morris's ability to work through his progressions.

The only thing not in the scheme was the homerun ball which makes sense in the context of the overall game. Our D was getting dominated. Once we tied everything up, Fisch was undoubtedly trying to control the ball with long drives to keep our D rested and off the field and keep us in the game. Same deal once we had a lead.

A lot of people on this board seem to think that the offensive and defensive scheme (particularly the defensive scheme) from this game is what we will install for every game. Don't be surprised if it completely changes based on the opponent. Golden and staff will put us in a position to win, whether it is pretty or not. Not that I want to be VaTech, but they have perfected this art and consistently win 10 games. I will take wins over style until we are good enough to dominate like we used to.

 

[Canesfan]

Who is Jenkins? Maybe Scott?

 

[DeadPoets]

Also consider this game plan served to settle the young/unproven receivers down. They weren't being asked to do too much, and still had issues with their hands going into the 2nd half. As the receivers develop (and as Morris gets comfortable with them) the O will begin to open up considerably. I definitely think we see more vertical routes this week.

Good point, especially after we were down 14 points right away. Still thought we would see more shots downfield in the second half but I will concede. We should see some wrinkles against KSU.

The one time we did take a shot BC covered it well. I think BC was very adamant on not letting our WRs get behind their safeties.
I was encouraged that we had an OC (first time in years) that took what they gave us.

How many times did Whipple take shots downfield just for the sake of taking shots downfield?

 

[Miami82]

Not sure why people say "multiple reads" for Morris is his weakness. I've seen him plenty of times go through his progressions without getting happy feet.
And he's hasd how many combined starts?

The progression is too slow. That is why he almost had a pick on his 4th read.

 

[TotesMagotes]

I hope so. 207 yards on 42 attempts is not efficient I don't care how often you're completing those passes.

The perception is the offense looked good. But when you take out the two Duke runs and the Perryman TD. You're looking at 280 yards of total offense at 3.6 yrds/play and 21 points. Against a mediocre, at best, ACC defense.

Duke is going to have to be superman every week if this offense is going to be this inconsistent drive for drive all year.

And if my Aunt had balls she'd be my Uncle. You are assuming that if Duke doesn't hit those two runs, we would not have scored/gained anymore yards on those drives.

I see what your line of thinking is, and I sort of agree with it except that Duke did hit those big runs (just like Lamar last year, McGahee, Portis, Edge.....see where I'm going with this). We shouldn't bemoan our current successes because of so many past failures.

First of all, everyone you mentioned was draft eligible when they became the feature back. Duke is a true freshman. But not really my point.

I can see I wasn't very clear. Even with the Duke runs our yards per play was below average. Without his contributions the figure is staggeringly miserable. Forget total yards as it isn't a true indicator of offensive efficiency.

5.25 yrds/play w/ the Duke runs. And 3.636 yrds/play without them.

To put this in perspective 5.25 yrds/play would have ranked 80th in the nation last year with the likes of Troy and Vanderbilt. Kent St ranked dead last, last year with 3.89 yrds/play.

It is just one game and I'm not jumping to conclusions based on 79 plays of offense. But this offense needs to be more efficient even if Duke is going to busting 50 yards runs every weeks because 5.25 yrds/play usually yields about 20 to 25 pts/game over a whole season.

Don't expect this team to score 41 again if they continue to average 5 yards a play. All I am saying.

 

[Pennmed Canefan]

I'm never overly concerned or happy after one game but I can't just throw this out. One of my problems with the idea that we couldnt go downfield was that we could. When morris threw intermediate or deep routes he hit hurns once, hit scott once (drop), and we were close on that dorsett play. So clearly we could get to that stuff. I think we went short because we wanted to. Now p

 

[Pennmed Canefan]

I'm never overly concerned or happy after one game but I can't just throw this out. One of my problems with the idea that we couldnt go downfield was that we could. When morris threw intermediate or deep routes he hit hurns once, hit scott once (drop), and we were close on that dorsett play. So clearly we could get to that stuff. I think we went short because we wanted to. Now pOint 2 is that I think college offenses are limited in what they can do so it's a bit hard for me to expect a large overhaul in a week. I guess we'll see but I think we'll see quite a bit of the same stuff obviously with some new stuff put in as well. I find an identity change hard to conceive.

 

[VinnDogg]

I think the gameplan for BC helped not only within the game, as all of this short stuff was wide open all day long--but it will help us in games later this year as teams will have to gameplan for the short stuff--which will draw defenses closer to the LOS and allow us to take more shots deep. Once the deep ball start working with this stuff, the middle of the field will open up...and then the TE's will get their catches we've been looking for. We put the short passing game on film for all of our opponents to see--and showed we could be dominant with it. Now they have to scheme for it. And we will in turn scheme to beat their adjustments (I would hope) by opening up the vertical passing game a little more.

I still think we could accomplish most of the same things we did Saturday from under center w/playaction, but the shotgun hurry-up isn't bad. And to those saying this is "the spread" and we're copying Oregon...it's really not. If nothing else, it's reminiscent of the K-Gun up-tempo offense that the Bills ran with Jim Kelly way back in the day. Even a few Jerry Glanville run & shoot "Red Gun" concepts are in there as well.

While I agree with this in theory, it would have been wise to utilize the TE and the backs other than Duke if you were trying to "show" other teams on film some different looks. We haven't had a reliable consistent deep passing game in years. We haven't had a QB, or capabale WR's to scare anyone. Why BC elected to play deep is somewhat surprising. I would play tight and make UM prove they can throw downfield before I concede.