The struggle at defensive back

[Gables Cane]

Mario has shown that he's very good at identifying and acquiring high school talent. Just look at some of the kids we've signed (top 7 classes the last 2 years) and those we recruited heavily and just missed out on (Colin Simmons, Anthony Hill, Dylan Stewart, Jeremiah Smith, etc.). Talent identification and talent acquisition are not problem areas for the program.

What Mario has not shown is the ability to develop talent. Talent development remains a massive TBD but will become clearer in the next 2 years.

 

[BS85]

The new player to trigger everyone for no apparent reason....Damari Brown

 

[Canes2523]

so is al golden the best recruiter we had
he just didnt use the correct scheme
imagine him with no cloud and our current NIL

That's a very good question.

 

[Astcloud11]

From 2016-2018 we finished 12th, 20th and 4th nationally in pass efficiency defense.

DB coach responsible? Mike Rumph.

From 2016-2022 (seven recruiting cycles), we signed 2 DBs out of high school who were drafted.

DB coach responsible? Mike Rumph.

Basically our choice is the can or the can opener. We can't have both for some reason.

Diaz and Banda were responsible, not Rumph. He didn't have full control over the guys he wanted for his corner room (he was the CB coach, not over all DBs on top of that). They even prevented him from going after Asante Samuel until it was too late.

 

[Canesq]

would agree the D.Backs are not great but tackling is not an issue of "talent"
also take the right pursuit angles!!!! I was at GT game and we seemed to never take the "angle" in pursuit

Totally agree. Yes we’ve recruited poorly at DB but we’ve also had poor coaching as well.

How many games were we in dogfights with a middle of the road ACC team where all of that team’s 3 star CBs turned into All Americans? There’s no busted coverages or their DBs inability to cover a drag route.

It’s embarrassing watching a team do a simple motion and there’s no awareness on the possibilities of what the play could be.

I was starting to call what plays GT was running.

The talent isn’t there and neither are instincts and awareness.

Trifecta complete.

 

[dorsey1]

The last great DT was Vince Wilfork-

DT is where it all starts-

Scott, is the highest rated DT we have recruited in years-

Will he turn out to be the goods? Time will tell-

We have not been great at that position-

We have some decent guys but, nothing like we had years ago-

 

[BigDikDaddyFromCincinnati]

people I trust around the program think highly of him.

Fair enough

 

[Confidence1000]

@Confidence1000

v

Jesus Christ what dis man talkin bout? Talm bout he grew a few inches! Man WTH! BIG PAUSE

Ayo Scott!

Hey yo Chico! Hit the button next time

 

[E1k]

We've come a long way from DBs don't lose you games.

bruh

 

[Hurracanes]

Horrific strategy with HS prospects and ****** portal evaluations. For years, the secondary hasn’t been prioritized enough. This year, Mario finally decided to recruit this room and unfortunately for us, 2 of our commitments are dealing with serious injuries. Can’t make this up.

 

[E1k]

Mario has shown that he's very good at identifying and acquiring high school talent. Just look at some of the kids we've signed (top 7 classes the last 2 years) and those we recruited heavily and just missed out on (Colin Simmons, Anthony Hill, Dylan Stewart, Jeremiah Smith, etc.). Talent identification and talent acquisition are not problem areas for the program.

What Mario has not shown is the ability to develop talent. Talent development remains a massive TBD but will become clearer in the next 2 years.

Now im not saying i disagree but brotha you just named literally 4 of the top players in the country i think all of them were at minimum top15 in their class, 3 of them were all considered cant miss prospects by everyone. Thats not identifying talent

You could have said anez and oj, or some of the younger guys who flashed

 

[wushah]

It starts with the head coach, dc, and db coach. We need talent at those coaching spots to help get the players. Once we have alignment there, it will be easier to identify who we want and need to play in this defense. I don't get the sense that we have the talent at HC, DC, and DB coach, don't have the alignment, and therefore can't get the players we want.

In this situation, Mario, who isn't going anywhere, needs to make the call on Guidry and our DB coach. He then will need to allocate additional spend to make up for his current roster deficiencies. It's an over-rotated response, but this is how he will need to pay the piper for the sins that occurred before he get to Miami and after. If he tries to stay within a "DB budget", he'll get what he paid for, ie Jaden Harris and Jadais Richard. I'm not trying to disrespect those guys, but they obviously haven't lived up to their promise which is old news to everyone here.

 

[TexasCane90]

Love seeing all these posts about lack of talent, speed, blah blah blah

We don’t need 2001 canes talent top to bottom to field an above average unit… this is on coaching being unable to deliver even average results with let’s be honest a talented enough roster

 

[Cylo]

Yet Guidry has had db misses and targeted transfer dbs from the elite db school of Vanderbilt apparently and Marshall in the portal. He can’t coach or recruit wtf is he here smh

Since Vanderbilt isn't that bad this season, they might have a safety that would be an upgrade over here lol. Lets go for 3 str8 years of Vandy DBs

 

[Cylo]

I'm curious what the defense looks like during practice, they getting torched by the scout team as well?

I think about this too. Isn't it funny during the summer the defense was ahead of the offense and we were worried about the offense

 

[Cane_J15]

Seems like were always going after the obvious recruits and miss on pretty much all of them. The ones we do get are bust. There so many DBS that go on to ball out. Numbers wise were always low. Never any guys waiting there turn.

It so bizarre. Every power 4 team seems to have at least one solid DB from the Miami area, EXCEPT Miami.

Part of the problem was prioritizing "elite" prospects well beyond the point where it was apparent we were going to finish 3 or 4th, at best. Then predictably, we were too late jumping in on kids already committed to UL, Pitt, MSU, Ole Miss. USCa, etc.

DB is the most apparent currently, but this has been a problem across several staffs are all South FL money positions-- CB, S, WR, RB, DE, and LB.

Coaches felt that if their Plan A thru D targets were top 200 players they were doing their job. While that's partly true, it overlooks our real bread and butter, which is south FL kids who outperform their star rankings in college.

There are literally so many kids down here who lack some elite measurable, that they just get slapped as a 3 star and the services move on, but the kids on field production is out of hand. Those are the kids we're supposed to be signing too.

Ding ding ding we have a winner!!! This explains it all! With the portal now also theres no reason at all we should be in this position. We were all screaming for dbs an they picked up Hill an ignored Safety, rode with what we had. We all knew it was coming! After DPJ who had done anything?? Ill wait

 

[Lokest]

We of course can’t have productive receivers a good o line and Cam Ward paired with a down and dirty defense.

Cam will go onto the NFL and the QB problem will rear its ugly head AGAIN and all the 5 star corners/db's we need now will sign but then our QB sucks balls...

This cycle is called the never ending miserable life of a Miami Hurricane fan.

I’ve had patience for 20+ years of irrelevance, not to be negative but we fix one thing and the next falls apart. When will it all come together and click

I've been past the point in thinking that miami will ever win another one in my lifetime. It's time for a lot of people to accept that as well.

 

[bobbydigius]

It starts with the head coach, dc, and db coach. We need talent at those coaching spots to help get the players. Once we have alignment there, it will be easier to identify who we want and need to play in this defense. I don't get the sense that we have the talent at HC, DC, and DB coach, don't have the alignment, and therefore can't get the players we want.

In this situation, Mario, who isn't going anywhere, needs to make the call on Guidry and our DB coach. He then will need to allocate additional spend to make up for his current roster deficiencies. It's an over-rotated response, but this is how he will need to pay the piper for the sins that occurred before he get to Miami and after. If he tries to stay within a "DB budget", he'll get what he paid for, ie Jaden Harris and Jadais Richard. I'm not trying to disrespect those guys, but they obviously haven't lived up to their promise which is old news to everyone here.

Spend is one thing but the strategy in terms of what we are looking for in CBs has been awful. They like bigger more physical corners but are slow. When we get a speed guy, they are usually completely raw and major projects. Remember the off season when we were sold that Richard was fast?

Now if we want to have an elite room then yes, we need to spend accordingly, but I’m talking baby steps here. Let’s start with having a functional room that doesn’t embarrass itself on Saturdays and that can be solved with just better strategy and identification. I do like what Jackson has done there. Now I know Merritt may eventually flip but that is exactly the type of kid we should recruit that is 3 star but the kid can outright play CB and for our sakes also can run.

 

[Dwinstitles]

Before I get into it, let me start with a disclaimer: this not a thread about Guidry's coaching, nor is it an excuse for him. Our defense has many issues that go beyond talent. But I wanted to focus on this specific problem, since it's plagued us for almost a decade now.

The last time Miami played great pass defense was from 2016-2018. We finished 12th, 20th and 4th nationally in pass efficiency defense over those three seasons. There are a lot of reasons why those groups played well, but one of them jumped off the page. Here are our starters from that era and the amount of games they played in the NFL:

Adrian Colbert- 41 games
Corn Elder- 35 games
Rayshawn Jenkins- 115 games (and counting)
Jamal Carter- 29 games
Jaquan Johnson- 60 games
Sheldrick Redwine- 34 games
Dee Delaney- 52 games
Mike Jackson- 48 games (and counting)

It's not complicated- we had some talent. Pretty much every DB starter from that period played multiple NFL seasons. It seems the sweet spot was Al Golden's recruits playing in Manny Diaz's scheme (two more Golden DBs, Artie Burns and Deon Bush, were drafted the previous year).

Now look at the drought that followed. From 2016-2022 (seven recruiting cycles), these are the only DBs we signed out of high school who were drafted as defensive backs:

DJ Ivey
Kam Kinchens

That's it. Two in seven years. If you include James Williams, who was drafted as a LB, it becomes three. And even though the problem goes well beyond local misses, this is an era where South Florida DBs got drafted in droves:

Patrick Surtain (1)
CJ Henderson (1)
Kaiir Elam (1)
Tyson Campbell (2)
Asante Samuel (2)
Trayvon Mullen (2)
Jordan Battle (3)
Marco Wilson (4)
Jarvis Brownlee (5)
Josh Metellus (6)
Rachad Wildgoose (6)
Faion Hicks (7)
James Wiggins (7)

When I look at the current group, OJ Frederique is the only guy that I feel good about as a future NFL talent. Maybe Damari Brown if he comes back strong. But this is a problem that has plagued us for a long time and has only gotten worse in past nine years. Mario's first full class (2023) was notably lacking in defensive backs, so it's not just a Manny issue.

We need to land multiple NFL defensive backs in the Class of 2025, and the Portal will have to make up for some misses. Miami is not Miami without a great secondary.

We suck at spending for DB it’s a premium position that cost a lot of money. We cheap asf or something in that area. This is the U we should always have top ten picks at every defensive spot. Period…..especially DB. I have hope for Stubbs but a lot of the evaluators here are scaring me with him.

Mario has failed DB it falls on him. Either he’s *** at evaluating or he’s not good at getting them. Or it’s both