Sean Allen... From enemy #1 to hero...

[btcane]

You non-lawyers are TOTALLY WRONG re Fifth Amendment. It CAN be raised in any proceding -- in, or out of court, if the information 'tends' to place you in jeopardy of criminal prosecution. If cop questions you on the street you can refuse to answer him/her. But, you will probably get a free ride to the jail.

 

[FullyERicht]

You non-lawyers are TOTALLY WRONG re Fifth Amendment. It CAN be raised in any proceding -- in, or out of court, if the information 'tends' to place you in jeopardy of criminal prosecution. If cop questions you on the street you can refuse to answer him/her. But, you will probably get a free ride to the jail.

What crime would be have been in jeopardy of being charged

 

[stormsurge]

 

[NoahZach]

You non-lawyers are TOTALLY WRONG re Fifth Amendment. It CAN be raised in any proceding -- in, or out of court, if the information 'tends' to place you in jeopardy of criminal prosecution. If cop questions you on the street you can refuse to answer him/her. But, you will probably get a free ride to the jail.

What crime would be have been in jeopardy of being charged

That's a different point, though. The initial comments were as to whether the 5th Amendment can be asserted in non-criminal contexts and, as btcane notes, it can. I agree that it isn't a blanket right, irrespective of the existence of a threat of prosecution, etc. Ultimately, just because we don't know if he was at risk of being charged with a crime and what that crime might be doesn't mean there wasn't one. Hopefully not, though. Bottom line is that you don't mess around in a deposition and that includes improperly pleading the Fifth.

By the way, can you imagine the stories if he had taken the Fifth? Suddenly, what was going on at UM wouldn't be viewed by the public and press as mere violations of NCAA regulations of questionable merit, but as crimes that are being concealed by a guy that once worked at UM. I imagine that would not have been good for us at all.

 

[canes1977]

You non-lawyers are TOTALLY WRONG re Fifth Amendment. It CAN be raised in any proceding -- in, or out of court, if the information 'tends' to place you in jeopardy of criminal prosecution. If cop questions you on the street you can refuse to answer him/her. But, you will probably get a free ride to the jail.

The Supreme Court has held that "the Fifth Amendment does not forbid adverse inferences against parties to civil actions when they refuse to testify in response to probative evidence offered against them." Baxter v. Palmigiano,[49] "[A]s Mr. Justice Brandeis declared, speaking for a unanimous court in the Tod case, 'Silence is often evidence of the most persuasive character.'"[50] "'Failure to contest an assertion ... is considered evidence of acquiescence ... if it would have been natural under the circumstances to object to the assertion in question.'"[51]

 

[NoahZach]

You non-lawyers are TOTALLY WRONG re Fifth Amendment. It CAN be raised in any proceding -- in, or out of court, if the information 'tends' to place you in jeopardy of criminal prosecution. If cop questions you on the street you can refuse to answer him/her. But, you will probably get a free ride to the jail.

The Supreme Court has held that "the Fifth Amendment does not forbid adverse inferences against parties to civil actions when they refuse to testify in response to probative evidence offered against them." Baxter v. Palmigiano,[49] "[A]s Mr. Justice Brandeis declared, speaking for a unanimous court in the Tod case, 'Silence is often evidence of the most persuasive character.'"[50] "'Failure to contest an assertion ... is considered evidence of acquiescence ... if it would have been natural under the circumstances to object to the assertion in question.'"[51]

That's correct. In a civil proceeding, the Court can instruct a jury that it may draw an adverse inference from the refusal to answer if someone pleads the Fifth. The person still has the right to refuse to answer, absent some exceptions, but there can be an adverse inference drawn from the person's doing so. I believe that usually applies to parties to an action, but that's a guess.

It would be interesting to see if the COI would draw adverse inferences from Fifth Amendment assertions by witnesses in enforcement actions . . . but not in UM's case. Let it be interesting when someone else is in the crosshairs.

 

[Classic]

He got dealt a bad hand, but I still think he's a **** for folding like a cheap suit. And a bit of an opportunist for attaching himself to the Shapiro teet.

But regardless, he obviously loves The U and has done everything within his power to redeem himself.

He's back to "don't shank" in my book.

Yeah, he just should have lied under oath and risked jail time

I went to law school.

You don't have to sing like a **** yellow canary in a deposition.

You answer the questions truthfully, succinctly, and with "yes," "no," or "I don't know" whenever possible, for example.

There are different ways to navigate a deposition than to bend over and spill all you know.

Which is what he did.

Because he was scared.

Because he's a *****.

 

[bomb]

He got dealt a bad hand, but I still think he's a **** for folding like a cheap suit. And a bit of an opportunist for attaching himself to the Shapiro teet.

But regardless, he obviously loves The U and has done everything within his power to redeem himself.

He's back to "don't shank" in my book.

Yeah, he just should have lied under oath and risked jail time

I went to law school.

You don't have to sing like a **** yellow canary in a deposition.

You answer the questions truthfully, succinctly, and with "yes," "no," or "I don't know" whenever possible, for example.

There are different ways to navigate a deposition than to bend over and spill all you know.

Which is what he did.

Because he was scared.

Because he's a *****.

Glad you're not my lawyer. In fact, you sound like a non-practicing lawyer. Did you even pass the bar? And I'm even more glad you're not involved with this process in any way whatsoever.

 

[Anon]

He got dealt a bad hand, but I still think he's a **** for folding like a cheap suit. And a bit of an opportunist for attaching himself to the Shapiro teet.

But regardless, he obviously loves The U and has done everything within his power to redeem himself.

He's back to "don't shank" in my book.

Yeah, he just should have lied under oath and risked jail time

I went to law school.

You don't have to sing like a **** yellow canary in a deposition.

You answer the questions truthfully, succinctly, and with "yes," "no," or "I don't know" whenever possible, for example.

There are different ways to navigate a deposition than to bend over and spill all you know.

Which is what he did.

Because he was scared.

Because he's a ****.

It's nice that you went to law school. Does that mean you were unable to graduate? Or did you struggle on the bar?

 

[Classic]

I'm not suggesting he should have lied. I'm not sure why you're taking such remarkable issue with my stance that Sean Allen overshared in his deposition.

Read the damned transcript.

"Did you supply money from Shapiro to Robert Marve to purchase a car?"

The answer is no.

But Sean goes on this bumbling story about how Marve hounded him to ask Shapiro for help with a down payment, but only because there was insurance money exchanging hands, and he's not sure if anything ever came of it, but he can't remember the exact dates, and blah blah blah. Verbal diarreah.

That's how they got the Al Golden/Bridgewater/Dan Marino's allegation that was later dropped. Because Allen started just spilling information instead of truthfully answering just the question asked.

My point is that he offered way more information than he was legally obligated to provide.

Listen, if you're MoralMan Supreme, and you want all of Miami's dirty laundry out there, regardless of consequence, then I understand your position. You shouldn't want me to be your lawyer. But if you're trying to navigate a "process" and retreat as unscathed as possible, well, then, that's when you share only what you are legally obligated to.

Ya jerks.

Oh, and Sean Allen is a *****.

 

[Anon]

I'm not suggesting he should have lied. I'm not sure why you're taking such remarkable issue with my stance that Sean Allen overshared in his deposition.

Read the damned transcript.

"Did you supply money from Shapiro to Robert Marve to purchase a car?"

The answer is no.

But Sean goes on this bumbling story about how Marve hounded him to ask Shapiro for help with a down payment, but only because there was insurance money exchanging hands, and he's not sure if anything ever came of it, but he can't remember the exact dates, and blah blah blah. Verbal diarreah.

That's how they got the Al Golden/Bridgewater/Dan Marino's allegation that was later dropped. Because Allen started just spilling information instead of truthfully answering just the question asked.

My point is that he offered way more information than he was legally obligated to provide.

Listen, if you're MoralMan Supreme, and you want all of Miami's dirty laundry out there, regardless of consequence, then I understand your position. You shouldn't want me to be your lawyer. But if you're trying to navigate a "process" and retreat as unscathed as possible, well, then, that's when you share only what you are legally obligated to.

Ya jerks.

Oh, and Sean Allen is a ****.

Hey Roy black, you're talking about a guy that was a **** equipment guy. He was sat down for a federal deposition. Sorry he didn't meet your high standards.

 

[bomb]

I'm not suggesting he should have lied. I'm not sure why you're taking such remarkable issue with my stance that Sean Allen overshared in his deposition.

Read the damned transcript.

"Did you supply money from Shapiro to Robert Marve to purchase a car?"

The answer is no.

But Sean goes on this bumbling story about how Marve hounded him to ask Shapiro for help with a down payment, but only because there was insurance money exchanging hands, and he's not sure if anything ever came of it, but he can't remember the exact dates, and blah blah blah. Verbal diarreah.

That's how they got the Al Golden/Bridgewater/Dan Marino's allegation that was later dropped. Because Allen started just spilling information instead of truthfully answering just the question asked.

My point is that he offered way more information than he was legally obligated to provide.

Listen, if you're MoralMan Supreme, and you want all of Miami's dirty laundry out there, regardless of consequence, then I understand your position. You shouldn't want me to be your lawyer. But if you're trying to navigate a "process" and retreat as unscathed as possible, well, then, that's when you share only what you are legally obligated to.

Ya jerks.

Oh, and Sean Allen is a *****.

So you DID fail the bar exam. Got it!

 

[Anon]

I'm not suggesting he should have lied. I'm not sure why you're taking such remarkable issue with my stance that Sean Allen overshared in his deposition.

Read the damned transcript.

"Did you supply money from Shapiro to Robert Marve to purchase a car?"

The answer is no.

But Sean goes on this bumbling story about how Marve hounded him to ask Shapiro for help with a down payment, but only because there was insurance money exchanging hands, and he's not sure if anything ever came of it, but he can't remember the exact dates, and blah blah blah. Verbal diarreah.

That's how they got the Al Golden/Bridgewater/Dan Marino's allegation that was later dropped. Because Allen started just spilling information instead of truthfully answering just the question asked.

My point is that he offered way more information than he was legally obligated to provide.

Listen, if you're MoralMan Supreme, and you want all of Miami's dirty laundry out there, regardless of consequence, then I understand your position. You shouldn't want me to be your lawyer. But if you're trying to navigate a "process" and retreat as unscathed as possible, well, then, that's when you share only what you are legally obligated to.

Ya jerks.

Oh, and Sean Allen is a ****.

So you DID fail the bar exam. Got it!

He's a tough guy on the message board, but hey...Hialeah law school will do that for you. Unfortunately, Hialeah law school doesn't prepare it's students too well for the bar.

 

[Classic]

Jesus. Do you two take turns under Sean Allen's desk, or is there room under there for both of you?

You're typically a fun-to-read poster, bomb, it's a shame you're being such a huge ****. What do you take issue with? Where am I wrong?

 

[Anon]

I'm not judging him either way, that's my point. You don't know the guy. You probably don't know 10 percent of the story with him, yet you become an online tough guy and call him a derogatory names on message boards. I just think that makes you the weak, uneducated person. Ironic, being that's what you're accusing Allen of.

 

[Classic]

He's a tough guy on the message board, but hey...Hialeah law school will do that for you. Unfortunately, Hialeah law school doesn't prepare it's students too well for the bar.

I'm the Internet tough guy, but you're the one tossing grammatically depressed insults...regarding my education?

Not that any of this is high-level-thinking attorney work.

 

[Classic]

I'm not judging him either way, that's my point. You don't know the guy. You probably don't know 10 percent of the story with him, yet you become an online tough guy and call him a derogatory names on message boards. I just think that makes you the weak, uneducated person. Ironic, being that's what you're accusing Allen of.

Hey, call me an ******* all you want. I'm just not wrong about the legality of what I'm suggesting. That's the part that annoyed me.

I think he hurt my alma mater a little, and so I called him a mean name. I'm sorry that got under your skin and so colored your perspective of my character. I'll buy you a beer at Sun Life.

 

[Anon]

Yea I'm sorry. I wrote a quick post on my iPad that added an apostrophe. You got me. I'm an idiot.

By, the way, you never addressed the previous subject. You said you wen to law school...did you graduate...did you pass the bar? Perhaps you went to the maria perez school of ethics?

 

[Anon]

I'm not judging him either way, that's my point. You don't know the guy. You probably don't know 10 percent of the story with him, yet you become an online tough guy and call him a derogatory names on message boards. I just think that makes you the weak, uneducated person. Ironic, being that's what you're accusing Allen of.

Hey, call me an ******* all you want. I'm just not wrong about the legality of what I'm suggesting. That's the part that annoyed me.

I think he hurt my alma mater a little, and so I called him a mean name. I'm sorry that got under your skin and so colored your perspective of my character. I'll buy you a beer at Sun Life.

Fair enough. Truce lol.

 

[Classic]

I went to UCLA Law, the #15 law school in the country, and passed the California bar, which has the lowest passage rate in the country.

Thanks for the chop blocks, though, guys. I endured hours of misery within those halls with the specific hopes of being able to argue deposition strategy with you.