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Mario versus his predecessors

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ItsAUThing.com said:
Randy had a lot of star power in that class, but he sucked at recruiting by position, need and filling holes. I think he had something like eight wide receivers in that class

Also brought in 32 kids and then some didn’t even make it—Arthur Brown, Brandon Marti, etc.—while 5-Stars like Brandon Harris and Marcus Forston didn’t pan out.

Marve was 2007 class—Jacory U-Swag Haircut was in 2008 with all 37 kids from Northwestern.

That was one or the biggest smoke and mirrors #1 class of all time; on paper stars, with a lot or head cases and underachievers—Jordan Futch, Ben Jones, Vaughan Telemaque, Jeremy Lewis all 4-Stars? Total joke.
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Landed all the Northwestern kids but failed eval on Lavonte David.

Shannon was a joke of a head coach.

Folden was a disease of a head coach.
 
JimmyJohnsonsHair said:
Randy Shannon had the #1 recruiting class in 2008 and flipped Marve from Alabama the previous year. Let's hope Cristobal turns out to be a better gameday coach.
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I can understand some healthy skepticism but to use Shannon and his 2008 class as a comparison to what Mario brings is frankly a bit head scratching. Not trying to be a jerk as a understand your cation but Randy Shannon? LOL
 
FrancisSawyer said:
I can understand some healthy skepticism but to use Shannon and his 2008 class as a comparison to what Mario brings is frankly a bit head scratching. Not trying to be a jerk as a understand your cation but Randy Shannon? LOL
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The point is simply that a good recruiting class does not guarantee success. Obviously I hope things work out better for Mario than they did for Shannon but his gameday coaching is still a concern to me.
 
JimmyJohnsonsHair said:
The point is simply that a good recruiting class does not guarantee success. Obviously I hope things work out better for Mario than they did for Shannon but his gameday coaching is still a concern to me.
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True one class doesn't guarantee success but Mario is an infinitely better recruiter. GameDay coaching is obviously something he still needs to improve on and I believe his best days are ahead of him. Mario is already a better GameDay coach than Manny Diaz so that's a start.
 
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NicKane said:
Shannon also failed to land the most important recruit in that class, Patrick Johnson/Peterson. Like you said, that 2008 “number one” class was a paper tiger.
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I will never forget in 08 the focus was on a heavy Florida team. I even drunk the Kool-Aid and hate that logic sense. The new AD Dan has given me a jolt of hope.
 
Brooklyndee said:
Maybe I'm just sensitive towards coach richt and defensive but it sounded like you were tearing down cmr in order to build up Mario. If I'm wrong I apologize. If not it's simply not necessary. Without cmr NONE OF THIS IS POSSIBLE... People don't realize just how much he really did for this program and he didn't struggle at all to put together a staff. He actually had a **** of a staff. His problems began and virtually ended with his health and nepotism. Regardless he is an amazing man and deserves any real cane fans utmost respect...
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Every good memory we’ve had here in basically 20 years is because of him
 
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ItsAUThing.com said:
Randy had a lot of star power in that class, but he sucked at recruiting by position, need and filling holes. I think he had something like eight wide receivers in that class

Also brought in 32 kids and then some didn’t even make it—Arthur Brown, Brandon Marti, etc.—while 5-Stars like Brandon Harris and Marcus Forston didn’t pan out.

Marve was 2007 class—Jacory U-Swag Haircut was in 2008 with all 37 kids from Northwestern.

That was one or the biggest smoke and mirrors #1 class of all time; on paper stars, with a lot or head cases and underachievers—Jordan Futch, Ben Jones, Vaughan Telemaque, Jeremy Lewis all 4-Stars? Total joke.
Click to expand...
Some interesting facts on that 2008 class:

- Class size was 32 commitments
- 8 players (all 3 stars) were gone after the 2008 season (Brandon Marti, Joe Wylie, Zach Kane, Antonio Harper, Gavin Hardin, Taylor Cook, Cannon Smith)
- 2 players (Theron Collier - 3 star, Arthur Brown 5 star) were gone after the 2009 season
- 31 percent of the class had departed by the time the 2010 season had begun

Some more interesting facts on the 2010 class:
- Class size was 30 commitments
- 10 players were gone after the 2010 season (3 four star players in Latwan Anderson, Tavadis Glenn, Storm Johnson, and 7 three stars in Delmar Taylor, Devont'a Davis, Jeremy Davis, Jermaine Barton, Kevin Nelson)
- 3 players (all three stars - Darion Hall, Keion Payne, Andrew Tallman) were gone after the 2011 season
- 45 percent of the class had departed by the time the 2012 season had begun

As for the wide receiver signings in the 2008 class, that's actually an interesting story of recruiting failure, roster management, and ultimately a near decade long ramification:

What led to this was recruiting. Miami's wide receiver signings under Larry Coker were few and far between. For a national championship team this was baffling. Following the 2002 class, Miami was never able to sign more than two wide receivers in a single year, and one year completely failed to sign any:

2002 (3): Ryan Moore, Sinorice Moss, Akieem Jolla
2003 (1): Darnell Jenkins
2004 (2): Khalil Jones, Lance Leggett
2005 (0): None
2006: (2): Sam Shields, George Robinson

Thus entering the 2006 season we had but six scholarship wide receivers, having successfully recruited only five wide receivers over the previous four years. By mid-season in 2006 we were down to just three healthy wide receivers, and our offense which was already struggling ground to a halt.

2006 Season: (6 WRs): Ryan Moore (5th yr), Darnell Jenkins (4th yr), Khalil Jones (3rd yr), Lance Leggett (3rd yr), Sam Shields (1st yr), George Robinson (1st yr)
2007 Season: (6 WRs): Darnell Jenkins (5th yr), Khalil Jones (4th yr), Lance Leggett (4th yr), Sam Shields (2nd yr), K. Farquharson (1st yr), Jermaine McKenzie (1st yr), Leonard Hankerson (1st yr)

Randy Shannon was able to bring in Farquharson for one year, but faced his first full recruiting class with a dilemma. He had only three wide receivers returning for the 2008 season (Shields, McKenzie, and Hankerson). Shannon was now forced to oversign in the 2008 class to bring numbers up to full, and brought in more wide receivers in one class than Larry Coker had been able to sign in four.

2008 Season (11 WRs): Khalil Jones (5th yr), Sam Shields (3rd yr), Jermaine McKenzie (2nd yr), Leonard Hankerson (2nd yr), Aldarius Johnson (1st yr), Davon Johnson(1st yr), Tommy Streeter (1st yr), Kendall Thompkins (1st yr), Thearon Collier (1st yr), Travis Benjamin (1st yr), LaRon Byrd (1st yr)

This surge was only temporary. Shields was moved to defense and McKenzie transferred, leaving the large 2008 signees as the only wide receivers on roster. Because he had signed seven in 2008, he was unable or was disinclined to bring in anyone in the 2009 class.

2009 Season (8 WRs): Leonard Hankerson (3rd yr), Aldarius Johnson (2nd yr), Davon Johnson(2nd yr), Tommy Streeter (2nd yr), Kendall Thompkins (2nd yr), Thearon Collier (2nd yr), Travis Benjamin (2nd yr), LaRon Byrd (2nd yr)

The giant 2008 class again had an impact the following season, as Shannon was able to sign only one new wide receiver for the 2010 class (a second signee failed to qualify). Miami remained at 8 wide receivers, but now the bulk of them were upper classmen. By signing so many two seasons earlier, Randy was now beginning to replicate the recruiting issues that Coker had.

2010 Season (8 WRs): Leonard Hankerson (4th yr), Aldarius Johnson (3rd yr), Davon Johnson (3rd yr), Tommy Streeter (3rd yr), Kendall Thompkins (3rd yr), Travis Benjamin (3rd yr), LaRon Byrd (3rd yr), Allen Hurns (1st year)

After Shannon departed Al Golden was able to bring in two freshmen recruits, maintaining numbers at 8 wide receivers after Aldarius Johnson and Leonard Hankerson departed. But the majority of the position were upper classmen whose eligibility was running out:

2011 Season (8 WRs): Davon Johnson (4th yr), Tommy Streeter (4th yr), Kendall Thompkins (4th yr), Travis Benjamin (4th yr), LaRon Byrd (4th yr), Allen Hurns (2nd year), Philip Dorsett (1st yr), Rayshawn Scott (1st yr)

This lopsided roster led to conditions similar to what existed after 2007. Entering his first full recruiting class in Feb 2012, Al Golden now found himself in a similar situation as Randy Shannon before the 2008 national signing day. He now needed to oversign in order to get numbers back up to par. Golden landed five wide receivers in that class, and had a sixth at one point (4 star Angelo Jean-Louis) who never played.

2012 Season (11 WRs): Davon Johnson (5th yr), Kendall Thompkins (5th yr), Allen Hurns (3rd yr), Phillip Dorsett (2nd yr), Rashawn Scott (2nd yr), Malcolm Lewis (1st yr), D'Mauri Jones (1st yr), Herb Waters (1st yr), Jontavious Carter (1st yr), Robert Lockhart (1st yr)

After that wide receiver recruiting finally stabilized. We would have one more class that would feature only one signee (2015 - Lawrence Cager), but never again a three year stretch where only three players were successfully recruited in a position that generally requires that a team maintain ten players.

Again, it is an interesting story about how recruiting failures can have impacts that can last for a longer period than one might expect.
 
GojiraCane said:
Some interesting facts on that 2008 class:

- Class size was 32 commitments
- 8 players (all 3 stars) were gone after the 2008 season (Brandon Marti, Joe Wylie, Zach Kane, Antonio Harper, Gavin Hardin, Taylor Cook, Cannon Smith)
- 2 players (Theron Collier - 3 star, Arthur Brown 5 star) were gone after the 2009 season
- 31 percent of the class had departed by the time the 2010 season had begun

Some more interesting facts on the 2010 class:
- Class size was 30 commitments
- 10 players were gone after the 2010 season (3 four star players in Latwan Anderson, Tavadis Glenn, Storm Johnson, and 7 three stars in Delmar Taylor, Devont'a Davis, Jeremy Davis, Jermaine Barton, Kevin Nelson)
- 3 players (all three stars - Darion Hall, Keion Payne, Andrew Tallman) were gone after the 2011 season
- 45 percent of the class had departed by the time the 2012 season had begun

As for the wide receiver signings in the 2008 class, that's actually an interesting story of recruiting failure, roster management, and ultimately a near decade long ramification:

What led to this was recruiting. Miami's wide receiver signings under Larry Coker were few and far between. For a national championship team this was baffling. Following the 2002 class, Miami was never able to sign more than two wide receivers in a single year, and one year completely failed to sign any:

2002 (3): Ryan Moore, Sinorice Moss, Akieem Jolla
2003 (1): Darnell Jenkins
2004 (2): Khalil Jones, Lance Leggett
2005 (0): None
2006: (2): Sam Shields, George Robinson

Thus entering the 2006 season we had but six scholarship wide receivers, having successfully recruited only five wide receivers over the previous four years. By mid-season in 2006 we were down to just three healthy wide receivers, and our offense which was already struggling ground to a halt.

2006 Season: (6 WRs): Ryan Moore (5th yr), Darnell Jenkins (4th yr), Khalil Jones (3rd yr), Lance Leggett (3rd yr), Sam Shields (1st yr), George Robinson (1st yr)
2007 Season: (6 WRs): Darnell Jenkins (5th yr), Khalil Jones (4th yr), Lance Leggett (4th yr), Sam Shields (2nd yr), K. Farquharson (1st yr), Jermaine McKenzie (1st yr), Leonard Hankerson (1st yr)

Randy Shannon was able to bring in Farquharson for one year, but faced his first full recruiting class with a dilemma. He had only three wide receivers returning for the 2008 season (Shields, McKenzie, and Hankerson). Shannon was now forced to oversign in the 2008 class to bring numbers up to full, and brought in more wide receivers in one class than Larry Coker had been able to sign in four.

2008 Season (11 WRs): Khalil Jones (5th yr), Sam Shields (3rd yr), Jermaine McKenzie (2nd yr), Leonard Hankerson (2nd yr), Aldarius Johnson (1st yr), Davon Johnson(1st yr), Tommy Streeter (1st yr), Kendall Thompkins (1st yr), Thearon Collier (1st yr), Travis Benjamin (1st yr), LaRon Byrd (1st yr)

This surge was only temporary. Shields was moved to defense and McKenzie transferred, leaving the large 2008 signees as the only wide receivers on roster. Because he had signed seven in 2008, he was unable or was disinclined to bring in anyone in the 2009 class.

2009 Season (8 WRs): Leonard Hankerson (3rd yr), Aldarius Johnson (2nd yr), Davon Johnson(2nd yr), Tommy Streeter (2nd yr), Kendall Thompkins (2nd yr), Thearon Collier (2nd yr), Travis Benjamin (2nd yr), LaRon Byrd (2nd yr)

The giant 2008 class again had an impact the following season, as Shannon was able to sign only one new wide receiver for the 2010 class (a second signee failed to qualify). Miami remained at 8 wide receivers, but now the bulk of them were upper classmen. By signing so many two seasons earlier, Randy was now beginning to replicate the recruiting issues that Coker had.

2010 Season (8 WRs): Leonard Hankerson (4th yr), Aldarius Johnson (3rd yr), Davon Johnson (3rd yr), Tommy Streeter (3rd yr), Kendall Thompkins (3rd yr), Travis Benjamin (3rd yr), LaRon Byrd (3rd yr), Allen Hurns (1st year)

After Shannon departed Al Golden was able to bring in two freshmen recruits, maintaining numbers at 8 wide receivers after Aldarius Johnson and Leonard Hankerson departed. But the majority of the position were upper classmen whose eligibility was running out:

2011 Season (8 WRs): Davon Johnson (4th yr), Tommy Streeter (4th yr), Kendall Thompkins (4th yr), Travis Benjamin (4th yr), LaRon Byrd (4th yr), Allen Hurns (2nd year), Philip Dorsett (1st yr), Rayshawn Scott (1st yr)

This lopsided roster led to conditions similar to what existed after 2007. Entering his first full recruiting class in Feb 2012, Al Golden now found himself in a similar situation as Randy Shannon before the 2008 national signing day. He now needed to oversign in order to get numbers back up to par. Golden landed five wide receivers in that class, and had a sixth at one point (4 star Angelo Jean-Louis) who never played.

2012 Season (11 WRs): Davon Johnson (5th yr), Kendall Thompkins (5th yr), Allen Hurns (3rd yr), Phillip Dorsett (2nd yr), Rashawn Scott (2nd yr), Malcolm Lewis (1st yr), D'Mauri Jones (1st yr), Herb Waters (1st yr), Jontavious Carter (1st yr), Robert Lockhart (1st yr)

After that wide receiver recruiting finally stabilized. We would have one more class that would feature only one signee (2015 - Lawrence Cager), but never again a three year stretch where only three players were successfully recruited in a position that generally requires that a team maintain ten players.

Again, it is an interesting story about how recruiting failures can have impacts that can last for a longer period than one might expect.
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I think it speaks to lack of foresight and poor roster management as much as anything else. Was Farquharson really the closest thing to a transfer we took during this period?

Great writeup!
 
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brcane1 said:
I think it speaks to lack of foresight and poor roster management as much as anything else. Was Farquharson really the closest thing to a transfer we took during this period?

Great writeup!
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I believe so, but I wasn’t following roster management so closely then. It’s a lot clearer now. Yes, Kayne was a plug-in due to the complete lack of depth. Coker’s departure put a crimp in the 2007 class…I’m not certain who would (or did decommit). I remember Randy landed McKenzie, but then he missed his freshmen year after getting into an auto accident. So really, we entered the 2007 season with just six healthy wide receivers. Same situation as Coker in his last year. It’s no surprise we did so poorly that season. There was no depth and no margin for error.
 
Cknucks305 said:
Mario may not be the best on game day or in game planning, but he has the chance to build a team that is so talented we will overwhelm most opponents. I also believe he will hire top notch assistants while also improving himself.
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Agreed. I also think he legit had the best win in college football this past year. Going into Ohio State's house, playing at noon west (9 pst for Oregon kids) and dominating Ohio State at their place was unbelievable. It won't be perfect, no coaches are but he will give us a better chance than anyone we've had in a long time.
 
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