Mario and Talent Acquisition

[MikeyCanez]

I wanted to wait until after we got a quarterback because at this rate, we are going to end up re-recruiting Poffenbarger.

But there were waaaay too many people on here talking about how Mario isn't elite at talent acquisition anymore. Fast forward a few weeks and despite almost no momentum to end the season, he has beaten out a lot of brand-name schools with lots of money to land at least 7 surefire contributors (wait and see on Karnley) and overhauled a secondary with no defensive coordinator in place and a current secondary coach that is likely a lame duck.

He also retained almost every key player from a 10-win team (Horton and Williams are the exceptions) with almost none of the drama that FSU had with Payton and DeLoach and others last season. He even snatched a well-respected personnel and talent evaluator away from Bill Belichick of all people.

I think it is time to put the narrative that Mario can't acquire talent to bed once and for all.

Yes, these evaluations still have to pan out and there is PLENTY to criticize him for and we will see what happens at quarterback and defensive coordinator.

But he deserves credit for not resting on the laurels of a 10-win season and identifying and addressing areas of weakness in the offseason.

Next year will be a huge litmus test for how we end up thinking about his tenure here, but good things are in motion at the very least.

 

[407cane]

this year was a disappointment but it was still our best season since 2003

three losses by a combined 10 points and the last one we can agree with his decision or not - we practically forfeited

even 2017 we got beat by pitt, smoked by clemson, and then *** kicked by Wisconsin - was entirely more flukey - this year, we were bigger, faster, and stronger than every team we played

IF he gets a QB to bridge to nickel - then he has done exactly what most expected him to do - build consistent 10-win teams. Will he win the title? idk, but winning 10 games consistently, sure as **** would beat the last 22 years

 

[OrangeBowlMagic]

Team is a solid QB and another piece or two away from being a 10 win type team again. Plenty of foundation on both lines, and that’s where teams are built. FSU fell apart because they couldn’t block a soul. That will not happen here.

Now….the “solid QB” isn’t exactly easy. So that’s a big puzzle piece. But imo the rest is there to have a step down on offense and a step up on defense. Hiring a good DC is going to be key in all this as well, obviously. But add Xavier Lucas to this roster and I feel pretty **** good about the secondary.

 

[MikeyCanez]

Team is a solid QB and another piece or two away from being a 10 win type team again. Plenty of foundation on both lines, and that’s where teams are built. FSU fell apart because they couldn’t block a soul. That will not happen here.

Now….the “solid QB” isn’t exactly easy. So that’s a big puzzle piece. But imo the rest is there to have a step down on offense and a step up on defense. Hiring a good DC is going to be key in all this as well, obviously. But add Xavier Lucas to this roster and I feel pretty **** good about the secondary.

I am hopeful the tweaked approach in the portal will lead to more impact players as well. I know we will probably end up taking almost as many transfers as we did last season (15), but we aren't losing any depth and so it feels like we are targeting a higher tier of portal player.

I am cautiously optimistic when it comes to quarterback. But we have way too much money and too good of an offensive line not to convince an upgrade to shake loose.

 

[TOcane]

I also see the comparison to Manny with the 3rd year as far as records go. That is another fallacy that they are equal even with the extra money. In Manny's best year he went 8-3 and we were blown out by Clemson and UNC. In these last two years we have been in position in the 4th quarter to win every game. That is an improvement. Saying that less than 9 wins next year even with not knowing who the QB is to me is not acceptable.

 

[OrangeBowlMagic]

I am hopeful the tweaked approach in the portal will lead to more impact players as well. I know we will probably end up taking almost as many transfers as we did last season (15), but we aren't losing any depth and so it feels like we are targeting a higher tier of portal player.

I am cautiously optimistic when it comes to quarterback. But we have way too much money and too good of an offensive line not to convince an upgrade to shake loose.

Well let’s be real. We’re losing a ton of depth at WR/TE.

The top 6 pass catchers, and 7 of the top 8, in terms of receptions are gone. A massive amount of production. But we do have some kids who hopefully can fill in. I’m confident in the offensive skill talent.

 

[caneinpsl]

Mario has done a better job of bringing in talent than his immediate several predecessors but unless he improves at the other parts of the job and continues to improve the roster it may not mean much. It's not like you can leave the cubbards full for the next guy in the era of NIL and the portal. Either Mario figures it all out or it's a reset with the next guy. Let's hope we can snag a QB and keep things moving forward.

 

[RVACane]

I wanted to wait until after we got a quarterback because at this rate, we are going to end up re-recruiting Poffenbarger.

But there were waaaay too many people on here talking about how Mario isn't elite at talent acquisition anymore. Fast forward a few weeks and despite almost no momentum to end the season, he has beaten out a lot of brand-name schools with lots of money to land at least 7 surefire contributors (wait and see on Karnley) and overhauled a secondary with no defensive coordinator in place and a current secondary coach that is likely a lame duck.

He also retained almost every key player from a 10-win team (Horton and Williams are the exceptions) with almost none of the drama that FSU had with Payton and DeLoach and others last season. He even snatched a well-respected personnel and talent evaluator away from Bill Belichick of all people.

I think it is time to put the narrative that Mario can't acquire talent to bed once and for all.

Yes, these evaluations still have to pan out and there is PLENTY to criticize him for and we will see what happens at quarterback and defensive coordinator.

But he deserves credit for not resting on the laurels of a 10-win season and identifying and addressing areas of weakness in the offseason.

Next year will be a huge litmus test for how we end up thinking about his tenure here, but good things are in motion at the very least.

I don’t really agree with the premise of this thread for most people who criticize Mario on here. Mario is the same very good recruiter he’s always been. The negative that many are noting is that NIL removes a lot of that advantage acting as an equalizer to his best skill - recruiting. It is what it is. That’s why, in my opinion, and the opinion of a number of us, the skills of evaluation, development and coaching prowess have increased in relation to recruiting prowess. A lot of it just comes down to money.

 

[407cane]

Mario has done a better job of bringing in talent than his immediate several predecessors but unless he improves at the other parts of the job and continues to improve the roster it may not mean much. It's not like you can leave the cubbards full for the next guy in the era of NIL and the portal. Either Mario figures it all out or it's a reset with the next guy. Let's hope we can snag a QB and keep things moving forward.

I think he made big strides this year in terms of game management

people can talk about the 4th down decision at Syracuse when he kicked instead of going for it - and for good reason, but that's minor in comparison to some of the other decisions he's made in year's past where he's been crucified (for good reason).

He had some great decisions this year - one that comes to mind the most was the early 2 point conversion against cal when we first started the comeback

 

[OrangeBowlMagic]

Mario has done a better job of bringing in talent than his immediate several predecessors but unless he improves at the other parts of the job and continues to improve the roster it may not mean much. It's not like you can leave the cubbards full for the next guy in the era of NIL and the portal. Either Mario figures it all out or it's a reset with the next guy. Let's hope we can snag a QB and keep things moving forward.

Cubbards, my guy???

 

[MikeyCanez]

Well let’s be real. We’re losing a ton of depth at WR/TE.

The top 6 pass catchers, and 7 of the top 8, in terms of receptions are gone. A massive amount of production. But we do have some kids who hopefully can fill in. I’m confident in the offensive skill talent.

True. I agree on the offensive skill talent and also think they will still add another receiver at some point. Receiver feels like a position where you can get acclimated quickly, so I am fine looking to the Spring if we can't land Branch or Thomas or someone of that caliber.

In college especially, if you have a QB that can get you the ball, being an above-average wide receiver is easier.

 

[TOcane]

I don’t really agree with the premise of this thread for most people who criticize Mario on here. Mario is the same very good recruiter he’s always been. The negative that many are noting is that NIL removes a lot of that advantage acting as an equalizer to his best skill - recruiting. It is what it is. That’s why, in my opinion, and the opinion of a number of us, the skills of evaluation, development and coaching prowess have increased in relation to recruiting prowess. A lot of it just comes down to money.

I don't believe this notion that NIL negates recruiters. Money has been involved for as long as the sport has been around. Sales is sales. The purpose of a sales person is to win when things are somewhat equal or even when you are at a slight advantage. That's what Mario and good recruiters do.

 

[caneinpsl]

I think he made big strides this year in terms of game management

people can talk about the 4th down decision at Syracuse when he kicked instead of going for it - and for good reason, but that's minor in comparison to some of the other decisions he's made in year's past where he's been crucified (for good reason).

He had some great decisions this year - one that comes to mind the most was the early 2 point conversion against cal when we first started the comeback

I agree that game management was somewhat improved this year but there are still plenty of issues that need to be addressed. For instance, we have no special teams coordinator and that's a deficiency. But Mario shows some willingness to grow and change prior coaches hadn't. Yesterdays hire being an example.

 

[RVACane]

I don't believe this notion that NIL negates recruiters. Money has been involved for as long as the sport has been around. Sales is sales. The purpose of a sales person is to win when things are somewhat equal or even when you are at a slight advantage. That's what Mario and good recruiters do.

I don’t agree with your assessment on the impact of NIL. It’s different now. Money is entirely in the open as a bidding war and it’s much bigger. There’s a lot more parity this year as a result of schools who didn’t play the bag game - at least not competitively - now in the legal bag game.

There’s still value to being a good recruiter. If all things are the same as to money, or close to it, the better recruiter can shine in those situations. But it’s less impactful of a trait, in my opinion, than pre-NIL days. If I’m hiring a HC today, I am putting the ability to evaluate, develop and coach above recruiter.

 

[MikeyCanez]

I don’t really agree with the premise of this thread for most people who criticize Mario on here. Mario is the same very good recruiter he’s always been. The negative that many are noting is that NIL removes a lot of that advantage acting as an equalizer to his best skill - recruiting. It is what it is. That’s why, in my opinion, and the opinion of a number of us, the skills of evaluation, development and coaching prowess have increased in relation to recruiting prowess. A lot of it just comes down to money.

I get it and definitely think there is plenty of truth to that idea. But I also think one year of less-than-ideal recruiting results isn't a large enough sample size to say that conclusively.

We definitely can't be missing on as many top-end targets as we did to end this cycle and our classes lack the Top 50 talent of Oregon and Auburn and Georgia. But I'd like to see if they tweak the strategy this year (more in-season official visits, less relying on late season flips, hopefully way less Dennis Smith) and it has any impact.

Maybe one of the insiders knows, but I would be really curious to know if we are beating Georgia and Oklahoma for O'Connor or Penn State for Blay because we are desperate and thus offering more money. I would think the offers can't differ THAT much. But maybe we are just dropping bags to stay afloat.

 

[Mikesmith29150]

Our team is being built the right way as our fans whine and cry.
Our rebuild is similar to Michigan with Harbaugh.

 

[CANESCANES]

No idea how true this is but seems like he required a big bag to land him

 

[RVACane]

I get it and definitely think there is plenty of truth to that idea. But I also think one year of less-than-ideal recruiting results isn't a large enough sample size to say that conclusively.

We definitely can't be missing on as many top-end targets as we did to end this cycle and our classes lack the Top 50 talent of Oregon and Auburn and Georgia. But I'd like to see if they tweak the strategy this year (more in-season official visits, less relying on late season flips, hopefully way less Dennis Smith) and it has any impact.

Maybe one of the insiders knows, but I would be really curious to know if we are beating Georgia and Oklahoma for O'Connor or Penn State for Blay because we are desperate and thus offering more money. I would think the offers can't differ THAT much. But maybe we are just dropping bags to stay afloat.

There could be a lot of things going on. Playing time helps. When I think about it, the gator had a better class and there’s no way Billy Napier’s a better pure recruiter than Mario. They paid a **** ton in NIL and so I understand it. I wasn’t mad. I’m sure Lagway helps but I think the money is probably the difference in things.

 

[MikeyCanez]

I don’t agree with your assessment on the impact of NIL. It’s different now. Money is entirely in the open as a bidding war and it’s much bigger. There’s a lot more parity this year as a result of schools who didn’t play the bag game - at least not competitively - now in the legal bag game.

There’s still value to being a good recruiter. If all things are the same as to money, or close to it, the better recruiter can shine in those situations. But it’s less impactful of a trait, in my opinion, than pre-NIL days. If I’m hiring a HC today, I am putting the ability to evaluate, develop and coach above recruiter.

I think Lashlee is a perfect litmus test for this opinion. Convenient hypothetical of course, but assuming we are a Top 10-15 team in recruiting every season and SMU is a Top 25-30, would you rather have Mario and the talent or Lashlee and the development?

I think SMU had the perfect storm of schedule and experience and will take a step back, so I'd rather have Mario and the talent. But I can easily see the argument the other way.

 

[RVACane]

I think Lashlee is a perfect litmus test for this opinion. Convenient hypothetical of course, but assuming we are a Top 10-15 team in recruiting every season and SMU is a Top 25-30, would you rather have Mario and the talent or Lashlee and the development?

I think SMU had the perfect storm of schedule and experience and will take a step back, so I'd rather have Mario and the talent. But I can easily see the argument the other way.

That’s a good situation. I think the way I look at it though is would I rather have Mario at UM with our NIL or Lashlee at UM with our NIL???