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Issiah Walker

So with only one IC left, who would people take -- Williams or Walker?* I am super-impressed by Walker's ceiling, think he has far more potential. But I personally would take Williams because he is plug & play with no personal drama, which means he gives us a far better chance to win more games in 2020.

*I'm assuming Moise goes to prep, since he apparently won't be cleared by the NCAA to play at any school.
 
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nuprin said:
You are correct, it's a count forward. But as TOC has stated ad-naseum...you can count forward ONLY after fall term, which is the exact title of that by law you posted. Essentially, all the EE's we had in January fall under this bylaw (unless any were used as a countback).
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Thanks for the kind words in the prior posting.

Honest to God, I'm not trying to be a **** about it. I wish that people would just read the rules and ask questions, instead of passing along incorrect information.

The NCAA doesn't help matters. It's the **** NCAA that uses the "count forward" language for Spring and Summer enrollees, when the actual truth is that these are "early enrollees" for the upcoming year.

Instead, some of these posters think we can count backwards AND forwards AND "present tense", which just isn't the case.

As a practical matter, there's just two choices. "Now" and "countbacks". Nobody who enrolls in Spring or Summer is playing until the Fall anyhow.

When I was PM'ing with Ivins and going over the wording of the rules, he had a funny comment, he asked me how he could explain this in a 90 second video. He's right. You can't.

One last way of thinking of this, for FOOTBALL only...the "measurement date" is in August...but the TRUE "reset date" is January. In January you can start to pivot and take guys for either the "present year" or the "upcoming year". In August, you are stuck with the "present year" or a "prior year".

Hope everyone has a great weekend, maybe we'll get some good news on one or both OLs. I hope we can get both, but I'm from Missouri, so Manny has to "show me".
 
TheOriginalCane said:
Thanks for the kind words in the prior posting.

Honest to God, I'm not trying to be a **** about it. I wish that people would just read the rules and ask questions, instead of passing along incorrect information.

The NCAA doesn't help matters. It's the **** NCAA that uses the "count forward" language for Spring and Summer enrollees, when the actual truth is that these are "early enrollees" for the upcoming year.

Instead, some of these posters think we can count backwards AND forwards AND "present tense", which just isn't the case.

As a practical matter, there's just two choices. "Now" and "countbacks". Nobody who enrolls in Spring or Summer is playing until the Fall anyhow.

When I was PM'ing with Ivins and going over the wording of the rules, he had a funny comment, he asked me how he could explain this in a 90 second video. He's right. You can't.

One last way of thinking of this, for FOOTBALL only...the "measurement date" is in August...but the TRUE "reset date" is January. In January you can start to pivot and take guys for either the "present year" or the "upcoming year". In August, you are stuck with the "present year" or a "prior year".

Hope everyone has a great weekend, maybe we'll get some good news on one or both OLs. I hope we can get both, but I'm from Missouri, so Manny has to "show me".
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Have a couple brews...you deserve it.
 
grover said:
So with only one IC left, who would people take -- Williams or Walker?* I am super-impressed by Walker's ceiling, think he has far more potential. But I personally would take Williams because he is plug & play with no personal drama, which means he gives us a far better chance to win more games in 2020.

*I'm assuming Moise goes to prep, since he apparently won't be cleared by the NCAA to play at any school.
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On the Moise issue, I would definitely like to get clarification on whether prep school helps you to avoid the "academic redshirt". Logically, this makes sense. If you had to struggle to qualify, and the NCAA wants you to sit out for a year of athletic competition, what difference should it make if you study at UM or you study at IMG Prep (though, I guess if I really think about it, some of these prep schools allow students to play sports).

So if Moise preps and doesn't play, would he be good-to-go for 2021? This is a new rule, I'm not really sure if we have an example of someone who has done this. Jobe?
 
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TheOriginalCane said:
"Deserve" might be a bit strong, but thank you.

Law school trains you in 2 important message board skills...reading things carefully, and arguing like a mo-fo. I apologize in advance for both.
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This is in response to your previous post about Moise. I don't see why he wouldn't be good to go for 2021 as long as he makes grades. They should just tell him you are playing OL here so he could mainly put his focus there and obviously school. I'm just thinking of Brandon Washington who was supposed to be in that 2008 class but went to prep school up north and came here in 2009 as a freshman.
 
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Mklein13 said:
This is in response to your previous post about Moise. I don't see why he wouldn't be good to go for 2021 as long as he makes grades. They should just tell him you are playing OL here so he could mainly put his focus there and obviously school. I'm just thinking of Brandon Washington who was supposed to be in that 2008 class but went to prep school up north and came here in 2009 as a freshman.
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Yeah, and I do agree with you about B-Wash, but that was before the rule change, so there's an extra wrinkle in there now.

Seems like there are 5 options for Moise.

1. Prep with the intent of coming to UM as soon as possible.
2. Take an LOI from another Division I-A school that has an IC slot available, and then take a redshirt year.
3. Sign with a I-AA program, possibly transfer up to I-A in the future.
4. Go to JuCo, play for 2 years, get the AA, go to any I-A school in 2 years.
5. Do not enroll in school until January 2021 (this works for IC rules, but I really doubt this works overall, as he might then be ineligible for Fall 2021).
 
TheOriginalCane said:
Yeah, and I do agree with you about B-Wash, but that was before the rule change, so there's an extra wrinkle in there now.

Seems like there are 5 options for Moise.

1. Prep with the intent of coming to UM as soon as possible.
2. Take an LOI from another Division I-A school that has an IC slot available, and then take a redshirt year.
3. Sign with a I-AA program, possibly transfer up to I-A in the future.
4. Go to JuCo, play for 2 years, get the AA, go to any I-A school in 2 years.
5. Do not enroll in school until January 2021 (this works for IC rules, but I really doubt this works overall, as he might then be ineligible for Fall 2021).
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Number 1 seems the most logical if he really wants to be here. Otherwise he'd go with number 2. Just my 14 cents.
 
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Mklein13 said:
Is he that good of a prospect for Miami to have to go through all this? And how likely is it he ends up at OL?
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I can't speak to the Offense vs. Defense question (and I think the OL projections come mostly from UM fans, to justify waiting on Moise, and happened before the Walker/Williams pursuit).

He is a good prospect and may be worth the take in January, but I would also say that there is probably a "UM is a stand-up school" angle that could play well in SoFla, that UM went out of its way to honor the commit from Moise. When you combine a better on-field product with honest straight-shooting coaches (see, generally, the "you'll play as a freshman" promise made to Walker), then you have a pretty solid recruiting pitch.
 
PittsburghCane said:
15.5.6.3.2 Recruited Student-Athlete Entering After Fall Term, Aided in First Year. [FBS/FCS] A
student-athlete recruited (per Bylaw 15.02.8 [just means he was "recruited" via visits, contact, etc...]) by the awarding institution [UM] who enters after the first term [Fall] of the academic year [the "first term of the academic year," at UM, is the Fall term, so entering "after" the Fall term means entering in the Spring term, which usually makes you an early enrollee] and immediately receives institutional financial aid (based in any degree on athletics ability) [gets a scholarship] shall be an initial counter for either the current academic year [i.e., in this case, Fall 2019- Spring 2020] (if the institution’s annual limit has not been reached [i.e., there is still space in that class's 25 IC limit]) or the next academic year [i.e., Fall 2020- Spring 2021]. The student-athlete shall be included in the institution’s total counter limit during the academic year in which the aid was first received. (Revised: 1/15/11 effective 8/1/11)

Last sentence basically is a count forward. This is why you can’t just live by a single bylaw. There’s thousands of them.
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My friend, this bylaw just explains the ability to back-count EEs to the prior academic class if there are free ICs. I put my lawyer hat on and put some comments into your quoted by-law, orange & green style. No snide-ness intended, just trying to put help put this debate to rest (for my own sanity).




* Note, none of the preceding is legal advice, and I have had several beers. So if you rely on any of this in a way that causes you financial harm or other damages, you are a moron and a slapd!ck.
 
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