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Front 7 recruiting at Miami, VT, & Duke

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I'll still give golden and d'onof the benefit of the doubt... they've fielded 2? top 25 defenses as a staff when they had their guys and here too when they had better talent.
 
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bes628 said:
CANE said:
I've always thought MIAMI had enough talent to win the coastal even without Duke and Dorsett.
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Our problems clearly have nothing to do with offense.
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Duke was a huge loss. When the offense is off the field in three downs makes a big difference on top of a depleted defense that ends up the field longer. Or score in 60 seconds off a passing attack. Just do not have the players on the defense. Look at What the ****'s defense charts when Duke and Dorsett went down. Not making any excuses for dorita but a lot of little things add up.
 
Hstokes1447 said:
There has been a lot of talk about talent and if Miami has more talent than VT & Duke. So I decided to take a deeper look at the front 7 recruiting between 2010-2013. Miami has had a very hard time recruiting in the most important area on defense during this time. VT & Duke has had success and it showed this season.

Miami 2010
DE David Perry 3 star (has never contributed)
DE Andrew Tallman 3 star (No longer on the team)
DT Jeffery Brown 2 star (no longer on the team)
DT Tavadis Glenn 4 star (never made it in)
LB Kalvin Cain 2 star (never really contributed)
LB Tyrone Cornelius 3 star (in the 2 deep)
LB James Gaines 2 star (starter)
LB Kevin Nelson 3 star (no longer on the team)
LB Travis Williams 4 star (no longer on the team)

VT 2010
DE Zack McCray 4 star (in 3 deep at TE)
DT Nick Acree 4 star (retired due to injury)
DT Derrick Hopkins 3 star (starting)
LB Brian Laiti 3 star (no longer on the team)
LB Chase Williams 3 star (in 2 deep)

Duke 2010
DE Jamal Bruce 2 star (starting)
DE Dezmond Johnson 3 star (in 3 deep)
DE Jordan Ondijo 2 star (in 2 deep)
DE Jamal Wallace 3 star (in 3 deep)
DT Will Bryant 2 star (contributing at NT)
DT Steven Ingram 2 star (in 3 deep)
LB kelby Brown 3 star (in 2 deep)
LB Clerance France 3 star (starting)

Miami 2011
DE Jalen Grimble 4 star (no longer on the team)
DE Anthony Chickillo 4 star (starter)
DE Ricardo Williams 3 star (no longer on the team)
DT Olsen Pierre 3 star (starter)
LB Eddie Johnson 3 star (no longer on the team)
LB Antonio Kinard 3 star (never made it in)
LB Gionni Paul 3 star (no longer on the team)
LB Denzel Perryman 3 star (starter)

VT 2011
DE Dewayne Alford 3 star (contributing on special teams)
DE Wedley Estime 3 star (no longer on the team)
DE Corey Marshall 4 star (in the rotation at DT)
DE Matt Roth 3 star (in 3 deep)
DE Justin Taylor 3 star (no longer on the team)
DT Kris Harley 4 star (in 3 deep)
DT Luther Maddy 2 star (starting)

Duke 2011
DE Kyler Brown 2 star (starting)
DE Lucas Brown 2 star (no longer on the team)
DE Mario Sanders 3 star (contributing on special teams)
LB Britton Grier 2 star (in DE rotation)
LB David Helton 3 star (in 2 deep)
LB LB Jon Woodruff 2 star (in 2 deep)

Miami 2012
DE Jelani Hamilton 4 star
DE Dwayne Hoilett 3 star
DE Tyriq McCord 4 star (in 2 deep)
DE Gabe Terry 3 star (no longer on the team)
DT Jacoby Briscoe 3 star (no longer on the team)
DT Dequan Ivery 3 star (no longer on the team)
DT Earl Moore 3 star (in the 3 deep)
LB Jawand Blue 3 star
LB Raphael Kirby 4 star (in the 2 deep)
LB Josh Witt 3 star (retired due to injury)

VT 2012
DE Woody Baron 3 star (in 2 dep)
DE Seth Dooley 3 star (contributing on specula teams)
DE Jarontay Jones 3 star (not on team)
DT Alston Smith 3 star (in 3 deep)
DT Nigel Williams 3 star (in 2 deep)
LB Deon Clarke 4 star (in 2 deep)
LB Trey Edmunds 4 star (moved to RB and is #1 on the depth chart)
LB Ken Ekanem 4 star (in 3 deep)
LB Dahman Mckinnon 3 star (in 3 deep)
LB Devin Vandyke 3 star (in 3 deep)

Duke 2012
DE Allen Jackson 3 star (contributing on special teams)
DE Michael Mann 2 star (in DE rotation)
DE A.J. Wolf 2 star (in 2 deep)
DE Carlos Wray 3 star (in 2 deep)
LB Keilin Rayner 3 star (in DT rotation)
LB Deion Williams 3 star (in 3 deep)

Miami 2013
DE Ufomba Kamalu 2 star (in the 2 deep)
DE AQM 4 star (in the 2 deep)
LB Devante Bond 3 star (never made it in)
LB Jermaine Grace 4 star (contributing on special teams)
LB Alex Figueroa 3 star (was in the 2 deep before injured)

VT 2013
DE Wyatt Teller 4 star (moved to OT and is redshirting)
LB Jamieon Moss 3 star (redshirting)
LB Andrew Motuapuaka (redshirting)

Duke 2013
DE Mike Ramsey 2 star (redshirting)
LB Dominic Zanca 3 star (redshirting)

The ugly truth is Miami has not recruiting well during this time in the front 7. Of the 32 front 7 commitments only 16 are actually on the roster THAT IS 50% GONE. You simply can not be successful on defense when you do not recruit well up front. The inability to retain players in the front 7 has completely eliminated the option to have competition or redshirt players. Competition is necessary because it brings out the best in players. Redshirting is extremely important when it comes to the front 7, because guys need time to build the strength needed to contribute in the trenches. Without having those luxuries Miami has been forced to play guys who have no business being on the field. I too believe the scheme sucks, but there is 0 talent or depth in the front 7 of this team.
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Good work on this list. A lot of little things start to add up when you have a lot of them. Just have not had any DTs coming in in a very long time. 2014 is looking better.
 
HurricaneinLA said:
bes628 said:
CANE said:
I've always thought MIAMI had enough talent to win the coastal even without Duke and Dorsett.
Click to expand...

Our problems clearly have nothing to do with offense.
Click to expand...

Duke was a huge loss. When the offense is off the field in three downs makes a big difference on top of a depleted defense that ends up the field longer. Or score in 60 seconds off a passing attack. Just do not have the players on the defense. Look at What the ****'s defense charts when Duke and Dorsett went down. Not making any excuses for dorita but a lot of little things add up.
Click to expand...

Out offense is putting up like 30 points a game even without them, that should be more than enough to win games. But our defense went full ******. Not tackling, bad calls, can't get off the field on third downs , no pass rush, mismatches in the passing game.
 
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Just to put the defense recruiting as a whole into perspective, here are Miami's DB commits during this same time.

Miami 2010
CB Devont'a Davis 3 star (no longer on the team)
CB Keion Payne 3 star (no longer on the team)
S Latwan Anderson 5 star (no longer on the team)
S Kacy Rodgers 3 star (in the 2 deep)


Miami 2011
CB Thomas Finnie 3 star (no longer on the team)

Miami 2012
CB Antonio Crawford 3 star (in the 2 deep)
CB Vernon Davis 3 star (no longer on the team)
CB Nate Dortch 3 star
CB Ladarius Gunter 3 star (starter)
CB Larry Hope 3 star
CB Tracy Howard 5 star (starter)
S Angelo Jean-Louis 4 star (never made it in)
S Deon Bush 4 star (starter)
S Rayshawn Jenkins 3 star (starter)

Miami 2013
CB Cornelius Elder 4 star
CB Artie Burns 4 star (in the 2 deep)
S Jamal Carter 4 star
 
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This guy gets it! We had no business taking most of those players, but the threat of sanctions kept good players away. Tallman was a Randy player, I saw him play my HS team in MA, he sucked. Never should have taken anyone like that, that was not on Golden, his hands have been tied up to this year. This class coming up is killer, as good as any class in the country. Saban, JJ and Bill Belichick couldn't have done much better with this D, most of them just don't have NFL or big time college talent, it is what it is. This is just too easy to see, why are so many Miami fans so blind? Without a good D line, you are never going to beat pretty good teams.

CarlosCanes said:
This doesn't excuse Dorito at all, but our front 7 is awful, simply awful. If you can't stop the run or get pressure on the QB, your defense will absolutely suck, its that simple.
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Hstokes1447 said:
There has been a lot of talk about talent and if Miami has more talent than VT & Duke. So I decided to take a deeper look at the front 7 recruiting between 2010-2013. Miami has had a very hard time recruiting in the most important area on defense during this time. VT & Duke has had success and it showed this season.

Miami 2010
DE David Perry 3 star (has never contributed)
DE Andrew Tallman 3 star (No longer on the team)
DT Jeffery Brown 2 star (no longer on the team)
DT Tavadis Glenn 4 star (never made it in)
LB Kalvin Cain 2 star (never really contributed)
LB Tyrone Cornelius 3 star (in the 2 deep)
LB James Gaines 2 star (starter)
LB Kevin Nelson 3 star (no longer on the team)
LB Travis Williams 4 star (no longer on the team)

VT 2010
DE Zack McCray 4 star (in 3 deep at TE)
DT Nick Acree 4 star (retired due to injury)
DT Derrick Hopkins 3 star (starting)
LB Brian Laiti 3 star (no longer on the team)
LB Chase Williams 3 star (in 2 deep)

Duke 2010
DE Jamal Bruce 2 star (starting)
DE Dezmond Johnson 3 star (in 3 deep)
DE Jordan Ondijo 2 star (in 2 deep)
DE Jamal Wallace 3 star (in 3 deep)
DT Will Bryant 2 star (contributing at NT)
DT Steven Ingram 2 star (in 3 deep)
LB kelby Brown 3 star (in 2 deep)
LB Clerance France 3 star (starting)

Miami 2011
DE Jalen Grimble 4 star (no longer on the team)
DE Anthony Chickillo 4 star (starter)
DE Ricardo Williams 3 star (no longer on the team)
DT Olsen Pierre 3 star (starter)
LB Eddie Johnson 3 star (no longer on the team)
LB Antonio Kinard 3 star (never made it in)
LB Gionni Paul 3 star (no longer on the team)
LB Denzel Perryman 3 star (starter)

VT 2011
DE Dewayne Alford 3 star (contributing on special teams)
DE Wedley Estime 3 star (no longer on the team)
DE Corey Marshall 4 star (in the rotation at DT)
DE Matt Roth 3 star (in 3 deep)
DE Justin Taylor 3 star (no longer on the team)
DT Kris Harley 4 star (in 3 deep)
DT Luther Maddy 2 star (starting)

Duke 2011
DE Kyler Brown 2 star (starting)
DE Lucas Brown 2 star (no longer on the team)
DE Mario Sanders 3 star (contributing on special teams)
LB Britton Grier 2 star (in DE rotation)
LB David Helton 3 star (in 2 deep)
LB LB Jon Woodruff 2 star (in 2 deep)

Miami 2012
DE Jelani Hamilton 4 star
DE Dwayne Hoilett 3 star
DE Tyriq McCord 4 star (in 2 deep)
DE Gabe Terry 3 star (no longer on the team)
DT Jacoby Briscoe 3 star (no longer on the team)
DT Dequan Ivery 3 star (no longer on the team)
DT Earl Moore 3 star (in the 3 deep)
LB Jawand Blue 3 star
LB Raphael Kirby 4 star (in the 2 deep)
LB Josh Witt 3 star (retired due to injury)

VT 2012
DE Woody Baron 3 star (in 2 dep)
DE Seth Dooley 3 star (contributing on specula teams)
DE Jarontay Jones 3 star (not on team)
DT Alston Smith 3 star (in 3 deep)
DT Nigel Williams 3 star (in 2 deep)
LB Deon Clarke 4 star (in 2 deep)
LB Trey Edmunds 4 star (moved to RB and is #1 on the depth chart)
LB Ken Ekanem 4 star (in 3 deep)
LB Dahman Mckinnon 3 star (in 3 deep)
LB Devin Vandyke 3 star (in 3 deep)

Duke 2012
DE Allen Jackson 3 star (contributing on special teams)
DE Michael Mann 2 star (in DE rotation)
DE A.J. Wolf 2 star (in 2 deep)
DE Carlos Wray 3 star (in 2 deep)
LB Keilin Rayner 3 star (in DT rotation)
LB Deion Williams 3 star (in 3 deep)

Miami 2013
DE Ufomba Kamalu 2 star (in the 2 deep)
DE AQM 4 star (in the 2 deep)
LB Devante Bond 3 star (never made it in)
LB Jermaine Grace 4 star (contributing on special teams)
LB Alex Figueroa 3 star (was in the 2 deep before injured)

VT 2013
DE Wyatt Teller 4 star (moved to OT and is redshirting)
LB Jamieon Moss 3 star (redshirting)
LB Andrew Motuapuaka (redshirting)

Duke 2013
DE Mike Ramsey 2 star (redshirting)
LB Dominic Zanca 3 star (redshirting)

The ugly truth is Miami has not recruiting well during this time in the front 7. Of the 32 front 7 commitments only 16 are actually on the roster THAT IS 50% GONE. You simply can not be successful on defense when you do not recruit well up front. The inability to retain players in the front 7 has completely eliminated the option to have competition or redshirt players. Competition is necessary because it brings out the best in players. Redshirting is extremely important when it comes to the front 7, because guys need time to build the strength needed to contribute in the trenches. Without having those luxuries Miami has been forced to play guys who have no business being on the field. I too believe the scheme sucks, but there is 0 talent or depth in the front 7 of this team.
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I know its a small footnote but Wesley Estime is still on VT. Changed his name to Dadi Nicolas.
 
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We've lost 17 front 7 recruits over the past 4 years while VT and Duke have lost a combined 5. B b b b but WTH told me that happened at every program? HAVE I BEEN LIED TO???
 
does not matter its coaching. all that is left is nfl talent being wasted on a bad scheme. cant wait to see highsmith and Cornelius play in the nfl or porter picked in the first round.


tons of talent folks you are to blind to see it
 
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WhatTheHell said:
Chickillo, McCord, Perryman, and Kirby are all great players. Porter was wanted by UF.

If the staff can't use them correctly that's on them.

If the staff felt Armbrister was a player and brought him in, that's on them.

If they whiffed on South Carolina's leading tackler as a true freshman that wanted to be a Cane, you guessed it, that's on them.

Identifying, attaining, and cultivating talent is in the job description.
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Florida also wanted and got Jacoby Brisset, how'd that turn out? LMAO what has Kirby shown to be great? Not saying it won't happen but come on. McCord is a GREAT, GREAT Pass Rusher but anyone who has watched him VS the run will tell you he is far from a great player yet. So its still 2 out of the front 7 and 4 or 5 out of the 2 deep if you add in AQM. Also that word attaining as in all the ones they've attained and then either left, flunked, didn't qualify or have been kicked out?
 
CANE said:
I've always thought MIAMI had enough talent to win the coastal even without Duke and Dorsett.
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we have more talent than we think... Tell you the truth I love AG to death but he is too loyal to his seniors and starters. He should have pulled players for not performing... I.e. Morris and let him see that his job is also up for the taking. But we did have the talent to have gone 11-1 this year... play calling and defense was atrocious at times this year especially the defense.
 
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Didnt Al Golden develop the "talent" at Temple or were they all 4 and 5 star recruits???
 
Alot of the actual players who have killed us were AG kids. He flipped the roster in nearly 2 years but kicked most of his guys(10) off the team or they never made it in. The kids that he's loyal to are mainly RS kids.
 
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wait, wait, wait. But I thought that was one of Goldens strengths, recruiting????
 
Guys...

We've failed to recruit legit talent on the DL.


























So let's run a scheme that requires extremely talented D-linemen!
 
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