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Confirmed Frank Ponce hired as QB Coach

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BostonCanes47 said:
Some great spin zones going on in here. App states offense scored 10 points against Miami and 16 points in 2021. So either 1. Diaz’s defense is good, 2. ponce stinks, or 3. it’s because of the talent gap.

1. We all know Diaz’s defense isn’t good unless it’s generating turnovers.

2. Ponce stinks

3. Talent gap is possible, but if so that explains why chase Brice saw a dramatic improvement in his numbers going from P5 ACC to G5 Sun belt.

The three main guys ponce has worked with are.

1. Taylor Lamb 2014 - 2017 - no real development numbers wise.

2. Malik Cunningham 2019 - 2020 - saw his numbers go down in his second year working with Ponce

3. Chase Brice - see above

If Ponce wasn’t a Miami guy and him and Mario didn’t have a prior relationship he wouldn’t even be a candidate here.
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Bump.
 
cway313 said:
Of all the hires this looks to be the worst. I wasn't as high on TVD as CIS but he looks like an FCS player now.
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I have no idea wtf Ponce’s role is in TVD’s yips are, and maybe they’re significant, but how could you guys know if it’s Ponce or Gattis or Malik or TVD or some combination?

And this is a serious question for you, @Liberty City El, and @who. You guys feel adamant about this and I’m curious to hear out the rationales. You guys know his day to day? TVD 100% looks worse. We’ve got that evidence. The cause? Here to listen.

Personally, I’ll eat crow if Ponce is the cause of TVD’s downfall. I did not see a downside to him as a QB coach. I was down on the idea of him as an OC. Garcia’s mechanics look about the same. No real disaster there (and that’s not to say he’ll do well in the system).
 
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LuCane said:
I have no idea wtf Ponce’s role is in TVD’s yips are, and maybe they’re significant, but how could you guys know if it’s Ponce or Gattis or Malik or TVD or some combination?

And this is a serious question for you, @Liberty City El, and @who. You guys feel adamant about this and I’m curious to hear out the rationales. You guys know his day to day? TVD 100% looks worse. We’ve got that evidence. The cause? Here to listen.

Personally, I’ll eat crow if Ponce is the cause of TVD’s downfall. I did not see a downside to him as a QB coach. I was down on the idea of him as an OC. Garcia’s mechanics look about the same. No real disaster there (and that’s not to say he’ll do well in the system).
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I thought Garcia looks mechanically sharp. He made mistakes and missed guys but he looks twitchier in the pocket than TVD and has a better release
 
LuCane said:
I have no idea wtf Ponce’s role is in TVD’s yips are, and maybe they’re significant, but how could you guys know if it’s Ponce or Gattis or Malik or TVD or some combination?

And this is a serious question for you, @Liberty City El, and @who. You guys feel adamant about this and I’m curious to hear out the rationales. You guys know his day to day? TVD 100% looks worse. We’ve got that evidence. The cause? Here to listen.

Personally, I’ll eat crow if Ponce is the cause of TVD’s downfall. I did not see a downside to him as a QB coach. I was down on the idea of him as an OC. Garcia’s mechanics look about the same. No real disaster there (and that’s not to say he’ll do well in the system).
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Don’t pay me any mind, he’s a phenomenal QB’s coach.
 
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LuCane said:
the snarky response to a genuine question is funny. If you don’t know why and can’t find it in one of your google searches (the ones where you claim a photographic memory), you can just say so. All good.
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Wasn’t trying to be snarky, my apologies.
 
LuCane said:
I have no idea wtf Ponce’s role is in TVD’s yips are, and maybe they’re significant, but how could you guys know if it’s Ponce or Gattis or Malik or TVD or some combination?

And this is a serious question for you, @Liberty City El, and @who. You guys feel adamant about this and I’m curious to hear out the rationales. You guys know his day to day? TVD 100% looks worse. We’ve got that evidence. The cause? Here to listen.

Personally, I’ll eat crow if Ponce is the cause of TVD’s downfall. I did not see a downside to him as a QB coach. I was down on the idea of him as an OC. Garcia’s mechanics look about the same. No real disaster there (and that’s not to say he’ll do well in the system).
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It has to be a combination of all 3 I'll pretend the summer with Malik was minimal. The QB that's not an OC is atypical to begin with but Ponce is the Passing Coordinator. TVD struggled with progressing through his reads last year and slow developing routesa. As a freshmen that's to be expected and very common. Ponce should have identified the issues and either:
1. Corrected it with our prized QB.
2. Implemented a passing attack that better aligned with what he was supposed to do well.
The fact that he looks worse this year has got to reflect poorly on the person that is supposed to have the greatest effect.
 
cway313 said:
It has to be a combination of all 3 I'll pretend the summer with Malik was minimal. The QB that's not an OC is atypical to begin with but Ponce is the Passing Coordinator. TVD struggled with progressing through his reads last year and slow developing routesa. As a freshmen that's to be expected and very common. Ponce should have identified the issues and either:
1. Corrected it with our prized QB.
2. Implemented a passing attack that better aligned with what he was supposed to do well.
The fact that he looks worse this year has got to reflect poorly on the person that is supposed to have the greatest effect.
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A few things:

1. It reflects poorly because he’s the QB coach, no doubt.
2. I’m actually unaware if that’s a real title (passing coordinator) or one of those so he can make more $. The formations and pass concepts look awfully similar to what Gattis previously showed. If it’s Ponce, then allow me to raise my hand that I hate them. There’s often zero spacing. But, I really don’t know and am not in the building.
3. I’m not saying Jake looks ‘great’ or he’ll even do well if given a chance. I actually think he’s likely also to struggle in our current form of offense. But, he doesnt look worse technically. Perhaps Ponce tried to change TVD and ignored Jake? Is that the argument?

You all are adamant. Perhaps you know something I don’t about the responsibilities in the building. I didn’t think Ponce would be a disaster as a *QB coach* (not OC). Thought he’d actually be a net positive (I wouldnt say great) to give at least some perspective to Gattis, who I was always concerned about. If it’s a total failure, I’ve got no problem raising my hand. Thanks for the response.
 
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LuCane said:
A few things:

1. It reflects poorly because he’s the QB coach, no doubt.
2. I’m actually unaware if that’s a real title (passing coordinator) or one of those so he can make more $. The formations and pass concepts look awfully similar to what Gattis previously showed. If it’s Ponce, then allow me to raise my hand that I hate them. There’s often zero spacing. But, I really don’t know and am not in the building.
3. I’m not saying Jake looks ‘great’ or he’ll even do well if given a chance. I actually think he’s likely also to struggle in our current form of offense. But, he doesnt look worse technically. Perhaps Ponce tried to change TVD and ignored Jake? Is that the argument?

You all are adamant. Perhaps you know something I don’t about the responsibilities in the building. I didn’t think Ponce would be a disaster as a *QB coach* (not OC). Thought he’d actually be a net positive (I wouldnt say great) to give at least some perspective to Gattis, who I was always concerned about. If it’s a total failure, I’ve got no problem raising my hand. Thanks for the response.
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TVD is still staring down WRs in start 13. If the QB coach can't come in and say naw this ain't it he's probably not fit for the job.
 
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DroCane said:
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I think I figured this whole thing out. Based on my flag football 5x championship experience and playing Madden, Ponce making TVD hold the ball high is no bueno. While it's the correct way, TVD was a pitcher in high school, and this tweak is causing him to be inaccurate. Baseball players tend to hold the ball lower to get that baseball throwing motion off. I am 99% sure I am wrong tho.
 
cway313 said:
TVD is still staring down WRs in start 13. If the QB coach can't come in and say naw this ain't it he's probably not fit for the job.
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Perhaps. For many years, my rule on position coaches (I’ve said this ab DB coaches and OL coaches, mainly), because I know a few of them personally, is I don’t judge them on anything but the technique. The rest gets bumped up to the coordinator because it’s presumably his system and a lot (production) flows from what’s being asked.

On the technical side, TVD’s feet look worse, his throwing motion looks different (mostly because of the hesitation), and he now seems to have the yips on even some easy throws. It’s completely fair to blame Ponce on those things if he’s the one responsible. Up to this point, I was wrong on thinking he’d help bring us something as a QB coach. Maybe that changes. Doesn’t look optimistic right now.
 
LuCane said:
Perhaps. For many years, my rule on position coaches (I’ve said this ab DB coaches and OL coaches, mainly), because I know a few of them personally, is I don’t judge them on anything but the technique. The rest gets bumped up to the coordinator because it’s presumably his system and a lot (production) flows from what’s being asked.

On the technical side, TVD’s feet look worse, his throwing motion looks different (mostly because of the hesitation), and he now seems to have the yips on even some easy throws. It’s completely fair to blame Ponce on those things if he’s the one responsible. Up to this point, I was wrong on thinking he’d help bring us something as a QB coach. Maybe that changes. Doesn’t look optimistic right now.
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Agreed x 100. I'm not a staunch fire Gattis guy but if it happened i wouldnt bat an eye. My bigger concern has been when plays have been available to be made either the WRs drop the ball or TVD delivers an errant pass. No play caller will ever be perfect but simple throw and catch execution is the worst I've ever seen here.
 
LuCane said:
Perhaps. For many years, my rule on position coaches (I’ve said this ab DB coaches and OL coaches, mainly), because I know a few of them personally, is I don’t judge them on anything but the technique. The rest gets bumped up to the coordinator because it’s presumably his system and a lot (production) flows from what’s being asked.

On the technical side, TVD’s feet look worse, his throwing motion looks different (mostly because of the hesitation), and he now seems to have the yips on even some easy throws. It’s completely fair to blame Ponce on those things if he’s the one responsible. Up to this point, I was wrong on thinking he’d help bring us something as a QB coach. Maybe that changes. Doesn’t look optimistic right now.
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I wonder if TVDs mechanics have been impacted at all by working with coaches outside the program and then having to try to roll back into what Ponce/Gattis want him to do. Like you said he doesn’t look comfortable or natural back there like he did last year. As you mentioned, we don’t know what conversations are exactly happening in that room and if it’s Gattis or Ponce putting him in a box. My biggest gripe with Ponce was his history and lack of development I saw from his QBs.

I know certain coaches are very picky about what trainers they want their players working with outside of the program.
 
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