Canes bs Gata - Winner Take All - Nooner, $ECN

[Rellyrell]

don't know about you, relly. but this "same old, same old" is just EXHAUSTING!

at least with football, we realized the same sh*t wasn't working, and we needed transformational changes. we have a ways to go, but no one can say we aren't scratching, spitting, and crawling to give ourselves a fighting chance to get there.

with hoops? Coach L has a system, a philosophy driven by his own experience. he knows it inside and out, and he has everyone on the same page understanding how to best make it work for Miami. he sticks to a good plan, tweaks it where and when he needs to, and we actually have a real program worth talking about.

baseball?

we've been mostly a disaster since Morris retired (without officially telling anyone), 3 years before he actually left the program.

with the exception of some "boom amidst the bust", have we really been anything but chaotic and consistently underwhelming? We haven't sniffed the CWS or a Super Regional, or even a conference championship since 2016. there's nothing about this team that leads anyone to believe we will ever be other than a "middle of the pack" player, and no one in the AD's office seems to care that Gino can't coach his way out of a one car driveway. He's in year 5, and .... exactly where is he heading?

i have zero faith in Gino or this program, and where football's long reign of mediocrity made me angry, this just makes me sad.

Amen & this is y I was disappointed in Rad for extending Gino like he did. That was, imo, a str8 nepotism/cronyism play. U can’t see what this program has been for the past 6 yrs, including that absolute flame out to end the season & say, “we’re in good hands.” Sure we’re known for FB, but Miami is also known as a powerhouse baseball program & this is sad to see. Gino angers me so much as a bench coach. We’re seeing the same chit EVERY season, so why would I expect it to change this yr?

 

[BP Joe]

Amen & this is y I was disappointed in Rad for extending Gino like he did. That was, imo, a str8 nepotism/cronyism play. U can’t see what this program has been for the past 6 yrs, including that absolute flame out to end the season & say, “we’re in good hands.” Sure we’re known for FB, but Miami is also known as a powerhouse baseball program & this is sad to see. Gino angers me so much as a bench coach. We’re seeing the same chit EVERY season, so why would I expect it to change this yr?

I am more interested in seeing what Radakovich does going forward as an AD, because he hasn't really done much yet. Coach L recruited himself years ago, his extension was a no brainer, and Mario was hired ahead of him. Gino's extension was likely done as a result of the national seed and out of respect for the DiMare family, which they deserve.

If Gino has another ending to this season like previous ones, I'm not even sure he'd want to stay, i.e. my understanding is he donates his salary, rendering the extension somewhat meaningless from a financial standpoint, right?

I know it's early, but if this season crashes and burns, I can't imagine he'd be enjoying it much as a volunteer head coach.

And again, I hope I start seeing the "accountabilty" we were promised w Radakovich, in football and baseball results as well.

 

[Rellyrell]

Eh, you have to extend coaches for recruiting optics. If you have your coach dangling in the wind, you're only shooting yourself in the foot. They can have 100 year contracts publicly, but the only thing that matters is the buyout language, which no one is privy to.

I wouldn't even be that surprised if UM and Gino have a mutual zero buyout. Where either side can walk. Gino isn't coaching for the money, and why would he play contractual hardball with the U, the only job in the world he really wants, with his lefthand while with his right hand his family is giving the university millions. ****, the man could be working for $100k for all we know, whatever is best for taxes.

I highly doubt Gino will ever be "fired" publicly, nor should he. If they decide he needs to go, he will go peacefully IMO as whatever is best for the U, and it will be negotiated and framed as a non-confrontational moment where's he's stepping down to take more responsibility with the family fortunes/biz or something to save face.

Agree w/ the rest of ur sentiments except that opening statement. If a coach is not producing, I would argue that’s more harmful to recruiting than the optics of him staying in his post.

 

[hoops156]

don't know about you, relly. but this "same old, same old" is just EXHAUSTING!

at least with football, we realized the same sh*t wasn't working, and we needed transformational changes. we have a ways to go, but no one can say we aren't scratching, spitting, and crawling to give ourselves a fighting chance to get there.

with hoops? Coach L has a system, a philosophy driven by his own experience. he knows it inside and out, and he has everyone on the same page understanding how to best make it work for Miami. he sticks to a good plan, tweaks it where and when he needs to, and we actually have a real program worth talking about.

baseball?

we've been mostly a disaster since Morris retired (without officially telling anyone), 3 years before he actually left the program.

with the exception of some "boom amidst the bust", have we really been anything but chaotic and consistently underwhelming? We haven't sniffed the CWS or a Super Regional, or even a conference championship since 2016. there's nothing about this team that leads anyone to believe we will ever be other than a "middle of the pack" player, and no one in the AD's office seems to care that Gino can't coach his way out of a one car driveway. He's in year 5, and .... exactly where is he heading?

i have zero faith in Gino or this program, and where football's long reign of mediocrity made me angry, this just makes me sad.

the worst part is the new Ad extended Gino after personally witnessing the collapse.

 

[hoops156]

Eh, you have to extend coaches for recruiting optics. If you have your coach dangling in the wind, you're only shooting yourself in the foot. They can have 100 year contracts publicly, but the only thing that matters is the buyout language, which no one is privy to.

I wouldn't even be that surprised if UM and Gino have a mutual zero buyout. Where either side can walk. Gino isn't coaching for the money, and why would he play contractual hardball with the U, the only job in the world he really wants, with his lefthand while with his right hand his family is giving the university millions. ****, the man could be working for $100k for all we know, whatever is best for taxes.

I highly doubt Gino will ever be "fired" publicly, nor should he. If they decide he needs to go, he will go peacefully IMO as whatever is best for the U, and it will be negotiated and framed as a non-confrontational moment where's he's stepping down to take more responsibility with the family fortunes/biz or something to save face.

they could've done a 1-2 year extension. they extended till 2026. it just puts the program in a hole when they wake up and realize Gino is trash as a coach

 

[hoops156]

Amen & this is y I was disappointed in Rad for extending Gino like he did. That was, imo, a str8 nepotism/cronyism play. U can’t see what this program has been for the past 6 yrs, including that absolute flame out to end the season & say, “we’re in good hands.” Sure we’re known for FB, but Miami is also known as a powerhouse baseball program & this is sad to see. Gino angers me so much as a bench coach. We’re seeing the same chit EVERY season, so why would I expect it to change this yr?

we flamed out multiple times already under Gino which is more disappointing. that was a Blake move imo. I guess rad just doesn't really care about baseball. wasn't he the same way at alcemson?

 

[hoops156]

I am more interested in seeing what Radakovich does going forward as an AD, because he hasn't really done much yet. Coach L recruited himself years ago, his extension was a no brainer, and Mario was hired ahead of him. Gino's extension was likely done as a result of the national seed and out of respect for the DiMare family, which they deserve.

If Gino has another ending to this season like previous ones, I'm not even sure he'd want to stay, i.e. my understanding is he donates his salary, rendering the extension somewhat meaningless from a financial standpoint, right?

I know it's early, but if this season crashes and burns, I can't imagine he'd be enjoying it much as a volunteer head coach.

And again, I hope I start seeing the "accountabilty" we were promised w Radakovich, in football and baseball results as well.

thats my problem. I agree they deserve respect and kudos for the amount of giving they do to the school, but Gino is hired employee who is not great at his job. you dont mix the two if youre a true AD. you dont need to fire him off the rip but you could let his **** play out or wait on the extension. we just repeated the Manny Diaz mistake with baseball. even if he is coaching for free, we are doing damage to a once great program same as we did damage to the football program w Shannon, Golden, Diaz

 

[hoops156]

I am more interested in seeing what Radakovich does going forward as an AD, because he hasn't really done much yet. Coach L recruited himself years ago, his extension was a no brainer, and Mario was hired ahead of him. Gino's extension was likely done as a result of the national seed and out of respect for the DiMare family, which they deserve.

If Gino has another ending to this season like previous ones, I'm not even sure he'd want to stay, i.e. my understanding is he donates his salary, rendering the extension somewhat meaningless from a financial standpoint, right?

I know it's early, but if this season crashes and burns, I can't imagine he'd be enjoying it much as a volunteer head coach.

And again, I hope I start seeing the "accountabilty" we were promised w Radakovich, in football and baseball results as well.

with football, I highly doubt Mario answers to anyone other than the real higher ups. he was hired before the AD and if the AD is coming in and straightening things out football wise, we got more issues. this is Marios show and no matter what, Mario should have complete control there.

 

[Rellyrell]

thats my problem. I agree they deserve respect and kudos for the amount of giving they do to the school, but Gino is hired employee who is not great at his job. you dont mix the two if youre a true AD. you dont need to fire him off the rip but you could let his **** play out or wait on the extension. we just repeated the Manny Diaz mistake with baseball. even if he is coaching for free, we are doing damage to a once great program same as we did damage to the football program w Shannon, Golden, Diaz

Yeah; when u’re running a business based upon favors vs. actual production & product viability, then that’s the first step in creating a disaster.

 

[hoops156]

Yeah; when u’re running a business based upon favors vs. actual production & product viability, then that’s the first step in creating a disaster.

baseball is a disaster. were gonna waste yoyos final year

 

[Cryptical Envelopment]

Agree w/ the rest of ur sentiments except that opening statement. If a coach is not producing, I would argue that’s more harmful to recruiting than the optics of him staying in his post.

Yeah I mean if its time, its time. But I mean the point where you're still not sure and are still giving him the chance to right the ship. Like what FSU did with Cornrow Mike before last season, just after he lost Hunter.

 

[Rellyrell]

Yeah I mean if its time, its time. But I mean the point where you're still not sure and are still giving him the chance to right the ship. Like what FSU did with Cornrow Mike before last season, just after he lost Hunter.

Bro; that’s an apples & grapes comparison.

Cornrow Mike has only been at FSU for 3 yrs. He inherited a chit show left by two predecessors, & he showed improvement from yr 1, to 2, & now yr 3.

Gino was apart of the chit show, & he’s been continuously on staff since 2012, as HC since 2019. He’s 1-5 in the ACC Tourney & 4-6 in Regionals. We’ve had a long enough sample size of what he is as a coach.

 

[hoops156]

Bro; that’s an apples & grapes comparison.

Cornrow Mike has only been at FSU for 3 yrs. He inherited a chit show left by two predecessors, & he showed improvement from yr 1, to 2, & now yr 3.

Gino was apart of the chit show, & he’s been continuously on staff since 2012, as HC since 2019. He’s 1-5 in the ACC Tourney & 4-6 in Regionals. We’ve had a long enough sample size of what he is as a coach.

this

 

[Rellyrell]

Bud I didn't compare them. That's a leap. I just used an example of a school showing fake *** public faith while not necessarily making any real long term commitment. Insert whatever example you want. I think Jason Candle's "extension" lowered his buyout as an example of a worthless extension.

The point was the "extension" for Gino didn't hamstring the school or make it harder to fire him IMO which is what we're talking about, right? The only thing that matters is buyout language. You can have a 20 year contract at $10M per for $200M total but if the school can buy you out for $500k you have a guaranteed $500k contract, with employer options. Gino's extension was likely for show re: recruiting purposes. It's not the reason he hasn't been fired.

Maybe that’s what u meant, but u definitely compared.

U’re post stated:

But I mean the point where you're still not sure and are still giving him the chance to right the ship. Like what FSU did with Cornrow Mike before last season, just after he lost Hunter.

When u use “such as” or “like” that’s the definition of comparing. And quite frankly, that wasn’t a good example. Again, Gino has been on staff since 2012. Extending a lame duck coach for “recruiting purposes” is actually more harmful. Do u not recall what happened when we kept Golden around past his expiration date? Did that help recruiting? ****, did that help our brand?

Whichever way u wanna slice or justify it, it made no sense to extend him after ANOTHER waisted season, besides what was said when Gino first got hired, nepotism & cronyism.

 

[Number1CanesFan]

Hate to disagree with you but it has everything to do with talent. If not, everyone would be a great pitcher. Some pitchers don't have control or the ability to "locate". If everyone just focused on throwing 95 and locating each pitch then everyone could do it.

We don't have the pitchers and not sure our coaches have the ability to "develop" them. Not too many of our pitchers are in the majors.

I think we are talking about 2 different things.

A guy that can throw 120 mph fastball has talent. If he can't throw a strike, his talent hasn't been developed.

So, we have talent. For what ever reason, the talent hasn't been developed.

 

[Pitcher in the Rye]

I think we are talking about 2 different things.

A guy that can throw 120 mph fastball has talent. If he can't throw a strike, his talent hasn't been developed.

So, we have talent. For what ever reason, the talent hasn't been developed.

Accuracy is most definitely a talent. It's the result of superior eye/hand coordination coupled with proper mechanics. It's the single most important factor in a pitcher. The relationship of accuracy to velocity is like a change-up: it only works when paired with a good fastball. There's a bunch of other factors that comprise a pitcher's "talent", but saying a pitcher is talented only because he throws hard is in an incomplete picture. Rosario is an example of a pitcher who is lacking a lot of these traits.

 

[CaneDawgCrew]

I think we are talking about 2 different things.

A guy that can throw 120 mph fastball has talent. If he can't throw a strike, his talent hasn't been developed.

So, we have talent. For what ever reason, the talent hasn't been developed.

Maybe...But you talk in terms of "locating" pitches and pitchers learning. It is more likely that our pitchers just aren't as talented as those past years or on the rosters of others.

I was just saying if it was just a matter off learning, locating pitches...Everyone would be a stud once developed. I am saying that you have to have talent to include eye and hand coordination, etc.

Maybe our views the same you just have a more upbeat way of presenting it lol.

 

[Number1CanesFan]

Accuracy is most definitely a talent. It's the result of superior eye/hand coordination coupled with proper mechanics. It's the single most important factor in a pitcher. The relationship of accuracy to velocity is like a change-up: it only works when paired with a good fastball. There's a bunch of other factors that comprise a pitcher's "talent", but saying a pitcher is talented only because he throws hard is in an incomplete picture. Rosario is an example of a pitcher who is lacking a lot of these traits.

Accuracy can be taught with proper mechanics. I don't think it takes talent to throw strikes. Guys in DII and DIII can throw strikes. They don't have the velocity or nasty slider or curveball to go with it.

I think we're arguing apples and oranges.

 

[TaylorWalls]

Accuracy can be taught with proper mechanics. I don't think it takes talent to throw strikes. Guys in DII and DIII can throw strikes. They don't have the velocity or nasty slider or curveball to go with it.

I think we're arguing apples and oranges.

This is absolutely not true, of course. The minor leagues are FULL of guys who throw 98 with no idea where it's going. And they have the best resources on the planet when it comes to development.

 

[TaylorWalls]

Accuracy is most definitely a talent.

Truth. Velocity without command makes you a travel ball coach who played pro ball for a few years.