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Dwinstitles said:
Not their work on the field it’s the intangibles. That’s what people see, others see stats that don’t tell the story sometimes. It’s like today I was listening to the Michael Kay Show over here in nyc, and a caller got mad cause he said Purdy was elite. And Kay was right he isn’t Mahomes he doesn’t have an arm but he’s winning but he’s not those guys. Regardless if he wins a title or not he’s just doesn’t have the gifts those other guys have.

I hate to bring it up I really do but it’s like the Cook and Yearby recruitment. Yearby was a regular rb and Cook was a first rounder anyone could see it. He could have played two games at Miami central his senior year and Yearby could have rushed for 1800 yards. I would still say Cook is the guy you have to land not Yearby. Pause pause pause

I only read your first paragraph I have to read the rest. But I had to reply it’s about intangibles and how they translate to d1, intangibles/frame/size/explosiveness for that particular position/can he gain weight and not lose those gifts/etc. that’s what these nerds study and a lot of times they get it right. It ain’t a perfect science but it’s pretty good for what it is.


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Cooper great find it shows the Hc knows how Miami/bama/Oregon are suppose to look like. Cole as well the film speaks for itself. Let them get it wrong but if Mario continues to hit they will eventually move most his classes up cause he proved he can evaluate. They did it with Saban because he was the best at it, that’s why his guys moved up. Everyone said it was biased it wasn’t Saban was right about a lot of those lower rated dudes. He saw it
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See, thats where i have an issue with the process and why its flawed. Wisconsin has shown for decades that they are able to identify and develop offensive lineman. Yet, their lineman recruits are rarely 4 and 5 stars across the board. By the logic you've given me, they should average 4 star lineman and any fat boy they send out a scholly too should get an Instant boost in their ratings.

I believe NO player is a given to be anything until they play on Saturdays, no matter their stars and rankings. The only players with high probability are the consensus 5 stars and even then itd still based on THAT players mentality and work ethic despite how talented they Seem to be.
 
Canezum5 said:
See, thats where i have an issue with the process and why its flawed. Wisconsin has shown for decades that they are able to identify and develop offensive lineman. Yet, their lineman recruits are rarely 4 and 5 stars across the board. By the logic you've given me, they should average 4 star lineman and any fat boy they send out a scholly too should get an Instant boost in their ratings.

I believe NO player is a given to be anything until they play on Saturdays, no matter their stars and rankings. The only players with high probability are the consensus 5 stars and even then itd still based on THAT players mentality and work ethic despite how talented they Seem to be.
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I agree when you hit college your a zero star to me. Same with the draft if you the top pick show me on Sundays.
 
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Home Slice said:
www.si.com

Miami Quarterback Commitment Explains Why He Chose 'The U'

Hurricanes have one of the nation's top 2025 quarterback recruits
www.si.com www.si.com

SIAP
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toy story cup GIF
 
Coach Macho said:
🤣 I kinda chuckled at this post... because some of the kids in these 7-on-7 highlights were on our schedule this past season... and we completely shut them out.

Football is completely different when you have pads on and the QB doesn't have 4 seconds to throw. You're now catching bubble screens and hoping that a Safety or Linebacker doesn't take your head off while filling the alley. Or running a post route hoping that the Safety isn't in the middle of the field waiting on you.

As a defensive coach I absolutely hate this 7-on-7 crap. It's 100% catered to the offense and takes away any advantages that a defense has.
I do see SOME value in it however. It really improves my Secondary's eyes/technique and helps my LB's learn how to cover.

There's actually high school teams that will dominate 7-on-7 tournaments but then go 5-5 during the real season.
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It's kind of like PO/PD units ("pass offense/pass defense") during practice.

If you treated it as something other than a well orchestrated drill session, or scout team exercise, you were going to be seriously misled. BIG difference between PO/PD, and say an actual scrimmage or full 11 on 11 situation.

From my perspective as a QB, of course PO/PD was helpful. But without a full D-Line to obscure passing lanes or disrupt timing, or throw you off platform as often happens, well ..... 🤷‍♀️

I concur that it's a good exercise for learning eye discipline or pattern recognition for guys in the back 7. That makes sense. I would say the same thing to QB's I've tutored: use it as another chance to get reps seeing how patterns play out in space.

But I'm in your camp and with @Brooklyndee on this one. Even if it tells you who may be a good athlete or pass the look test, it's not going to really tell you who can play football.
 
gogeta4 said:
This touch football has totally change the landscape of things.

Its all the rave and to some the sole rave.

This aint even the mid 2000s when it comes to recruiting... You almost HAVE TOPLAY the game with the 7 on 7 teams as it is now AAU basketball.
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I’m not saying it will all work itself out and this staff is infallible, but the fact that we have more resources now to see these kids multiple times, in hopefully different settings, makes me more optimistic in some of the MarioZo evals
 
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Canezum5 said:
See, thats where i have an issue with the process and why its flawed. Wisconsin has shown for decades that they are able to identify and develop offensive lineman. Yet, their lineman recruits are rarely 4 and 5 stars across the board. By the logic you've given me, they should average 4 star lineman and any fat boy they send out a scholly too should get an Instant boost in their ratings.

I believe NO player is a given to be anything until they play on Saturdays, no matter their stars and rankings. The only players with high probability are the consensus 5 stars and even then itd still based on THAT players mentality and work ethic despite how talented they Seem to be.
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I have no horse in this race but that’s not necessarily correct on Wisconsin. Since 2018 they’ve signed 19 OL of which two were 5*, nine were 4* and only eight were 3*. Of the 9 four stars, 7 of them were top 247 so high 4 star. Of the 8 three stars only 2 were outside the top 800 and you have to go all the way back to 2014 to find a OL ranked outside the top 1000 like Cooper.

No question Cooper was a miss by the services especially since I believe he played against good competition in HS. The only thing I can think of why they rated him so low was because of his weight as he was close to 400 pounds if not more. Believe there was also question on whether he would be an OL or DT (Mario wanted him as a DT). It’s a testament to how hard he’s worked to get where he’s at and it was a **** of a find by Mario. He’s one of my favorite players.
 
TRick72 said:
I have no horse in this race but that’s not necessarily correct on Wisconsin. Since 2018 they’ve signed 19 OL of which two were 5*, nine were 4* and only eight were 3*. Of the 9 four stars, 7 of them were top 247 so high 4 star. Of the 8 three stars only 2 were outside the top 800 and you have to go all the way back to 2014 to find a OL ranked outside the top 1000 like Cooper.

No question Cooper was a miss by the services especially since I believe he played against good competition in HS. The only thing I can think of why they rated him so low was because of his weight as he was close to 400 pounds if not more. Believe there was also question on whether he would be an OL or DT (Mario wanted him as a DT). It’s a testament to how hard he’s worked to get where he’s at and it was a **** of a find by Mario. He’s one of my favorite players.
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I wonder what their star ratings were before WI scouted and offered them? Especially now, the evals by the coaches matter, since you need to be monitoring and courting have only wrapped up their Junior season at best, may be only Freshmen and Sophomores. Lightfoot and Pickett are perfect examples of that. One was a mid 4 and if I'm not mistaken Pickett was a 3. Yet our coaches were on them nearly as much as they were on Stewart and as much as Simmons. Mack is still only a 3 star on 247 and outside the Top 300 on the composite. Do we really believe that?

So both can be true. The stars matter, but they matter because the consensus best evaluators have validated a kid's ranking with committable offers.

At the end of the day, I'm going to trust this current set of coaches above any "analyst" from Rivals, 247 or On3. And even then, I'm going to judge the recruits with my own eyes, lol.
 
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RedSquare said:
It's kind of like PO/PD units ("pass offense/pass defense") during practice.

If you treated it as something other than a well orchestrated drill session, or scout team exercise, you were going to be seriously misled. BIG difference between PO/PD, and say an actual scrimmage or full 11 on 11 situation.

From my perspective as a QB, of course PO/PD was helpful. But without a full D-Line to obscure passing lanes or disrupt timing, or throw you off platform as often happens, well ..... 🤷‍♀️

I concur that it's a good exercise for learning eye discipline or pattern recognition for guys in the back 7. That makes sense. I would say the same thing to QB's I've tutored: use it as another chance to get reps seeing how patterns play out in space.

But I'm in your camp and with @Brooklyndee on this one. Even if it tells you who may be a good athlete or pass the look test, it's not going to really tell you who can play football.
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For me I can't even really see it so much with qbs. I can see the very minor lessons in what you explained but I feel like from everything I've ever known when it relates to qbs the most important factor in a qbs success or failure comes from his mental. How can you really test a qb in any aspect if he knows worst case 4 seconds runs out and it's a wasted down. Something else in itself when you know you can get your whole head tore off in the blink of an eye. How often do you really see qbs in seven on seven who really struggle that are even remotely decent? They just sit back there and pick **** apart. Real easy to make an amazing throw when you have no fear in it. Your only fears in 7 on 7 doesn't even really come down to ball placement. Fine your team gets hot over a turnover. Hella different than you **** near getting your reciever paralyzed because you short armed something and left a ball high over the middle of the field.
 
TRick72 said:
I have no horse in this race but that’s not necessarily correct on Wisconsin. Since 2018 they’ve signed 19 OL of which two were 5*, nine were 4* and only eight were 3*. Of the 9 four stars, 7 of them were top 247 so high 4 star. Of the 8 three stars only 2 were outside the top 800 and you have to go all the way back to 2014 to find a OL ranked outside the top 1000 like Cooper.

No question Cooper was a miss by the services especially since I believe he played against good competition in HS. The only thing I can think of why they rated him so low was because of his weight as he was close to 400 pounds if not more. Believe there was also question on whether he would be an OL or DT (Mario wanted him as a DT). It’s a testament to how hard he’s worked to get where he’s at and it was a **** of a find by Mario. He’s one of my favorite players.
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Point taken. Yet, why does it take till 2018 to give Wisconsin their flowers when they been developing Olineman since the days of Ron Dayne.

I hate these **** recruiting sites.
 
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Canezum5 said:
Point taken. Yet, why does it take till 2018 to give Wisconsin their flowers when they been developing Olineman since the days of Ron Dayne.

I hate these **** recruiting sites.
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In fairness I only went back to 2018 to go in details into the numbers since there’s still dudes on college rosters from that class due to Covid, except Cam he’s 2015. I just skimmed through 2011-2017 to see when was the last time they had someone ranked outside the top 1000 (composite started in 2011 with the new sites so don’t have info before then).

From 2011-2014 it was glaring and even worse than what you said. From what I peeped they didn’t have a guy inside the top 1000 and had a couple outside the top 2000. So to your point, it took them atleast 15 years before they started getting the benefit of the doubt with OL.
 
Brooklyndee said:
For me I can't even really see it so much with qbs. I can see the very minor lessons in what you explained but I feel like from everything I've ever known when it relates to qbs the most important factor in a qbs success or failure comes from his mental. How can you really test a qb in any aspect if he knows worst case 4 seconds runs out and it's a wasted down. Something else in itself when you know you can get your whole head tore off in the blink of an eye. How often do you really see qbs in seven on seven who really struggle that are even remotely decent? They just sit back there and pick **** apart. Real easy to make an amazing throw when you have no fear in it. Your only fears in 7 on 7 doesn't even really come down to ball placement. Fine your team gets hot over a turnover. Hella different than you **** near getting your reciever paralyzed because you short armed something and left a ball high over the middle of the field.
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All true and all valid.

I have said this so many times on the board, I can't even see straight: the QB position is so critically dependent upon what's between the ears and under the ribcage. And while I can help you in most all areas of QB play, I can't make you smarter and I can't make you want to be tougher. NO ONE can. Sorry. It's why the 7 on 7 experience is extremely limited in how it helps a QB .... either to get better or be evaluated. It doesn't say anything about mental flow or toughness under fire.

You and I are aligned here.
 
RedSquare said:
All true and all valid.

I have said this so many times on the board, I can't even see straight: the QB position is so critically dependent upon what's between the ears and under the ribcage. And while I can help you in most all areas of QB play, I can't make you smarter and I can't make you want to be tougher. NO ONE can. Sorry. It's why the 7 on 7 experience is extremely limited in how it helps a QB .... either to get better or be evaluated. It doesn't say anything about mental flow or toughness under fire.

You and I are aligned here.
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I don't know what area you're in. But do you know nick Rita? Day 1 to d1?
 
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