2014 Defensive Line Depth

[moshated305]

Scary, will be another year full of excuses

 

[moshated305]

It still kinda surprises me how little people know about what we're doing on defense.

1. Our DE's in the 3-4 don't provide pass rush because they're in a read-and-react position. So placing one of the nations best edge rushers at that spot would (more often than not) be ineffective.

2. Chad Thomas is a lean, rangy, athletic 6'5" 240lbs. He would need to gain a minimum of 45 pounds to play 3-4 DE. He would no longer be an edge rusher, which is his #1 talent, and he would be asked to 2-gap. He would sit on the bench for at least 2 years to allow him to develop.



Chad Thomas is a prototype 4-3 DE or 3-4 OLB. If you could build a 3-4 OLB in a lab he would look like Thomas. A lean, long 6'5" 265lbs with range and bend. He's not a 3-4 DE, whether you're talking about size or skill-set.

Who do you see in this class playing SDE?

Maybe Moten. Truthfully, we don't have anyone. Which is part of the reason why I don't understand why we are running a defense that we can't recruit. Majority of the kids we bring in belong in a 4-3.

 

[rok]

It still kinda surprises me how little people know about what we're doing on defense.

1. Our DE's in the 3-4 don't provide pass rush because they're in a read-and-react position. So placing one of the nations best edge rushers at that spot would (more often than not) be ineffective.

2. Chad Thomas is a lean, rangy, athletic 6'5" 240lbs. He would need to gain a minimum of 45 pounds to play 3-4 DE. He would no longer be an edge rusher, which is his #1 talent, and he would be asked to 2-gap. He would sit on the bench for at least 2 years to allow him to develop.



Chad Thomas is a prototype 4-3 DE or 3-4 OLB. If you could build a 3-4 OLB in a lab he would look like Thomas. A lean, long 6'5" 265lbs with range and bend. He's not a 3-4 DE, whether you're talking about size or skill-set.

Who do you see in this class playing SDE?

Maybe Moten. Truthfully, we don't have anyone. Which is part of the reason why I don't understand why we are running a defense that we can't recruit. Majority of the kids we bring in belong in a 4-3.

FSU ran a 4-3 for 40 years until 2013 and they're about to win the title in their first year in a 3-4. None of their players were recruited to play a 3-4 but they made it work because they have better talent than everyone else.

 

[RiDLer80]

FSU ran a 3-4 for about two weeks before Pruitt realized it wasn't going to work.

 

[moshated305]

It still kinda surprises me how little people know about what we're doing on defense.

1. Our DE's in the 3-4 don't provide pass rush because they're in a read-and-react position. So placing one of the nations best edge rushers at that spot would (more often than not) be ineffective.

2. Chad Thomas is a lean, rangy, athletic 6'5" 240lbs. He would need to gain a minimum of 45 pounds to play 3-4 DE. He would no longer be an edge rusher, which is his #1 talent, and he would be asked to 2-gap. He would sit on the bench for at least 2 years to allow him to develop.



Chad Thomas is a prototype 4-3 DE or 3-4 OLB. If you could build a 3-4 OLB in a lab he would look like Thomas. A lean, long 6'5" 265lbs with range and bend. He's not a 3-4 DE, whether you're talking about size or skill-set.

Who do you see in this class playing SDE?

Maybe Moten. Truthfully, we don't have anyone. Which is part of the reason why I don't understand why we are running a defense that we can't recruit. Majority of the kids we bring in belong in a 4-3.

FSU ran a 4-3 for 40 years until 2013 and they're about to win the title in their first year in a 3-4. None of their players were recruited to play a 3-4 but they made it work because they have better talent than everyone else.

FSU doesn't run a a 3-4. They tried and BC ran it down their throats and they switched back to what Stoops ran 4-3 with a lot of 4-2-5 mixed in. Crazy a first year DC can make a switch after one bad game but we are here in year 3 still wondering wtf is going on.

 

[jerzeycane]

Chick is a SDE in a 4-3.

Pierre is a 4-3 DT.

Heurtelou is a 4-3 DT.

AQM, McCord and Thomas are all WDEs in a 4-3.

Figs is a SAM in a 4-3.

Grace is a WLB in a 4-3.

I'm seeing a whole lot of players that are gonna be playing out of position for us.

How could you say this if you don't know what positions they play in our own defense?

How could you say this if you don't know the functions of the positions in our defense?

Don't know how many times it needs to be said, but this isn't a straight up 3-4 like Bill Parcells or Belicheck employ.

 

[RiDLer80]

First, I don't need to know what they play in our defense when I know what their best positions would be IMO.

Second, I've watched our defense play this style for two seasons now. I know what our players are asked to do and I've seen it fail.

 

[bozcane]

It still kinda surprises me how little people know about what we're doing on defense.

1. Our DE's in the 3-4 don't provide pass rush because they're in a read-and-react position. So placing one of the nations best edge rushers at that spot would (more often than not) be ineffective.

2. Chad Thomas is a lean, rangy, athletic 6'5" 240lbs. He would need to gain a minimum of 45 pounds to play 3-4 DE. He would no longer be an edge rusher, which is his #1 talent, and he would be asked to 2-gap. He would sit on the bench for at least 2 years to allow him to develop.



Chad Thomas is a prototype 4-3 DE or 3-4 OLB. If you could build a 3-4 OLB in a lab he would look like Thomas. A lean, long 6'5" 265lbs with range and bend. He's not a 3-4 DE, whether you're talking about size or skill-set.

Who do you see in this class playing SDE?

Maybe Moten. Truthfully, we don't have anyone. Which is part of the reason why I don't understand why we are running a defense that we can't recruit. Majority of the kids we bring in belong in a 4-3.

FSU ran a 4-3 for 40 years until 2013 and they're about to win the title in their first year in a 3-4. None of their players were recruited to play a 3-4 but they made it work because they have better talent than everyone else.

FSU doesn't run a a 3-4. They tried and BC ran it down their throats and they switched back to what Stoops ran 4-3 with a lot of 4-2-5 mixed in. Crazy a first year DC can make a switch after one bad game but we are here in year 3 still wondering wtf is going on.

 

[Coach Macho]

Chick is a SDE in a 4-3.

Pierre is a 4-3 DT.

Heurtelou is a 4-3 DT.

AQM, McCord and Thomas are all WDEs in a 4-3.

Figs is a SAM in a 4-3.

Grace is a WLB in a 4-3.

I'm seeing a whole lot of players that are gonna be playing out of position for us.

How could you say this if you don't know what positions they play in our own defense?

How could you say this if you don't know the functions of the positions in our defense?

Don't know how many times it needs to be said, but this isn't a straight up 3-4 like Bill Parcells or Belicheck employ.

Yeah?

So we're not lined-up head-up on the Offensive Tackles and Center? We're not 2-gapping up front on **** near every play?

 

[Coach Macho]

It still kinda surprises me how little people know about what we're doing on defense.

1. Our DE's in the 3-4 don't provide pass rush because they're in a read-and-react position. So placing one of the nations best edge rushers at that spot would (more often than not) be ineffective.

2. Chad Thomas is a lean, rangy, athletic 6'5" 240lbs. He would need to gain a minimum of 45 pounds to play 3-4 DE. He would no longer be an edge rusher, which is his #1 talent, and he would be asked to 2-gap. He would sit on the bench for at least 2 years to allow him to develop.



Chad Thomas is a prototype 4-3 DE or 3-4 OLB. If you could build a 3-4 OLB in a lab he would look like Thomas. A lean, long 6'5" 265lbs with range and bend. He's not a 3-4 DE, whether you're talking about size or skill-set.

I have gone back and forth on this one since he committed. I would love to see him used like Aldon Smith. I'm just not confident that this defensive staff will properly use him.

How anybody can think he's a 3-4 DE is beyond me.

Maybe they think cause he's a DE in high school then he's a DE in our scheme. *shrug*

 

[arcane]

With the addition of 2 JUCO DT's and several very talented high school d lineman, we just might be ok in 2014. Ufomba Kamalu could turn out to be a stud and I think Earl Moore will surprise everyone. I would love to see these guys in a more attacking scheme to really take advantage of their athletic ability. I think this unit is still a year or 2 away from being a championship caliber unit, but I do believe the talent is finally there.

2014 d line with an additional 10 pounds added to their current weights *In order by class*
SDE

1. SR Anthony Chickillo 6-4 285
2. RJR Ufomba Kamalu 6-6 295
3. FR Chad Thomas 6-5 240

NT

1. JR Earl Moore 6-1 310
2. JR Michael Wyche 6-4 325
3. FR Travonte Valentine 6-4 325
4. FR Courtel Jenkins 6-2 304

WDE/DT

1. SR Olsen Pierre 6-4 315
2. RJR Corey King 6-1 302 (I really don't think he will make it past the spring)
3. JR Jelani Hamilton 6-5 295 (hopefully he is finally 100% healthy)
4. JR Calvin Heurtelou 6-3 314
5. FR Anthony Moten 6-4 302

Corey King will eventually graduate with a degree from UM.

 

[jerzeycane]

Chick is a SDE in a 4-3.

Pierre is a 4-3 DT.

Heurtelou is a 4-3 DT.

AQM, McCord and Thomas are all WDEs in a 4-3.

Figs is a SAM in a 4-3.

Grace is a WLB in a 4-3.

I'm seeing a whole lot of players that are gonna be playing out of position for us.

How could you say this if you don't know what positions they play in our own defense?

How could you say this if you don't know the functions of the positions in our defense?

Don't know how many times it needs to be said, but this isn't a straight up 3-4 like Bill Parcells or Belicheck employ.

Yeah?

So we're not lined-up head-up on the Offensive Tackles and Center? We're not 2-gapping up front on **** near every play?

Uh, No...VERY often we play a 3 technique, nose, stack end. That's not a traditional 3-4 brah

We play what the Niners and Seahawks play.

 

[jerzeycane]

It still kinda surprises me how little people know about what we're doing on defense.

1. Our DE's in the 3-4 don't provide pass rush because they're in a read-and-react position. So placing one of the nations best edge rushers at that spot would (more often than not) be ineffective.

2. Chad Thomas is a lean, rangy, athletic 6'5" 240lbs. He would need to gain a minimum of 45 pounds to play 3-4 DE. He would no longer be an edge rusher, which is his #1 talent, and he would be asked to 2-gap. He would sit on the bench for at least 2 years to allow him to develop.



Chad Thomas is a prototype 4-3 DE or 3-4 OLB. If you could build a 3-4 OLB in a lab he would look like Thomas. A lean, long 6'5" 265lbs with range and bend. He's not a 3-4 DE, whether you're talking about size or skill-set.

I have gone back and forth on this one since he committed. I would love to see him used like Aldon Smith. I'm just not confident that this defensive staff will properly use him.

How anybody can think he's a 3-4 DE is beyond me.

Maybe they think cause he's a DE in high school then he's a DE in our scheme. *shrug*

Many of the the 4-3 looks and 3-4 looks are the same, the only difference being...how many hands are in the ground.

In this diagram we see the 4-3 Under, which is the same exact thing as the 3-4 Under front. Only difference is the personnel.

Your own post brah

 

[Coach Macho]

Chick is a SDE in a 4-3.

Pierre is a 4-3 DT.

Heurtelou is a 4-3 DT.

AQM, McCord and Thomas are all WDEs in a 4-3.

Figs is a SAM in a 4-3.

Grace is a WLB in a 4-3.

I'm seeing a whole lot of players that are gonna be playing out of position for us.

How could you say this if you don't know what positions they play in our own defense?

How could you say this if you don't know the functions of the positions in our defense?

Don't know how many times it needs to be said, but this isn't a straight up 3-4 like Bill Parcells or Belicheck employ.

Yeah?

So we're not lined-up head-up on the Offensive Tackles and Center? We're not 2-gapping up front on **** near every play?

Uh, No...VERY often we play a 3 technique, nose, stack end. That's not a traditional 3-4 brah

We play what the Niners and Seahawks play.

I must be missing that. Can you show me?

Majority of the time I see us head-up on the Tackles and Center, in a frog stance, 2-gapping.

When I watch the Niners I see them attacking up front.

 

[jerzeycane]

Chick is a SDE in a 4-3.

Pierre is a 4-3 DT.

Heurtelou is a 4-3 DT.

AQM, McCord and Thomas are all WDEs in a 4-3.

Figs is a SAM in a 4-3.

Grace is a WLB in a 4-3.

I'm seeing a whole lot of players that are gonna be playing out of position for us.

How could you say this if you don't know what positions they play in our own defense?

How could you say this if you don't know the functions of the positions in our defense?

Don't know how many times it needs to be said, but this isn't a straight up 3-4 like Bill Parcells or Belicheck employ.

Yeah?

So we're not lined-up head-up on the Offensive Tackles and Center? We're not 2-gapping up front on **** near every play?

Uh, No...VERY often we play a 3 technique, nose, stack end. That's not a traditional 3-4 brah

We play what the Niners and Seahawks play.

I must be missing that. Can you show me?

Majority of the time I see us head-up on the Tackles and Center, in a frog stance, 2-gapping.

When I watch the Niners I see them attacking up front.

Someone with stills should be able to. I don't have them, nor do I have the patience to search for them.

 

[Coach Macho]

How could you say this if you don't know what positions they play in our own defense?

How could you say this if you don't know the functions of the positions in our defense?

Don't know how many times it needs to be said, but this isn't a straight up 3-4 like Bill Parcells or Belicheck employ.

Yeah?

So we're not lined-up head-up on the Offensive Tackles and Center? We're not 2-gapping up front on **** near every play?

Uh, No...VERY often we play a 3 technique, nose, stack end. That's not a traditional 3-4 brah

We play what the Niners and Seahawks play.

I must be missing that. Can you show me?

Majority of the time I see us head-up on the Tackles and Center, in a frog stance, 2-gapping.

When I watch the Niners I see them attacking up front.

Someone with stills should be able to. I don't have them, nor do I have the patience to search for them.

So are we 2-gapping out of this? Or is this our 1-gap look?

 

[jerzeycane]

Yeah?

So we're not lined-up head-up on the Offensive Tackles and Center? We're not 2-gapping up front on **** near every play?

Uh, No...VERY often we play a 3 technique, nose, stack end. That's not a traditional 3-4 brah

We play what the Niners and Seahawks play.

I must be missing that. Can you show me?

Majority of the time I see us head-up on the Tackles and Center, in a frog stance, 2-gapping.

When I watch the Niners I see them attacking up front.

Someone with stills should be able to. I don't have them, nor do I have the patience to search for them.

So are we 2-gapping out of this? Or is this our 1-gap look?

Different players have different responsibilities in different calls. The nose and stack end are almost always playing a body first. The 3 technique is an attacking player in the defense however. This is the Justin Smith role on the defense. He's playing upfield most of the time and needs to be able to defeat a one on one block.

In our defense, Olsen Pierre/Robinson is usually playing the 3 technique and trying to defeat a one on one block. Porter/Renfrow play the 0/1 technique and Chick/Kamalu plays the stack end.

I should have prefaced this by saying that it's not necessarily true that we never play a straight 3-4 because they do that as well. This is truly a multiple defense.

 

[Sable]

Our defense is not always in a 3-4 scheme. Many times they will change to a 4-3 depending on down and distance. With better players we will be much better.

 

[DrCane]

300 pound DE's. Awesome. We've become Penn State.