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Stranglehold on the ACC Coastal

Zanecane

Zanecane

7th Floor Crew
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I know it's still early in the recruiting season but we are really starting to see the benefits of having continuity within our coaching staff and the administrations investment in our football program. Obviously these two things have led to success on the field and our coaches have been able to use that success to pull away from the rest of our division off of it.

Look at the difference between us and the rest of the coastal.. We have more 4 star recruits committed than the rest of the schools in our division COMBINED. If we take care of business again this season, with the mess VT/UNC will become if they both struggle. It's not unrealistic to expect ACC championship games as the floor for every season moving forward.

Oh and for those of you complaining about the amount of 3star recruits we have, we are currently only .28 points away from matching Clemsons average ranking.
 

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BeachCanes said:
Having the best recruiting class in the coastal should be a given. Our main competition is V tech and they don’t even go after elite guys. Should be the standard to dominate recruiting of the coastal.
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Agreed, but it hasn't been that way. We've had too many classes fall apart due to coaching changes, poor seasons and/or the NCAA.

With the bull**** behind us. We should finally pull away from the pack with another strong season.
 
zanecane said:
I know it's still early in the recruiting season but we are really starting to see the benefits of having continuity within our coaching staff and the administrations investment in our football program. Obviously these two things have led to success on the field and our coaches have been able to use that success to pull away from the rest of our division off of it.

Look at the difference between us and the rest of the coastal.. We have more 4 star recruits committed than the rest of the schools in our division COMBINED. If we take care of business again this season, with the mess VT/UNC will become if they both struggle. It's not unrealistic to expect ACC championship games as the floor for every season moving forward.

Oh and for those of you complaining about the amount of 3star recruits we have, we are currently only .28 points away from matching Clemsons average ranking.
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In all seriousness, you're spot on, Zane. We still have to prepare and play and Lane stadium is a rough environment with all of those engineers and hillbillies jingling their keys but they will jave 9 new starters on defense and don't they have a qb suspension issue with Jackson?

I was at the UNC game last season and thought we underperformed. Their running back, Brown I think, is the best guy ai saw on their team but he's just one small fast guy and that isn't enough. We made their QB look better than he was like we did with Benkirt from UVA. Hopefully with the talent infusion, we will play to our level and not the level of our opponents.

We need to kick F$U's a$$ at home just for recruiting and momentum even though not Coastal.

I'll humbly leave the x and o analysis to the real football minds on here but in my less than expert opinion, just watching the team last year, and learning from the Alpha coaches on here, a lot rides not only on the QB but on the O-Line. We are building depth there but there could be a big droppoff between the first and second lines. In the next year I expect to see these positions upgraded and playing like it.

We should be able to dominate the coastal for years to come. Make F$U little brother again and beat Clem$on and we are in it. The path is there. Let's rise!
 
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zanecane said:
Agreed, but it hasn't been that way. We've had too many classes fall apart due to coaching changes, poor seasons and/or the NCAA.

With the bull**** behind us. We should finally pull away from the pack with another strong season.
Click to expand...
And having lived in Richmond for 8 years and talking a lot of recruiting and play with a Vag Tech superfan I know, where VT killed us is in coaching quality. They took a bunch of 3 stars, year in and year out and coached them up like crazy, particularly on defense.

Last year Stroman was a former low 3 star (like an 82 on 247) who was 1st team all ACC I believe. If we had Bud Foster instead of Doritos, running his system and picking players that fit his scheme, with our access to talent, even under Alph, we would have been respectable and probably won our conference long ago.

Fuentes should be better than Beamer on the offensive side but Beamer got a lot out of what he had.

VT, of all the teams I have watched us face, knows how to identify underrated talent that fits what they do and get the most out of it.

We gonna choke these biotches out now though.
 
RVACane said:
In all seriousness, you're spot on, Zane. We still have to prepare and play and Lane stadium is a rough environment with all of those engineers and hillbillies jingling their keys but they will jave 9 new starters on defense and don't they have a qb suspension issue with Jackson?

I was at the UNC game last season and thought we underperformed. Their running back, Brown I think, is the best guy ai saw on their team but he's just one small fast guy and that isn't enough. We made their QB look better than he was like we did with Benkirt from UVA. Hopefully with the talent infusion, we will play to our level and not the level of our opponents.

We need to kick F$U's a$$ at home just for recruiting and momentum even though not Coastal.

I'll humbly leave the x and o analysis to the real football minds on here but in my less than expert opinion, just watching the team last year, and learning from the Alpha coaches on here, a lot rides not only on the QB but on the O-Line. We are building depth there but there could be a big droppoff between the first and second lines. In the next year I expect to see these positions upgraded and playing like it.

We should be able to dominate the coastal for years to come. Make F$U little brother again and beat Clem$on and we are in it. The path is there. Let's rise!
Click to expand...

Couldn't agree more. A few times last year we let teams hang around (UNC/Virginia etc). But we had the talent needed to win those games even without our best effort. With another top class now on campus the talent gap should only increase.

We aren't without our weaknesses, but we should be able to control our own fate all season. We'll be getting everyone's best shot, and the spot light is on us. But beat FSU and LSU and I think a top 5 recruiting class is attainable once again, while the rest of the coastal may not finish in the top 25.
 
We've finished with the best 247 class in the Coastal in 10 or the last 12 years (post-Coker era), and most of the time the gap was pretty sizable. The only years we didn't recruit the best in the division were the transition class between Shannon and Golden and Butch Davis' outlier top 10 class at UNC. That doesn't even take into consideration the "South Florida 3* = 4* Elsewhere" rule.

We've had a talent advantage over our opponents forever, we just haven't done anything else well. No talent development, poor scheme design, atrocious game day decision making, etc. That has all markedly changed in the Richt era. We're definitely ahead of the rest of the division competitively, with the chance to really pull away if we string together some double digit win seasons. Keep piling up classes in the Top 10 neighborhood and we'll be a freight train.
 
I'd say the biggest recruiting issue we've had during the lean years was proper evaluation. Coker started recruiting from lists/rankings, Shannon recruited one school, and Golden recruited fairly well but many of his evals were boom/bust (re: the massive attrition rate during his tenure.)

Without the advantage of a well-oiled bag game, Miami HAS to be very particular and correct regarding their evaluations. That means developing long-term relationships with players and their entire support system (family, coaches, academic advisers, handlers, etc.) and taking a serious look at risk/reward for each individual player. I *think* Richt can be very good, even elite at this - he's already putting the infrastructure in place with the youth camps and upgrades to facilities and support staff. At the end of the day, though, I think we're going to live and die not by how many stars Richt brings in, but WHICH stars he brings in.
 
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Umm.. 12/14 years We've had the #1 class in the coastal and just won the coastal for the first time. This isn't magic. We just have a competent enough HC. All of our previous head coaches were on training wheels.
 
TheChosenOne said:
Umm.. 12/14 years We've had the #1 class in the coastal and just won the coastal for the first time. This isn't magic. We just have a competent enough HC. All of our previous head coaches were on training wheels.
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We definitely had bad coaching. But we also had bad recruiting and development. Our teams always had talent. But we also played with only 70-75 guys, of which 20 were JAGs and at least 2-3 positions had no quality depth. You don't win tough games with Mike Williams at CB or Earl Moore at DT or Kirby Freeman at QB or Romeo Davis at LB. And because of our lack of depth, we invariably lost in the second half when our guys were gassed.
 
Despite the huge talent advantage we have, most of that is negated with poor QB play.

Teams like Syracuse (I know they aren’t coastal), UVA, UNC should not be able to hang around like they did last year.
 
While recruiting has certainly improved under the current staff, it wasn't necessarily horrible under the previous staffs. I'd say the bigger problem was actual coaching and getting the most out of the players they recruited. It just seemed like a majority of the guys they brought in never got better. Some guys even got worse as their college careers went on. Golden was notorious for signing guys who either got kicked off the team right away or never even made it into school. Miami has always recruited better than the rest of the Coastal. They just sucked at coaching that talent.
 
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We had cultural rot. We got guys like Duke, Perryman, etc, who were going to be Canes no matter what. That certainly helped our recruiting ranking. But we also had a lot of guys who put on the U helmet and thought that meant they had swag and they were the ****. Every season started with optimism, but when we got punched in the mouth, guys started to realize their coaches were dip****s and entitled players started to quit. Guys like Duke never quit, but when the rest of the team around them started giving up, what were they to do?

The rot extended from the administration, to the players, to the facilities, to the fanbase.

There is no overstating how bad of shape we were in, from a foundational standpoint, when Richt was hired. Dude has taken two years to chip out the rot and start replacing our foundations, brick by brick. People are right when they say we are still years away from being the program we should and need to be once again. Inertia is a powerful force to overcome.

That said, we've won national championships before when we didn't have our best team of the decade, and there's nothing saying this group can't catch lightning in a bottle and achieve big before the program as a whole reaches structural soundness and maturity. That's the fun and beauty of sports, we get to go play the games and watch the games and the outcome is determined on the field, and luck and hot streaks or chemistry, etc, can and do happen.

Looking into the future and observing these last couple recruiting classes, we are building more depth and more talent than we have in over 15 years. Given the holes we have to fill, and the little gaps and misses we still see in recruiting, we're still a couple classes from where we need to be. There is no doubt in my mind, however, that OP's basic premise that this is the year we can and should reach escape velocity from the rest of the Coastal is correct. I'd actually argue that happened last year, but with the game in Blacksburg this fall, it's right to say we need to wait and see. This is a very important season, no doubt.
 
DTP said:
While recruiting has certainly improved under the current staff, it wasn't necessarily horrible under the previous staffs. I'd say the bigger problem was actual coaching and getting the most out of the players they recruited. It just seemed like a majority of the guys they brought in never got better. Some guys even got worse as their college careers went on. Golden was notorious for signing guys who either got kicked off the team right away or never even made it into school. Miami has always recruited better than the rest of the Coastal. They just sucked at coaching that talent.
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And they took the wrong talent in a lot of cases. As others have said, it's not just about getting a bunch of highly rated players, it's about getting the right highly rated players.
 
RVACane said:
And having lived in Richmond for 8 years and talking a lot of recruiting and play with a Vag Tech superfan I know, where VT killed us is in coaching quality. They took a bunch of 3 stars, year in and year out and coached them up like crazy, particularly on defense.

Last year Stroman was a former low 3 star (like an 82 on 247) who was 1st team all ACC I believe. If we had Bud Foster instead of Doritos, running his system and picking players that fit his scheme, with our access to talent, even under Alph, we would have been respectable and probably won our conference long ago.

Fuentes should be better than Beamer on the offensive side but Beamer got a lot out of what he had.

VT, of all the teams I have watched us face, knows how to identify underrated talent that fits what they do and get the most out of it.

We gonna choke these biotches out now though.
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Couldn't agree more about Vag Tech. They've gotten more out of "less" for years - like you said, especially on defense. They recruit heavily in the Richmond/Tidewater area and staes in the mid-Atlantic and cherry pick a few from FL every year.
 
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RVACane said:
In all seriousness, you're spot on, Zane. We still have to prepare and play and Lane stadium is a rough environment with all of those engineers and hillbillies jingling their keys but they will jave 9 new starters on defense and don't they have a qb suspension issue with Jackson?

I was at the UNC game last season and thought we underperformed. Their running back, Brown I think, is the best guy ai saw on their team but he's just one small fast guy and that isn't enough. We made their QB look better than he was like we did with Benkirt from UVA. Hopefully with the talent infusion, we will play to our level and not the level of our opponents.

We need to kick F$U's a$$ at home just for recruiting and momentum even though not Coastal.

I'll humbly leave the x and o analysis to the real football minds on here but in my less than expert opinion, just watching the team last year, and learning from the Alpha coaches on here, a lot rides not only on the QB but on the O-Line. We are building depth there but there could be a big droppoff between the first and second lines. In the next year I expect to see these positions upgraded and playing like it.

We should be able to dominate the coastal for years to come. Make F$U little brother again and beat Clem$on and we are in it. The path is there. Let's rise!
Click to expand...
Saw a report today that said Jackson's academic issue was resolved and he's returned to the roster.
 
Miami's issue has never been recruiting against the Coastal. It's been coaching. Now that Richt is here I don't think Miami should lose a single Coastal game save for maybe one every 2-3 years. Winning the Coastal should literally be a given. It's arguably the worst P5 division in the country (I said arguably, maybe the Big 10 West or Pac-12 South could possibly be, but the fact that it's even a discussion proves my point).
 
OrangeBowlMagic said:
Miami's issue has never been recruiting against the Coastal. It's been coaching. Now that Richt is here I don't think Miami should lose a single Coastal game save for maybe one every 2-3 years. Winning the Coastal should literally be a given. It's arguably the worst P5 division in the country (I said arguably, maybe the Big 10 West or Pac-12 South could possibly be, but the fact that it's even a discussion proves my point).
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Or the SEC East.

OK, so now we've named an arguably terrible division in all 4 of the P5 conferences that have divisions. When you are talking about such a small data set, and such a subjective value, the fact that it is even a discussion most certainly does NOT prove your point. The fact of the matter is, the ACC and Miami by extension (or vice versa depending on your perspective) take a lot of unfair crap about the strength of the Coastal division. And no, our division is not a gauntlet of national powerhouses, I will certainly grant that, but it is also not the punching bag it's made out to be by Paul Finebaum.

Just look at the final records for the teams in the SEC East and the Coastal. Keeping in mind that UGA didn't actually play the best team in their conference in the SEC championship game, the records are essentially identical, granted Georgia was the better team at the end of last season, it is somewhat understandable given the depth that CMR bestowed them with and the lack thereof that we had by the end of the season. The results against (opponent in common) ND at least show that, when healthy and playing well, Miami and UGA were at minimum comparable.

(ACC teams records appear to be regular season only)
ACC Coastal: SEC East:
Miami (10-2) UGA (13-2)
Vag T (9-4) South Cac (9-4)
GT (5-6) KKKtucky (7-6)
Duke (7-6) Misery (7-6)
UVA (6-7) Felony (4-7)
Pitt (5-7) Vandy (5-7)
UNC (3-9) Tenn (4-8)

Pretty **** comparable, isn't it?

Be a realist if you want, but I'm sick and ****** tired of our own fans slurping up the bull**** that eSECpn and the rest of the media spews, without any critical thought or analysis, accepting it as true just because someone on TV or in print says it, and then regurgitating the same crap to impugn the very program that they purport to root for. Guess what guys, it's 2018, the media doesn't tell the truth anymore. They just sell stories and narratives. Truth is dead and there's no interest or profit in it. If you want to **** on the Canes, that's fine, but go get yourself a cot **** Semenholes or Gaytors hat and do it on your own time. Ain't nobody got time for that crap up in CIS.
 
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