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On the “win now” vs. “develop young players” debate

You could argue we've already had the 2nd best roster in the ACC for the past several years. The reason we need a talent advantage "by a large margin" is because we're not certain yet if Mario's recruiting/roster filling advantages can overcome his coaching deficiencies.

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Warning said:
If we don't win BIGLY this year I am going to spend 20 hours a day on here being snarky fighting a "culture war" in my mind about things people said would happen but didn't happen. Just so I make sure people know they were WRONG on a message board for the same 4 people to like my comments.
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Jack Nicholson Yes GIF
 
LuCane said:
Double digit wins. I’m sorry. That’s the bar. It’d be the bar for anyone else, so Mario shouldn’t get an accommodation.

He has Cam Ward. He’s had a lot of resources. He’s had some time.

It’s time.

And, I’m sitting over here deathly afraid of our Safety/Nickel situation. So, unless we find a corner who can help us play man coverage inside or a Safety who can do the same (because as far as I know Powell can’t be in two places at once and we have to pray for his health), Mario better be open to scoring a lot of points and pushing the pace.

Double digit wins. By any means necessary.
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You're deathly afraid of DB, I'm deathly afraid of DT. But I agree with the threshold. No reason we shouldn't win 10.

I just think Mario made it harder on himself allowing so many guys to transfer out. After Ward committed, we needed a WR, a RB, a NT and 2 DBs. Now we need a WR, 2 RBs, 2 DTs, a DE and 2 DBs, with less runway. Plus the "culture" pitch attenuates when local guys like Kelly or 6 year starters like JHH leave. ... Anyway, it's Year 3, no more excuses.
 
grover said:
You're deathly afraid of DB, I'm deathly afraid of DT. But I agree with the threshold. No reason we shouldn't win 10.

I just think Mario made it harder on himself allowing so many guys to transfer out. After Ward committed, we needed a WR, a RB, a NT and 2 DBs. Now we need a WR, 2 RBs, 2 DTs, a DE and 2 DBs, with less runway. Plus the "culture" pitch attenuates when local guys like Kelly or 6 year starters like JHH leave. ... Anyway, it's Year 3, no more excuses.
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Why do we need two rbs? We’ll have Martinez, CJ, Lofton, CWH, Allen, and Lyle. Also, I’m getting the sense that the staff seems to think that we’ll see Fletcher this season. Ward hinted at it in several interviews as well. It’s just the vibe I’m getting
 
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bshaw28 said:
1st - Recruit like **** to get the best Freshman & develop them.

2nd - Use the portal to upgrade & plug holes. How good your current players are dictates how heavily you need the portal.

3rd - Keep your current best players happy so they don't get poached.

Recruiting is now so much more involved/time consuming than it used to be. It's become a nightmare.

Having a coach that thrives in recruiting like Mario is a big advantage.
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Yep. In this wild era that revolves around recruiting, we have one of the best head coaches to handle it.

Just cross your fingers on Saturdays during the fall.
 
ST26 said:
Why do we need two rbs? We’ll have Martinez, CJ, Lofton, CWH, Allen, and Lyle. Also, I’m getting the sense that the staff seems to think that we’ll see Fletcher this season. Ward hinted at it in several interviews as well. It’s just the vibe I’m getting
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Because if Martinez (who we still need to sign!) goes down, our season is put at risk.

CJ doesn't have the balance, Allen is injured, CWH is too tiny to hold up under Mario ball at least in 2024. Lofton is not a RB. Lyle hasn't even made it to campus.
 
TriStarCane said:
This is too reductive. Evals / dev are my concern. Misevaluating high school prospects only to pass, miss, or settle for replacement or below level talent in the portal is going to put us perpetually behind. If we miss on our HS Top 75 DL eval, and then miss on the top 3 portal prospects, they can’t bring in a depth piece and tell us “we are killing it in the portal!” I don’t believe you. There are a lot of examples to provide. For every 1 Cam Ward we get 3 JAGs after blowing our HS evals. Then we bring in the JAGs and they take away from development opportunities for the younger guys. Then the young guys aren’t good enough so we replace them with more JAG transfers and high upside freshman that don’t pan out. And around we go…
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Nah this staff has been here long enough to recruit 2 full cycles out of high school. They've killed it in high school recruiting but right now all the Mario kids from his classes are still young. So we have two choices - play Manny's guys or portal. I choose portal.

The guys already on the roster were Manny guys, a lot of those were bad evals and no amount of development was going to make them better.

So we've had to rely on the portal to replace upperclassmen who were recruited by the last staff and who aren't good enough to play here. Simple as that. How many kids from the '23 or '24 classes have been pushed out? Not many. Most of the kids leaving were Manny kids or kids who came in during the transition.
 
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ST26 said:
Why do we need two rbs? We’ll have Martinez, CJ, Lofton, CWH, Allen, and Lyle. Also, I’m getting the sense that the staff seems to think that we’ll see Fletcher this season. Ward hinted at it in several interviews as well. It’s just the vibe I’m getting
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If Allen and Fletcher are hurt you really want to rely on freshmen and Martinez? You are one Martinez injury away from being in trouble. Remember last year Allen, Chaney, Parrish, and Fletcher all missed time.
 
Da Jumbo Mutombo said:
Just meant from a definition standpoint. Blue chip is a 4 star or above.

Most of these kids were high 4 stars too.

I'm not injecting any opinion by stating what they were ranked coming out of HS.
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facts ... being a blue chip gets in you in the door ...
 
grover said:
Because if Martinez (who we still need to sign!) goes down, our season is put at risk.

CJ doesn't have the balance, Allen is injured, CWH is too tiny to hold up under Mario ball at least in 2024. Lofton is not a RB. Lyle hasn't even made it to campus.
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Allen will be fully healthy once camp starts. Lofton is 100% getting snaps at RB, even with Martinez coming. Dude is legit. CWH is 6’0” and will definitely add weight. Him and CJ both showed upside in all the spring practices as well as the spring game. And if you don’t think Lyle will get carries this season, then you’re crazy. Seems like a lot of people on here hasn’t seen his senior tape. He’s a STUD. Plus I still think we’ll see Fletcher this season
 
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Yoyo82 said:
You could argue we've already had the 2nd best roster in the ACC for the past several years. The reason we need a talent advantage "by a large margin" is because we're not certain yet if Mario's recruiting/roster filling advantages can overcome his coaching deficiencies.

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Mario has done a great job recruiting out of high school but you can't expect to field a team of freshmans and win many games. I don't care how many stars you have a team of 18 year old kids is losing to a team of 21 year old men 9 times out of 10.

It takes 3 years for the kids you recruit out of high school to mature and develop to where that's your team. In '22 and '23 the players getting snaps were mostly Manny guys.
 
Yoyo82 said:
You could argue we've already had the 2nd best roster in the ACC for the past several years. The reason we need a talent advantage "by a large margin" is because we're not certain yet if Mario's recruiting/roster filling advantages can overcome his coaching deficiencies.

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What in the Matt Shodell. We got somebody telling the truth. Mario aside for second Miami has never really had a big talent problem it's the AD and President... Besides Butch and Mark Ritch( got sick) for 20 yrs we been picking bad coaches and blaming the kids. Then we hire a OL coach that was never a OC or DC how many successful coaches you know that were never coordinators but we stuck for now. I hope next coach is a SEC guy or at least somebody that is a coach not just a recruiter only. But go Mario for now.
 
Geddy Lee said:
If Allen and Fletcher are hurt you really want to rely on freshmen and Martinez? You are one Martinez injury away from being in trouble. Remember last year Allen, Chaney, Parrish, and Fletcher all missed time.
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I hate to break it to you, but the odds we carry 7 scholarship rbs is low
 
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ST26 said:
Allen will be fully healthy once camp starts. Lofton is 100% getting snaps at RB, even with Martinez coming. Dude is legit. CWH is 6’0” and will definitely add weight. Him and CJ both showed upside in all the spring practices as well as the spring game. And if you don’t think Lyle will get carries this season, then you’re crazy. Seems like a lot of people on here hasn’t seen his senior tape. He’s a STUD. Plus I still think we’ll see Fletcher this season
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Allen idk but he scored a lot last yr. Lyle #1 2024 RB idk why ppl acting like Frsh RB don't play everywhere even the NFL play rookie RBs. Now CHW I hope I'm wrong but he look better then CJ. They just got to stop running slow guys up the middle give them tosses, screens, outside zones. Martinez Lyle and Fletcher should be used differently then CHW CJ.
 
DMoney said:
You can do both. Mario is hitting the Portal like a maniac. He recruits high school like a maniac. We want the best roster in the ACC, and we want a wide margin. That’s a good thing.

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Correct, however, it appears to bring in more portal upgrades, more current players have to be shown the door or at least taken off scholarship and NIL opportunities.

I would think this gets harder as portal window drags on because there isn't yet an established roster cut day like the NFL.

Tough needle to thread right?
 
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