O Line

[Westorangecane]

Most effective combination was used early in the game Wheeler at center, Linder at guard and Henderson at tackle. That combination was obviously the most successful, why was this combination not used again?

 

[TexasCane90]

This group and the corners have no business having threads started as they were the least of our concerns

 

[nystateofmind]

 

[JimmyJohnsonsHair]

They are bad against any team with a pulse.

 

[CANE4LIFE]

This group and the corners have no business having threads started as they were the least of our concerns

WRONG.

This group should be the STRENGTH of the team and should be DOMINATING. This was probably our most experienced, BIGGEST and talented OL in YEARS. These guys should be running people OVER. Game after game they have underachieved. At BEST our OL is average to slightly above average. TIME and TIME again they have FAILED to get the push needed to get close 3rd downs, they allow WAY too much penetration, and while they pass pro was actually decent last night, they have allowed WAY too much pressure by the front 4 of many teams this season. We should have have one of the TOP OLs in the nation, and Im not sure they are even playing like a top 25 OL. McDermott is simply NOT cutting it and hasnt all year. He's been getting beat constantly. Flowers is having a pretty disappointing year, as has Seantrel. Linder is also very inconsistent.

There is NO excuse with the size, talent, and EXPERIENCE this OL has we shouldnt be MAULING people out there. IMO we've seen this story before, and the one key ingredient from those eras has the initials AK.

 

[Mrbliss345]

Turnstiles versus legitimate D

 

[LuCane]

This group and the corners have no business having threads started as they were the least of our concerns

WRONG.

This group should be the STRENGTH of the team and should be DOMINATING. This was probably our most experienced, BIGGEST and talented OL in YEARS. These guys should be running people OVER. Game after game they have underachieved. At BEST our OL is average to slightly above average. TIME and TIME again they have FAILED to get the push needed to get close 3rd downs, they allow WAY too much penetration, and while they pass pro was actually decent last night, they have allowed WAY too much pressure by the front 4 of many teams this season. We should have have one of the TOP OLs in the nation, and Im not sure they are even playing like a top 25 OL. McDermott is simply NOT cutting it and hasnt all year. He's been getting beat constantly. Flowers is having a pretty disappointing year, as has Seantrel. Linder is also very inconsistent.

There is NO excuse with the size, talent, and EXPERIENCE this OL has we shouldnt be MAULING people out there. IMO we've seen this story before, and the one key ingredient from those eras has the initials AK.

This group was not even close to the reason we couldn't sustain last night. Re-watch the game. They gave plenty of opportunities in the run game and the pass game. I have no idea how you measure success or failure for an OL, but I'm interested to hear you explain how they underachieved last night. They're handicapped by a rookie playcaller and QB who, at this point, I think everyone can agree does not make quick decisions. For you to say Flowers is having a disappointing year and Linder is very inconsistent shows me that you're just writing and capitalizing words out of the clear blue. Mcderm struggles at times and did so last night. We all know that. Please provide evidence of others.

 

[CINCYCANESFAN]

lu is right

 

[porterhouse77]

When there are 8-9 guys in the box it can be a little harder to run the ball. I thought the line played well. We didn't have the balanced attack to keep them honest.

 

[Mico Jones]

This group and the corners have no business having threads started as they were the least of our concerns

WRONG.

This group should be the STRENGTH of the team and should be DOMINATING. This was probably our most experienced, BIGGEST and talented OL in YEARS. These guys should be running people OVER. Game after game they have underachieved. At BEST our OL is average to slightly above average. TIME and TIME again they have FAILED to get the push needed to get close 3rd downs, they allow WAY too much penetration, and while they pass pro was actually decent last night, they have allowed WAY too much pressure by the front 4 of many teams this season. We should have have one of the TOP OLs in the nation, and Im not sure they are even playing like a top 25 OL. McDermott is simply NOT cutting it and hasnt all year. He's been getting beat constantly. Flowers is having a pretty disappointing year, as has Seantrel. Linder is also very inconsistent.

There is NO excuse with the size, talent, and EXPERIENCE this OL has we shouldnt be MAULING people out there. IMO we've seen this story before, and the one key ingredient from those eras has the initials AK.

This group was not even close to the reason we couldn't sustain last night. Re-watch the game. They gave plenty of opportunities in the run game and the pass game. I have no idea how you measure success or failure for an OL, but I'm interested to hear you explain how they underachieved last night. They're handicapped by a rookie playcaller and QB who, at this point, I think everyone can agree does not make quick decisions. For you to say Flowers is having a disappointing year and Linder is very inconsistent shows me that you're just writing and capitalizing words out of the clear blue. Mcderm struggles at times and did so last night. We all know that. Please provide evidence of others.

Disagree entirely. Of course they aren't the prime reason and of course Morris and Coley don't help. But they continue to not get push on expected short yardage situations. We were gashing their 3-3-5 front but as soon as they adjusted out of that that we didn't run the ball well.

The O-line had more trouble than their talent and experience dictates in picking up blitzes. There is no good reason for Henderson to not be on the field.

You forget that these are talented guys. Henderson, Linder, Flowers, Feliciano will all play in the NFL. Yet they don't dominate the way that they should as a unit.

The reason is simple. Art Kehoe.

The other teams line has looked far more vicious this year and guys like Cameron Irving, Hart & Stork were far less hyped as recruits. They will be NFLers because of Rick Trickett and how he developes linemen.

They execute consistently. They always get push and protect in unison. They manage blitzes well. The execute screen plays. They are a far better line that ours yet we have far better talent.

 

[Coach Macho]

Pretty sure the unit that was mauling FSU in the beginning of the game was Flowers, Feliciano, McDermott, Wheeler, Linder.

 

[Coach Macho]

Not even sure why anybody has a problem with the OL after last night. They ran the ball well for the most part and they didn't allow anybody near Morris.

I've said this before and I'll say it again...

A failed running play doesn't always mean the OL got beat. Look at the TE's. On that failed 4th down run play by Duke our TE got his **** pushed in.

 

[LuCane]

This group and the corners have no business having threads started as they were the least of our concerns

WRONG.

This group should be the STRENGTH of the team and should be DOMINATING. This was probably our most experienced, BIGGEST and talented OL in YEARS. These guys should be running people OVER. Game after game they have underachieved. At BEST our OL is average to slightly above average. TIME and TIME again they have FAILED to get the push needed to get close 3rd downs, they allow WAY too much penetration, and while they pass pro was actually decent last night, they have allowed WAY too much pressure by the front 4 of many teams this season. We should have have one of the TOP OLs in the nation, and Im not sure they are even playing like a top 25 OL. McDermott is simply NOT cutting it and hasnt all year. He's been getting beat constantly. Flowers is having a pretty disappointing year, as has Seantrel. Linder is also very inconsistent.

There is NO excuse with the size, talent, and EXPERIENCE this OL has we shouldnt be MAULING people out there. IMO we've seen this story before, and the one key ingredient from those eras has the initials AK.

This group was not even close to the reason we couldn't sustain last night. Re-watch the game. They gave plenty of opportunities in the run game and the pass game. I have no idea how you measure success or failure for an OL, but I'm interested to hear you explain how they underachieved last night. They're handicapped by a rookie playcaller and QB who, at this point, I think everyone can agree does not make quick decisions. For you to say Flowers is having a disappointing year and Linder is very inconsistent shows me that you're just writing and capitalizing words out of the clear blue. Mcderm struggles at times and did so last night. We all know that. Please provide evidence of others.

Disagree entirely. Of course they aren't the prime reason and of course Morris and Coley don't help. But they continue to not get push on expected short yardage situations. We were gashing their 3-3-5 front but as soon as they adjusted out of that that we didn't run the ball well.

The O-line had more trouble than their talent and experience dictates in picking up blitzes. There is no good reason for Henderson to not be on the field.

You forget that these are talented guys. Henderson, Linder, Flowers, Feliciano will all play in the NFL. Yet they don't dominate the way that they should as a unit.

The reason is simple. Art Kehoe.

The other teams line has looked far more vicious this year and guys like Cameron Irving, Hart & Stork were far less hyped as recruits. They will be NFLers because of Rick Trickett and how he developes linemen.

They execute consistently. They always get push and protect in unison. They manage blitzes well. The execute screen plays. They are a far better line that ours yet we have far better talent.

Execution of any play (but especially a running play) often has to do with down, distance and situation. Feel free to look at this post where I showed that we sure do run the ball well when we're placed in the right situations, but fail miserably otherwise: http://www.canesinsight.com/threads/58402-Chances-and-conversions-33-vs-73

We had over 4 yards a carry from our RBs yesterday against a talented defense that knew we were going to run the ball. No one was near Morris for the majority of the game and some of the sacks are on Morris OR Coach Coley for either not making a quick enough decision or not being optimally prepared with audibles/checks/fake audibles.

We'll agree to disagree here.

 

[Mico Jones]

Pretty sure the unit that was mauling FSU in the beginning of the game was Flowers, Feliciano, McDermott, Wheeler, Linder.

That had more to do with the 3-3-5 front. It was Wheeler at guard that gave up the first sack on a zone blitz. The blitzing backer came through clean from 5 yards off the ball. Couldn't move his feet fast enough to get to him.

Linder stops that cold.

 

[TexasCane90]

This group and the corners have no business having threads started as they were the least of our concerns

WRONG.

This group should be the STRENGTH of the team and should be DOMINATING. This was probably our most experienced, BIGGEST and talented OL in YEARS. These guys should be running people OVER. Game after game they have underachieved. At BEST our OL is average to slightly above average. TIME and TIME again they have FAILED to get the push needed to get close 3rd downs, they allow WAY too much penetration, and while they pass pro was actually decent last night, they have allowed WAY too much pressure by the front 4 of many teams this season. We should have have one of the TOP OLs in the nation, and Im not sure they are even playing like a top 25 OL. McDermott is simply NOT cutting it and hasnt all year. He's been getting beat constantly. Flowers is having a pretty disappointing year, as has Seantrel. Linder is also very inconsistent.

There is NO excuse with the size, talent, and EXPERIENCE this OL has we shouldnt be MAULING people out there. IMO we've seen this story before, and the one key ingredient from those eras has the initials AK.

Come on hoss back up your statements or get negged for talking out of your ***.

Morris held on to the ball to long at times. And we had running lanes as evidence by duke having 50 or so yards in the first and duke was on his was to having a great night on the ground

 

[Coach Macho]

Pretty sure the unit that was mauling FSU in the beginning of the game was Flowers, Feliciano, McDermott, Wheeler, Linder.

That had more to do with the 3-3-5 front. It was Wheeler at guard that gave up the first sack on a zone blitz. The blitzing backer came through clean from 5 yards off the ball. Couldn't move his feet fast enough to get to him.

Linder stops that cold.

So you're saying we were mauling them in the beginning cause they were running a 3-3-5?

Why would any DC run a 3-3-5 on running downs?

 

[nycane]

u have a qb who cant make a throw, can make a quick decision, and is just a disaster. the oline isnt really the problem.

 

[Mico Jones]

Pretty sure the unit that was mauling FSU in the beginning of the game was Flowers, Feliciano, McDermott, Wheeler, Linder.

That had more to do with the 3-3-5 front. It was Wheeler at guard that gave up the first sack on a zone blitz. The blitzing backer came through clean from 5 yards off the ball. Couldn't move his feet fast enough to get to him.

Linder stops that cold.

So you're saying we were mauling them in the beginning cause they were running a 3-3-5?

Why would any DC run a 3-3-5 on running downs?

Its Pruitts favorite lineup. They may have felt they could slow our run enough with it. There are squads that run 3-3-5 on every down.

 

[cane33]

4th and 1 to keep the drive alive and stay in the game to prevent a blowout. Maybe the biggest play in the game. Absolutely must convert. What happens? OL gets destroyed, loss of yards, and our best player gets piled on by 5 Noles breaking his ankle and ruling him out for the rest of the season.


Yeah....how dare anybody criticize our OL right?

If your OL can't be counted on in short yardage situations you do not have a good OL. Period.

 

[PSU Cane]

The revolving door OLine continues to hurt the consistency of the OLine. I'm all for getting guys snaps, getting them experience and keeping them happy.....but when you rotate that many guys that often THROUGHOUT the entire game, you lose consistency, especially in a zone scheme. You have to know how the guy next to you is going to react to something. If ones series that guy is Linder and the next it's Wheeler, i'm sure they will react differently. I think that is why at times we have breakdowns.

To me, the best lineup we have is Flowers-Feliciano-Wheeler-Linder-Henderson. I like Bunche as the swing man if a guy gets nicked or needs a rest. But there's no reason to not stick with those 5 guys in big games like FSU, VT, etc.